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what do you think of reproduction bodies?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by LWT, May 7, 2012.

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  1. More 32 then Henry built.
    Nothing wrong with that.
    Now we have Mustangs and Camaros.
    Plus 1948 to 1954 Chevy pickups.
    If you have the $'s go for it.
    I lucked out on my 50 Chevy.
    The bed sides are re-poped.
     
  2. countrysquire
    Joined: Oct 9, 2007
    Posts: 163

    countrysquire
    Member

    I would love to have to make the decision between a Brookville '32 roadster body and an original that is reasonably solid and straight. Where do I go to find this nice original roadster body for 12 grand? I sure as hell ain't seen any for sell lately.
     
  3. hotrodhoodlum
    Joined: Oct 25, 2009
    Posts: 5,109

    hotrodhoodlum
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    if the guy or gal who builds it or buys it is happy
    that is all that matters whether it is origional / steel / or fiberglass
     
  4. mramc1
    Joined: May 26, 2006
    Posts: 418

    mramc1
    Member

    I built my '29 A truck cab mostly by hand with a factory gas tank and door posts so I guess it's a reproduction body. Even though it looks cool and people all think it's really old I know that it's 90% 2006 steel. The truck means alot to me as I built the entire thing with hand tools for less than a good body would cost, but truly it will never be an original that's made it 80 plus years to be here today.

    The '31 Sport Coupe I'm building is a different animal because it will be about 85-90% pre-'48 parts. It'll mostly be the "real deal."

    Personally I'd never own a glass car with an aftermarket chassis. Although that's not a "kit car" in the most simplistic terms it's getting pretty close. I consider "kits" to be like the '34 Street Beast jobs and cars like the fake Rolls and all the others that use VW pans. Those are true kit cars, but a glass '32 on an aftermarket frame with brand new axles, motor, tranny, etc is getting dangerously close to that line, IMO.

    Now watch me talk out of the other side of my mouth. Don't think I haven't entertained the idea of buying a '31 Brookville roadster body to do to as a change-up for my Sport Coupe. I get tired of the coupe body, I unplug the electricals and mechanicals and swap bodies for the summer. Nice and easy drop top cruising.
     
  5. outlaw256
    Joined: Jun 26, 2008
    Posts: 2,023

    outlaw256
    Member

    i beg to differ with you , i have a 41 willys glass car and there is nothing KIT about it. it is a body and body only. with a kit you get shit and i didnt get shit. i have to find or make anything and everything.just like building all my steel factory bodied cars.
     
  6. theHIGHLANDER
    Joined: Jun 3, 2005
    Posts: 8,049

    theHIGHLANDER
    Member

    Ok, see if this makes your 'roids swell up. I'm working on a 34 Packard LeBaron Speedster. Yeah, the ones that bring like 3-4 million dollars. There's only 4 known. This one could get close to #5. It's going on a gennie 1106 chassis (proper and unique). The body was built from a Packard print. The other ones with new coachwork (there's maybe 6 of them) are on modded 1103 chassis. What is it? A fake, or a save due to the frame being correct? Something to chew on, and right in line with this topic. Just think about it...
     
  7. Highlander I am probably wrong here but weren't they coach built originally? I know that a lot of those high end cars were coach built.

    This may be a little off base for this thread but just to throw sand in the cogs I think it is worthy of mention. One of the fellas here on the HAMB has a '58 Corvette. It is not an original body, it is a glass race body, the chasm between an original Corvette glass body and a race body is really wide. This one does look the same as an original so the plugs must have been pulled from an original body.

    Where does this lie in the repro body argument? the original was glass so is the repop. The original weighed a ton the repop is light as a feather. Given my options I would much rather have the latter.

    So what is are everyone's thoughts on that option?


     
    Last edited: May 9, 2012
  8. aerocolor
    Joined: Oct 7, 2009
    Posts: 1,162

    aerocolor
    Member
    from dayton

    I have been experiencing this very dilemma for the past couple of years. I wanted a 32-34 coupe. Preferably a 3 window. Here is how I solved the issue of glass vs steel.

    After sitting down and doing my homework I knew i couldn`t handle having a big number in a `glass car as all my vehicles are investments to tap into when I retire and they just weren`t holding any value. Strike one.

    My second choice was a repop steel body but after adding up the cost to buy the necessary parts to build it was still cost prohibitive and no title to boot. Strike two.

