vibrating gyrating ford 302-- just annoying

Here's something to think about as well. I have seen many Parts Store machine shops "Balance" and engine, but in reality all they do is balance the weight on the rods and piston and never spin the crank. i have also known of some who spin the crank without the balancer or flywheel/flexplate, a friend brought his motor over for me to assemble years ago and he didn't have the balancer or flywheel with him. I asked him if he left them at the machine shop. He said no, they were at home, he never took them to the machine shop, but they charged him for balancing.
So there is a chance that he got a similar Cut Rate job and changing the flexplate will do the trick in this case.

 

I thought I would add that I fiddled around with the washers (weights) and got nearly all of the shake gone.. Only a tinniest remnant of it ever being there. Thanks again!

 

This has been a really good thread. I THOUGHT that I knew alot about the 50 vs 28 deal but this has been an eye opener. Lots of good balance shop info and some good old back yard balancing info as well.

 

amen to that... that washer trick is pretty nifty! I never would of guessed to do that.. I think I need a tad more weight on the bolt to the right side of the weight...however I have exhausted my few different washers for that size bolt.. I know there is a such thing as weighted washers and nuts.. I'll have to do some looking around and experimenting.. more just to see if I can do it at this point. lol. just to rip it out and put in a new one soon. I love learning things like this!

 

So are you going to swap in a 50 oz balancer? Running around with washers seems beyond hokey.

 

Yes.. Ordering one on payday.

 

Nice.

 

Had the same problem. Here's what I did:

1. Pulled the motor.
2. mctim64 built me a new roller.

Fixed.

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Kustom Falcon Build Thread:
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The problem is the guy that balanced the engine .there used to be a race engine builder here that his engines all shook at about 2000 rpm ,his explanation was its a race engine you don't run it at 2000 its balanced for high rpm . its just a crappy balance job

 

Wow... That's a good one


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lol.. well.. good engine builders are for whatever reason hard to come by around here... the best in arkansas is Keith craft engines in Arkadelphia Ar.. http://www.facebook.com/pages/Keith-Craft-Performance-Engines/283509546583

I called them about a longblock.. 10k.. lol.. I wish I had 10k to spend on a motor! I think he said the cheapest they have would be around 7 or 8.. been a few years things may be diff now.. maybe next time.

 

Holy mother of pearl! Hell, Ford Racing wouldn't even stiff you that bad.

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Kustom Falcon Build Thread:
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=734282

 

I've read this with interest. My SBF's are a flathead and a y-block, but this has added a good bit of info if I ever try the next Ford in progression.
Thanks and good luck!
RB

 

RB, honestly for the price you're better of buying used runners or pic a more interesting engine... the windsor is just not a good bang for the buck (from my experience).

 

Not to hijack the thread but there has been some talk about Mexican blocks. When I was building a 347 clevor I called the SVO line at Ford and ask about the Mexican blocks and was told that they did have heaver caps but they had checked the nickel content in them and could find no differance from the US blocks.

 

Don't know if you changed anything, but you can make a weight, it doesn't have to be very thick, .030 would work and make it the contour of the f. plate. You want to be sure it fits flat against the plate when the nut is drawn down. Also deburr the holes. If I were doing it I would make 2 about 2 inches long, drill the holes in the middle. I know, alot of people make fun of this, but it works! Not knowing how the assembly was balanced, a 50 oz plate may not cure the problem either. I take it the motor vibrated from the beginning; not preaching, you should have got a hold of those people and driven the car there. They should have made good on their work! Mike. P. S. I would build a motor for a heck of a lot less than that!! LOL!! I stand behind my stuff!!

 

TR has it right, been in his shoes, I think the best thing you can do is to change to the 50 oz Flex plate and I bet you will have to add weight somewhere on the flex plate to get it as close as possible.
When I had my machine shop I NEVER added or subtracted ANY weight from the balancer or flex plate on an ext ballanced motor, this very well may have happened in your motor. It's acrap shoot at best now. If you pull the pan again you might look at the counterweights to see if there are any drill holes or welding that don't look factory, hell they might have matched the rods and pistons for weight and never spun the crank that would be a good thing for you at this point!
Good luck!

 

I'm in complete agreement with you! A good friend used to balance engines at a shop in Wichita. I watched him several times; Ed explained the differences between in-line, V and opposed stuff. And he showed the clay trick. They had a crank, (Don't remember what), couldn't get that sucker to really smooth out, "chased that tail all over and out the door"!! LOL!! This 302 engine probably has had the crank all messed up, but who knows! That was why I brought the "washer" trick, and if he puts in a for real heavy f. plate, I'll bet ya a dollar to a dough-nut, it will still have the shake. It's one of those things, tear it apart, spend more hard-earned money or do a seat-of-the-pants and be out a little time. I'll tell ya about a motor that had a shake; in '74 I bought a '64 Galaxie that someone had dropped a for real Super Cobra Jet 428 into. Yeah, that's an external balance, BIG weight on the front, but they used the 390 flywheel, hell that thing would vibrate on the drive and MOVE around!! LOL!!

 

agree, could be a misfire at certain rpm on one cylinder

 

I put a 351W in a '79 Mustang and got the wrong (302) flywheel. It would shake the screws out of the dash! I took the original 351 flex plate to the balancer guy and he matched the flywheel to it, no more problems. Apparently all 351's are 28oz, 302's can be either 28 or 50.

 

Well 65, sup??

 

We ran into a similar problem after installing a rebuilt engine,...the original had the external balance weight, as well as weights on the flex plate; Removed the external weigh, and replaced the flex, vibration (at 1750 rpm) went away.

It seems Ford used internally balanced engines, and some were external balanced,....Can't mix the pieces, as we learned.

4TTRUK

 

Perfect example of "FORDS BETTER IDEA" Hay 65 FORDGUY. Have not heard from you since 2/19/13. Did you fix it?? You mentioned ordering a 28oz balancer on payday. Wouldn't a 50oz flexplate be a whole lot cheaper, plus getting rid of a problem FP and have your new 50oz balancer you already have???

 

I have the same problem exactly with the 292 in my 57 Ranchero? I test drove it and it had a 3 speed standard with overdrive and had the vibration. When I switched off the OD it smoothed out so I figured it had to be in the tranny. I had a 700 R bolted on and it only moved the vibration to a different speed or RPM. It does it in park as well. Have not tried any cures as yet and was waiting for that simple solution. I will start with removing the belts and if any miracle cures come along let me know.