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Twisted Sixter HA/GR in Kentucky Build Thread

Discussion in 'HA/GR' started by robsimmons, Nov 15, 2018.

  1. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    I've been an occasional lurker for a couple years and have wanted to try my hand at building a HA/GR for that long, thanks to Old6rodder.

    I've taken the time lately to go through all 32 pages of posts, so I can avoid all of the automatics, 4 barrels and narrowed rear ends stuff.

    I'm dedicated to the Slant 6, so that is the only option there. I have several to choose from.
    I've always run automatics for drag racing, but banging gears for a change sounds like a blast!
    It's not like I'll be running in any HA/GR pure events given my location, so I've thought about going the SDRA route if I can't come up with a good 3 or 4 speed set up.

    I picked up a '33 Chevy frame a couple weeks ago, so that will be the basis to start with. They had cut the rear section and moved it up and were using it as a farm trailer of sorts. Right now the wheelbase is 84", but once I reconfigure it for a HA/GR it should be legal length. I plan to keep it pretty short and may even follow Old6rodder's side slung theme.

    It's gonna be a slow process with several other projects needing to take precedence over this one, but I'm really looking forward to going old school and having some fun.

    I wasn't around during this era (born in '67), so I'll try and learn as much as I can and be as true to things as I can.

    Gasser 1.jpg
     
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  2. Old6rodder
    Joined: Jun 20, 2006
    Posts: 2,545

    Old6rodder
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from SoCal
    1. HA/GR owners group

    Can't be as slow as Cassi, my street roadster project of 47 years, three different designs, and two different engine/gearbox combos so far. :rolleyes:

    Tuned in to this one, or "following" as the screen says. :cool:
     
  3. bobw
    Joined: Mar 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,372

    bobw
    Member

    I used Cassi for inspiration for the roadster pick up I'm now building. With a Slantie, 4speed OD.
     
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  4. Old6rodder
    Joined: Jun 20, 2006
    Posts: 2,545

    Old6rodder
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from SoCal
    1. HA/GR owners group

    Bob, start a build thread with pics or it didn't happen. :D
    Pretty please? :cool:

    Rob, how 'bout a push button? First gen slant 904 was a good enough slush pump for any medium build. And with its two pumps you can even push start if you feel like it. You'd have the only one, as well. :)

    ps Those rails're crying out for some added lightness (holes ;)).
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2018

  5. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    A push button would be uber cool. Very Mopar. Unfortunately, I don't have any of those. All of my 904s are later style.
    I reached out to Fopar on slantsix.org to ask what he did to make his shorty 904 for his RED. Gotta head over to the Pull a Part and climb under some Jeeps with 2.5 or 2.8 engines for some pieces & parts...

    The rails will definitely have some added lightness! :)
     
  6. Old6rodder
    Joined: Jun 20, 2006
    Posts: 2,545

    Old6rodder
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from SoCal
    1. HA/GR owners group

    The minor offset thing's really easy to do. I just moved a piece of the housing tube over, and swapped the long & short axles. I clamped some angle iron splints on for re-assembly alignment, tacked'er together, pulled'em, and stitch welded'er up. Increases the original pinion offset to 4.250". Could've gone another .250" and still had plenty of axle spline in the spiders.

    I'm running SUs, which can't siphon, like regular carbs do. So you may want to add carb hood(s) or a scoop, as it/they'll be right in line with your face. Lot of strips'll demand that. I've even had to school the occasional youngster on SUs during tech, when they carped about my lack of carb covers.

    A recent post here noted this full spool now available for 8"ers. :cool:
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2018
  7. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    Very cool! I assumed you would have had to get an axle shortened and replace the longer one. I thought you had offset the center section by an additional 4 1/2".

    Even more older schooler... I love it!
     
  8. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    Zoomie 3.jpg Zoomie 2.jpg Zoomie 1.jpg On the SUs... That would be cool, but I haven't come across another SU set up for the Slant since I sold mine many years ago. If anyone has one laying around, let me know! LOL

    I do have a dual 1 barrel manifold and have been trying to pin a guy down on a dual 2 barrel manifold...

    I wanted to run my Hyper Pak on this, but I saw a post a long time ago to you from Ryan saying that was a No Go. :-(

    I was given a cool set of Zoomie type headers off a pulling tractor I'd love to use, but they won't work with any of the manifolds I have. I'll need some sort of side draft or other cobbled design. I noticed you changed yours to point back over. These may not work at all. Maybe more wall art. LOL
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2018
    classiccarjack likes this.
  9. Old6rodder
    Joined: Jun 20, 2006
    Posts: 2,545

    Old6rodder
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from SoCal
    1. HA/GR owners group

    Had to change'em to lay farther over when a tech bitched about the vertical ones being too close to me, CO wise. The simple fact that they shot straight up was lost on him. So I slant cut the tips, and the revised set looks even cooler. Take that, you dipshit tech. :D

    Yeah, the HyperPack uses a quad, decidedly uncool for HA/GR. I wonder how a two barrel'd function on that manifold? I ran a BBD for one season some time ago, and it only cost me about a second.