    The next option was to find a project or original at a cost that still left room for making it the car I wanted. Project cars when found were too high or gone before I could jump. I was able to locate a `32 5W original priced up past my comfort level but I negotiated a fair price and purchased the car planning on hotrodding it as additional funds were available. Just wasn`t happy with the room of a five window so I sold it and started the search for my prized 3W. Almost strike three and out.

    After pretty much giving up a call came from a buddy that knew of a highboy style `32 3W that "might" be for sale. After three days of back and forth a deal was struck and I have the car of my dreams . Not exactly but close enough to eventually make it into mine. My requirements was a steel body and no chop. I have the rest of my life to change it.

    I know it`s a long drawn out process and everyone has a price and style they can live with. If you`re happy with a reproduction in glass or steel, great but once the deed is done you have to live with your decision. As for the cost of a `32, most of us have multiple cars with a lot of money in the sum total. Just tailor your collection/projects to include your dream car. I`ll gladly give up two Model A`s for a steel `32.

    A vintage car dealer/collector recently told me that young guys buy glass cars but old guys buy original steel because they know better.
    He has nine `32 Fords in his garage. Not one is glass.
     
  9. SquireDon
    Joined: Aug 8, 2010
    Posts: 600

    SquireDon
    Member
    from Oregon

    Sounds like an awesome project. Packards are a beautiful car. However, the Packard Community will never give it the respect it deserves. Because most of them are pretty uptight when it comes to originality. I belonged to a Packard Club once, and didn't renew my dues because they really turned their nose up at Packards that weren't restored to the concours level.
     
  10. langy
    Joined: Apr 27, 2006
    Posts: 5,735

    langy
    Member Emeritus



    I would just call it a very cool car, make no difference to me.
     
  11. DrJ
    Joined: Mar 3, 2001
    Posts: 9,422

    DrJ
    Member

    "Anal-Retentive Restorers"; a lot of the "traditional hotrod" crowd have become just like them.
    The only difference between someone who turns their nose up at a Ford or Packard that doesn't have all factory nuts and bolts in the undercarriage and the traditional hotrod crowd is the traditional hot rod crowd also turns their nose up at any speed equipment part made after a certain year and even then it has to have been a "right part" in their narrow minded estimation.

    A friend describes them as "Pickle People" You can tell by the way they walk...It's as if they have a tight hold on the pickle up their ass and they like it.

    You can thumb through the old early '50's little pages and other hotrod enthusiast magazines and damn near every one has an article on how to fix, replace, or modify some part of your MODIFIED CAR using that new wonder material, fiberglass.
    It's part of the tradition from back when hotrodding meant to be the vanguard of change, and NOT do things the same as they were done before, to NOT be traditional!
    The only hotrod thing that was traditional was to try to go faster than you did the week before!
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2012
  12. ^ ^ ^ Amen to that! ^ ^ ^
     
  13. theHIGHLANDER
    Joined: Jun 3, 2005
    Posts: 8,049

    theHIGHLANDER
    Member

    Squire, you needed to find a better chapter.

    The Packard community is most likely the least of this guy's priorities. Of the 4 known gennies, I don't think any of them are available. Beaner's right, they were originally coachbuilt cars by custom order. Will it ever be the real deal? No, but it will most certainly be respected based on how faithful to the original it comes out. Even the few other "new" ones are commanding serious dough, most likely due the the time and cost of creating it. Add to that, how often will you see someone going out for a spin in a $4,000,000 car? Not very...

    So some will ask, WTF does it have to do with the topic? It's simple. You want it so you build it. Can't drop $25K for a Brookville? Can't drop $18-20K for a rusty gennie? Since we're talking strictly the coachwork, what's the difference? It's not like you'd pull up to the show or cruise night and claim it's genuine 32 fiberglass. It was mentioned earlier about custom frames and such. Right on. A traditionally built Brookville roadster on a TCI or Lobecks frame, even has a flatty and steelies, and is done to the highest possible standards in authenticity and finish. I'd like to see the mopes who'd turn their noses up at it. We know those types. Best to escort them off to their clapped out 4dr 66 Rambler as they have nothing to share and not a spec of appreciation or respect for what it took to create it. And if that isn't the core of the point, just consider this 2min of your life you'll probably never get back.
     
