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Water based paint

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by scharleyride, Sep 20, 2012.

  1. southern thunder
    Joined: Mar 14, 2012
    Posts: 226

    southern thunder
    Member

    is water borne/based paint shot at a different air pressure at the gun as apposed to the older paints ?
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2012
  2. usually at a higher PSI for better atomization. i think AAC calls for 40 PSI.
     
  3. dtracy
    Joined: May 8, 2012
    Posts: 223

    dtracy
    Member

    Would it be of any value to practice on your vehicle using just plain water in the gun? Same booth conditions and air temp though. Would it give you any sense of how heavy a hand you should use with the gun or not?

    Dave.
     
  4. that would be of ZERO value.
    there are no solids in water.
    AAC shoots NOTHING like urethane.
     
  5. dtracy
    Joined: May 8, 2012
    Posts: 223

    dtracy
    Member

    Thanks alteredpilot, just kind of thinking out loud. I haven't sprayed any waterbased auto paint. I remember that back in the early 70's GM used a few waterbased colors on their cars mostly pastels and they were very hard to sand and impossible to spot. Panel to panel was about the only way to finish them. If you tried to spot the feather would peel up and make a mess. Color match was good though.

    Dave.
     
  6. Salty
    Joined: Jul 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,259

    Salty
    Member
    from Florida

    Like (and I) already mentioned....it shoots totally different, it's a way different feel than....if it's been awhile scince I've shot AAC I'll shoot something really quick just to get the feel of it back.....
     
  7. Dane
    Joined: May 6, 2010
    Posts: 1,351

    Dane
    Member
    from Soquel, CA

    I though you had to buy a whole new gun to shoot water borne?
     
  8. not sure about the commercial stuff, but for aac you just need a 1.3 with a stainless needle/nozzle.
     
  9. Nope but any steel parts will eventually rust so they recommend that you convert to one that has stainless components where fluid will be.
     
  10. dtracy
    Joined: May 8, 2012
    Posts: 223

    dtracy
    Member

    Alteredpilot, does it get tacky between coats or what? How do you know when to recoat? And, most of all, does it flow very well or do you have to sand it smooth before clear coat?

    Dave
     
  11. Blue One
    Joined: Feb 6, 2010
    Posts: 10,926

    Blue One
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Alberta

    I can buy the Solvent based urethane myself, I'll find someone to spray it, there are still lots of hobbyist -rodders who paint without being registered bodyshop businesses.

    Won't be a problem.
     
  12. verno30
    Joined: Aug 25, 2008
    Posts: 1,070

    verno30
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    This is shot in waterborne PPG. The first time I ever shot the water based stuff was this spring. All I painted was the green part of the frame. The white is traditional solvent pased paint. The remainder of the body and fenders was shot by a good friend of mine. I was worried sick abot spraying it because of the horror stories, however, it really isn't that intimidating.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. grf-x
    Joined: Jul 15, 2010
    Posts: 299

    grf-x
    Member

    I have been using Auto Air since it first came out. It started as an airbrush paint for guys like me who fear Urethanes. I have loved this stuff from the get go. CLear's real nice with Urethanes. Nice ride by the way.
     
  14. no it does not. its either 'damp' or 'dry'

    knowing when to recoat is a matter of experience. if there is any 'sheen' or 'gloss' its still wet. if its nice and 'matte' and it looks good and dull, and you cant feel any wet or cold in it, its time to spray.

    it doesn't flow at all. thats NOT how its sprayed. AAC is sprayed in 3 dust passes which equal one 'coat'. its a totally different game. forget everything you know about urethanes or any other system.

    there is a perceived 'texture' from alot of users, but that can be overcome by taking the time to learn how to reduce, adjust your gun and apply the paint. that said, even when i was on the steep part of the learning curve, i always had great results.

    its a great system, but not for people who want it to behave like urethane.
     
  15. chopt55bc
    Joined: May 10, 2008
    Posts: 886

    chopt55bc
    Member

    with ppg envirobase you shoot 2 medium coats at 27psi. forced air dry between each coat. and then you shoot what they call a control coat at 17psi with a very fast stroke. this gets the metalics to really pop and makes your blends flow better.dry that last coat and go to clear.
     