    I have a second set of SUs, but they're destined for El Toad. If the 'Brick doesn't sell when I get that round twit, I'll give you a crack at the carbs & pipes. That'll likely be awhile though.
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2018
    Crosley likes this.
  10. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    I asked Mark Goodman about the Hilborns that were run with these headers. They are on his Lancer now, so they are certainly seeing some good use! Thanks for keeping me in mind on any of your stuff. Much appreciated.
    Got it on the Hyper Pak... "But they were around before '62..." :rolleyes:

    Another really off the wall thought I have is to cobble up a modified head like I read about in Slant Six Racing News (SSRN) many years ago and saw mentioned here as well. Modify the intake runners to come from up top. It was an effort to straighten up that sharp bend in the intake runner we're stuck with... Hmmm... Way beyond my capabilities, but most things are...
     
  11. bobw
    Joined: Mar 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,372

    bobw
    Member

    K.I.S. Keep it simple so you won't have to tear your hair out trying to get it to run right.
     
  12. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    Good point. I'm gonna get it running first. The funky stuff can come later, whenever... ;-)
     
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  13. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 4,493

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    I have a pair of HS-3s with balance tube, heat insulator spacers, etc. from an Austin Healy (I think). I don't know if they would work for you - I'm using a pair of HS-6s on my 300 crossflow Ford.

    PM me

    sr_042_5.jpg sr_048.jpg
     
  14. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    Nice work. Too bad that intake wouldn’t work on my Slant! I can barely MIG weld.

    I’ll shoot you a PM. Thanks!
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2018
  15. storm king
    Joined: Oct 16, 2007
    Posts: 1,990

    storm king
    Member

    If you were going to HA/GR legal, Holborn's and 4 bbl's wouldn't really help, since you're limited to those narrow, non race tires. SGRA is another story. A stick is still a good way to go, but does the HA/GR rules require a legit one piece explosion proof bell housing ( I suspect not) or just a safety shield of some sort? Building your standard transmission as a slick shift unit would really help the et's, as I've noted in old6rodder's videos, he loses a lot of et to the shifts. a robust, well designed shift linkage, and slick shifted gears would significantly speed things up.
     
  16. old sparks
    Joined: Mar 12, 2012
    Posts: 414

    old sparks
    Member

    over the top rules ( in my opinion ) severely limits participation so build what you have available and go out and have fun. as long as you follow the safety rules and the visual of the car is impressive you wont have any problems with tech. first impressions by the tech gods mean alot
     
  17. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    A little more poking around looks like the HS-3s may be a tad small for my purposes. Cool looking option, but for the effort involved I may be better off going with something else.

    This car will be run more at local tracks and at the Slant 6 races. I might make it to Mo-Kan or Tulsa once or twice. Given that, I will likely have a set of slicks to run everywhere except the HA/GR and SDRA events.

    My understanding from reading posts here is that a safety shield of some sort (1/8" steel?) is required for HA/GR. Correct me if I'm wrong. Old6rodder had a Quick Time bell made I believe ($500ish at the time?)

    This car is more for the fun factor than trying to win round points in the Slant 6 series, so doing something "different" and running a stick sounds like the most fun. I need to learn about slick shifted gears. I'm not that familiar with the different terms used. I've heard of "straight cut" gears and "Fully Synchronized."...

    I've got a couple lines on an A833 OD (Maybe truck version with long throws) and a "Fully Synchronized" 3 speed from some fellow Slant 6ers.

    Can we run hydraulic clutches? Or is that not in keeping with the era? Trannies are whatever you want, but I imagine old style linkage is the right way to go. Just curious...
     
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  18. classiccarjack
    Joined: Jun 30, 2009
    Posts: 1,466

    classiccarjack
    Member

    I have a hot rodded slant six with a A833OD behind it. I love these engines! Can't wait to see what you build!

    Sent from my Moto Z (2) using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  19. Mr. Mac
    Joined: May 16, 2005
    Posts: 1,956

    Mr. Mac
    Member

    FYI The 2019 rules for the SDRA will read Slicks(any kind) no wider than 10inches can be used.
     
  20. Old6rodder
    Joined: Jun 20, 2006
    Posts: 2,545

    Old6rodder
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from SoCal
    1. HA/GR owners group

    Fewer than six HS3s'll be decidedly too small for a slant. In SUs you'd want size 6 (1.750" throat). Three of those're about right for the slant's displacement @ tach.