  14. jfg455
    Joined: Apr 22, 2011
    Posts: 171

    jfg455
    Member
    from NH

    pretty soon it will be like saying "I will only drive an original Cobra". Those who have them will be worth a ton of dough and the rest of us will be happy with our reproductions. If you really want to anger some people then tell the their Bob Drake 40 ford or Brookville 32 is technically a 'kit car'. I am not in a position nor if I was would I drive an original anything. I would be to worried about my investment. So I drive stuff that is non-numbers matching, maybe a little road worn, but is fun and gets driven. I say build what you like with what you can afford. Just my $.02
     
  15. Weasel
    Joined: Dec 30, 2007
    Posts: 6,707

    Weasel
    Member

    If it is not steel it is NOT a Willys period. It may be a more or less faithful replica of a Willys but it is NOT a Willys. Willys were made by Willys Overland in Toledo, OH and various plants and overseas licensesees on original Willys Overland chassis and partial body stampings such as H.C.L Sieberg in the Netherlands Willys Crossley (note 2 S in Crossley) in the U.K., Holden's Body Builders in Australia and later Willys do Brasil. Even if it were built on an original or modified original chassis it would still be a recreation. If it has an aftermarket body and chassis then it is a replica of a Willys. That having been said I am sure it provides you with plenty of fun and enjoyment - but a Willys it is not.
     
  16. Doc,
    I think that the majority of the flathead crowd doesn't have a clue what it means to go fast this week than they did last week. There are some that are out there wringing them out but mosy of what we see are putt putt cars.

    Rodding has always been about being cutting edge, I think that some of us would like to regain what cutting edge was back when it wasn't yet "traditional".

    I don't think that the proper nuts and bolts or the proper inspectors mark are very important parts of what we are doing. That said I have given some serious thought to putting a bogus inspectors mark on the hacked firewall of my Commander. But that is just to screw with the restorer crowd.

    my problem with some of the things that we do in the name of being traditional is that I drive my stuff like I stole it. Sometimes that involves some concessions.


    Actually even a lot of the steel willys that get built get a chassis and suspension change as well as the entire drivetrain. There just isn't much left that is willys on majority of them that get built. I think that sometimes when we get all wrapped up in what is real and what is not we choke on water but swallow a water melon.

    I would actually like to build a 33 Willys myself. I am not sure that I could live with the wiggly original chassis under it, like I mentioned earlier I drive my stuff too hard and too often. Maybe I would box the original chassis and use it but I am thinking that it would take a lot of beefing to survive the rigors of daily driven car with too much torque would have to endure.

    So here is the rub, how much can you modify an original car and have it still be that car? if I change the floor board is it still original or if I change the firewall and the floor, what about if I add a patch panel or two?

    This is just food for thought.
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2012
  17. If I'm at a car show and the owner of the car call his car a 32 Ford and there isn't a 32 Ford part on the car I have a problem with that. It's a clone, a reproduction, a replica and not a 32 Ford.
     
  18. langy
    Joined: Apr 27, 2006
    Posts: 5,735

    langy
    Member Emeritus


    Well said !!!
     
  19. Cerberus
    Joined: May 24, 2010
    Posts: 1,381

    Cerberus
    Member

    If the owner calls it a '32 Ford Replica, do you have a problem with that?
     
  20. Weasel
    Joined: Dec 30, 2007
    Posts: 6,707

    Weasel
    Member

    You should see the chassis under Ohio George's '33 Willys - X member cut out and no lateral bracing apart from a swiss cheese drilled straight across plate where the center of the X member used to be, all suspension components chromed and doubtless not embrittlement relieved so subject to outgassing and stress cracks - all that with 1200 hp on tap. One of the scariest builds I have seen....:eek:
     
  21. flatoutflyin
    Joined: Jun 16, 2010
    Posts: 385

    flatoutflyin
    Member

    As I've said before, life is a series of compromises. I too would prefer a gennie steel body, hands down, and I don't envy those guys who have made the sacrifice to own them, I admire them. As a 65 year old retired bodyman, I need to be careful now in this world of a volatile stock market, zero return fixed investments, and a shrinking dollar with inflation imminent (I may have just made the case for a real Henry '32). My time horizon doesn't extend endlessly any longer and I have three friends with cancer and one with congestive heart failure. In the past I'd always owned survivor type cars - virgin originals - as I've always admired untouched, unrepaired, straight original bodies. When I crave that old car smell, I take my affordable, unrestored, never rusted, never hacked upon '36 Plymouth coupé (thanks cuznbrucie for the correct pronunciation) out and inhale deeply. It's like a trip into the past. When I'm out in the glass roadster, I immediately feel like that kid who could have cared less what my car body was made of. I'm always looking for that real car, but in the meantime, let's roll.
     