  16. gasolinescream
    Joined: Sep 7, 2010
    Posts: 614

    gasolinescream
    Member

    I'm new to painting, I have been using Auto Air paints on smaller items in the garage like helmets, cooler boxes etc. Hopefully as my skills develop further i'll move on to bigger things. Pretty much got the whole range of paints (metallics, candy, pearls,colour shifts) in the colors i like and been using them with my 1.0 mini gun and .3/.4/.5 airbrushes.

    So far so good and using the paint is pretty simple with little or no mixing. Get the garage to a 20-25 degree temp to work in. I've been using an hair dryer set on cold inbetween coats and amazed by how quick you can put tape on it, great for complicated taped design work and multi colors. I just need to save some more money so i can buy a bigger air tank and new full size gun for laying down the clear and painting bigger areas. As i don't have the right gun for clearing i'm either getting a friend to put clear(slow drying) on for me or using a rattle can for smaller stuff. The cans not ideal but this is just hobby stuff for shits and giggles and the results are easily as nice as anything i've attempted before.

    It does cover in a different way and that takes getting used to. Dusting the paint on is important otherwise the paint can look milky.Metallics and flakes etc don't pop very much until you get the clear on ,so go easy. One trick i've noticed is that a coat of transparent base inbetween colors gives it alot more depth and helps with no marking when taping up for desgins. The fact you can have a small panel painted and dry to work on in a very short amount of time is appealing.

    There is alot of support online for their stuff aswell as many video tutorials that are pretty damn good. Thats one of the reasons i decided to use it as i'm kind of teaching myself on custom paint, airbrushing, lettering, etc, etc and i need all the help i can get.

    Good luck, Dan:cool:
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2012
  17. hotroddonnie
    Joined: Apr 28, 2011
    Posts: 243

    hotroddonnie
    Member

    Just had my car painted with waterborne paint!
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Sep 22, 2012
  18. dtracy
    Joined: May 8, 2012
    Posts: 223

    dtracy
    Member

    Thanks to everyone for their comments, I know your time is very valuable. I used to paint with lacquer, enamel, and urethane when I was still in the business. I have an old Studebaker that I hope to do one of these days and by then waterbased will probably be the only paint available. So it's learn it or pay someone else to do it. I'm certainly not knocking the professionals but the reason I still have the car is to do it myself.

    Anyways, thanks for the help guys. This information is very valuable to me.

    Dave.
     
  19. plodge55aqua
    Joined: Jan 4, 2009
    Posts: 1,710

    plodge55aqua
    Member
    from Alberta

    I think the reason for Forced air in Spray Booths is more for a Fast Production enviroment.. How ever.. having good airflow in the Booth does help even doing a long term project.. even though its a water based product.. it still has to flash properly prior to Clear..
     
  20. Jim Stabe
    Joined: Oct 31, 2008
    Posts: 179

    Jim Stabe
    Member

    There is a good article in the latest Rod & Custom on the subject. Charlie Hutton (of Coddington and Foose fame) demos the PPG Envirobase and has a lot of good tips. He says it sprays much like the old lacquers - thin coats that dry quickly. He was working on a door and sprayed 3 coats and a final dust coat in 10 minutes. Says it is boon for the home painter
     

  21. It’s not a bad article but they make it sound like they are writing about all waterborne paint. However it is written about the PPG envirobase. So far I’ve used a few different waterborne systems and the technique used to spay a couple of them is totally different.
     
  22. sierra rod shop
    Joined: Feb 16, 2011
    Posts: 382

    sierra rod shop
    Member

  23. scott51
    Joined: Mar 7, 2009
    Posts: 131

    scott51
    Member

    So based on some of the feedback does that mean HVLP is not as suitable? Do they make different reducers, fast or slow drying etc?
     
  24. Jim Stabe
    Joined: Oct 31, 2008
    Posts: 179

    Jim Stabe
    Member

    All it tells me is that I'm going to try the Envirobase PPG paint when the time comes. Sounds like it's pretty hard to screw up.
     

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