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  22. aerocolor
    Joined: Oct 7, 2009
    Posts: 1,162

    aerocolor
    Member
    from dayton

    Good points and very nice pair of cars. Compromise is the name of the game. If you are happy then all is well.

    While the cost of purchasing a real `32 Ford is considerable I felt the money spent was less than the present market value and my investment was safe therefore I get to drive and enjoy my retirement fund while I`m still able.

    Money in the bank is not what it used to be.
     
  23. Harms Way
    Joined: Nov 27, 2005
    Posts: 6,869

    Harms Way
    Member

    I have the answer !!!!!

    If you have a original steel body on a repo frame its,.................................1/4 real

    If it has a original frame and a repo body it's,...........................................1/4 real

    If it has a a original body & Frame, and anything other than 100% original from the factory parts unmodified,.... It's,............................................................1/2 Real

    If it's a 100% concourse AACA preservation National champion, and if it has anything on it, not made for the car back in the year of manufacture, or body work, patch panels, body filler, original paint, remanufactured parts of any kind, upholstery, glass (window glass,.. not fiberglass,.. Don't want to get the "soul" guys all wound up) gaskets, bearings, light bulbs,.... man the list is endless,......

    They should break the car down to every part on it and figure what the percentage of real car is left,..... To be totally fair.

    Like I said in other threads,.. the essence of hot rodding was to "MODIFY" a car for more speed, power, style etc...... The moment you began to remove fenders, chop tops, replace mechanical brakes for hydraulic brakes, different drivetrains ,..... ANY modification from when it first left the Assembly Line,.... It has in fact ceased to be a true 1932 Ford , 1934 Ford, 1933 or 1941 Willis. If you doubt this,... ask a restorer !,.. Which is exactly what some of you guys sound like.

    Unless your bolting your car together with the same tools, wrenches and bolts used on it when it rolled down the line,.... you have a "Kit Car"
     
  24. gasolinescream
    Joined: Sep 7, 2010
    Posts: 614

    gasolinescream
    Member

    If i want a particular thing i don't go out and buy a copy of it. I save my money and have the real deal. If i can't save for it in reasonable time, it's too expensive and i shouldn't be thinking about it. Don't do loans or credit. That applies to cars aswell as anything else.

    Good job Kustoms are more my thing:D
     
  25. aerocolor
    Joined: Oct 7, 2009
    Posts: 1,162

    aerocolor
    Member
    from dayton

    Here is 100%- Ran & drove like an old Ford too...
     

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  26. countrysquire
    Joined: Oct 9, 2007
    Posts: 163

    countrysquire
    Member

    Maybe owning a car with a replica body is kinda like screwing a woman that ain't real pretty. Sure, you'd be more proud of it if she looked like Christina Hendricks, but you enjoy it just as much anyway.
     
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  27. 45_70Sharps
    Joined: May 19, 2010
    Posts: 331

    45_70Sharps
    Member

    I just don't get the part where people are worried about what someone else thinks of their car??

    Kind of doing all this for the wrong reason if you are more worried about what someone else thinks than what you think.
     
  28. aerocolor
    Joined: Oct 7, 2009
    Posts: 1,162

    aerocolor
    Member
    from dayton

    I understand perfectly. We build cars for at least two reasons. The joy of accomplishing a goal that only a few (relatively speaking) are capable of and the praise we receive from our peers who understand. Car clubs, cruise-ins, car shows and forums such as this prove my point. I rarely go drive my car just to drive without going to see my buddies or some other event.
    We all look for approval for our efforts and few build cars without imput from others. Case in point. Who hasn`t looked at another car and discovered a better way or better looking approach to some situation on their present project?
     
  29. theHIGHLANDER
    Joined: Jun 3, 2005
    Posts: 8,049

    theHIGHLANDER
    Member

    This is like the story from Redd Foxx. Picked up this pretty girl, got her back to his place. She takes off the wig, the padded bra, the eyelashes, heels and tossed it all onto the sofa. As he's headed for the sofa she says, "Where you goin?" He says "I'ma go make love to the sofa!":cool:
     
  30. tfeverfred
    Joined: Nov 11, 2006
    Posts: 15,795

    tfeverfred
    Member

    Man, I wish all that would fit as my signature line. A bunch of hoopla over nothing. There was a time when a Fiberglass V/S Steel thread would have gotten closed in the first page.
     
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