    You should decide up front how much of the car you want to build in "the era". Most're happy to have a car that looks right, but built, equipped, and raced with more modern techniques.

    SDRA's been running slicks for a bit, and having a ball doing it. Very few actual HA/GR minded builds left state side these days. More in OZ though.

    Scatter shields want to be .250" plate minimum. Need to block both flywheel and clutch, full perimeters, for most strips' tech. QT bells're running $700+ lately, but there're still a few left. Show up on Ebay from time to time. Steel flywheels're available @ around $400, and a wise investment, as are good racing quality clutches, around $350. All three're a particularly good idea if you're going "side saddle".

    Hydro clutch mechs're likely fine with the SDRA boys as well. Only us HA/GR fanatics'd quibble something like that.

    "Slick shift", or removing every other tooth to make wider spaces available to mesh the gears, is an old trick. It's good as long as the remaining teeth can handle the load. In most small stock boxes for the slant it'd be more likely to provide RUD** experiences . Rocky & Lee did it on a couple of their small Ford boxes, blew both of'em and went back to full teeth. Lee was rather hard on gearboxes anyway, liked to tach hammer his launches & shifts.

    **Rapid Unplanned Disassembly
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2018
  21. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    Awesome information Dick! Thanks!

    Initial plans will be K.I.S.S. with mostly parts I have. I may likely pick up that Ford 8" instead of my 8 1/4 with highway gears though. I think they might be those super high 2.45s...

    Very good point on the importance of the safety items with that clutch sitting right next to me if I do go side slung...

    No room in the garage right now and the frame is covered in ice, so I likely won't start hacking away any time soon. Good winter planning though! Thanks all!!
     
  22. 64 DODGE 440
    Joined: Sep 2, 2006
    Posts: 4,377

    64 DODGE 440
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from so cal

    For this kind of car K.I.S.S. is important. Build for reliability and try to build it light. Too many people get deep into trying to squeeze every .001 second out of the car and never learn to read the lights for that .000 launch where the win really comes from (flag starts remove a bunch of the stress and really turn back the years). That and the fact that many forget the fact that the class is about going back in time to the early days not trying to build an old looking car with modern technology. The other thing that gets lost in the translation is it's about the experience. They get lost in trying to be the best of the best and forget to have fun.

    Don't worry about having a slow build process. I started on our car in 2007 and keep hoping that one of these days it will be ready to move under it's own power. It won't be the fastest or quickest, but it will probably be the oldest bunch of parts on the track. Old6rodder keeps my inspired with a couple of runs in the Brick every year at Eagle Field and win or lose, it keeps me grinning all the months in between meets.

    Keep at it, I'm looking forward to following your build.
     
  23. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    No progress to report other than plotting and planning, but that part occupies some of what's left of my gray matter... :)
     
  24. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    I got a package in the mail today from Old6rodder. I guess that means there is HA/GR progress!! :)

    It's so well packaged I don't want to open it... LOL
     
  25. 64 DODGE 440
    Joined: Sep 2, 2006
    Posts: 4,377

    64 DODGE 440
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from so cal

    Trust me, if Old6rodder Packed it, it was packed well. We need pictures or it didn't happen.
     
  26. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    I'll tear into 'em this weekend. I got a second package last night... Judging by the size and shape of the first box, Dick must be an expert at the video game "Tetris". I'm interested to see how he ever got a Slant 6 intake manifold, set of headers and two carbs in that box! PICS of the unwrapping will follow. ;-)

    Thanks again Old6rodder!!
     
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  27. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    FE49DD1F-0FFE-4953-A28D-932068A24E67.jpeg 1D7C376B-3755-48D2-8F21-DF13F16AC6B6.jpeg 0619199C-C7CB-4D50-BF5A-1E902CDA0313.jpeg E2F5F3BB-B74B-4A43-A62A-17C061A9B8BE.jpeg Wow! I still don’t want to open it! It’s too well packaged...

    I did open the second box. Very, very cool! Thanks Dick!

    A group of us are building a 62 Valiant for Lemons racing. This is our new mascot!!
     
  28. spanners
    Joined: Feb 24, 2009
    Posts: 1,675

    spanners
    Member

    Just don't lick the mascot.
     
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  29. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    82FB7519-8A1A-4C86-96DD-B18144242723.jpeg 64FFFB05-9C3A-470D-9BCE-DDD7810698F5.jpeg 63F38853-2F71-4DB0-84FD-8D05FC467E32.jpeg Goodies! Dual carbs & headers! Vroom!
     
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  30. robsimmons
    Joined: Jan 13, 2012
    Posts: 69

    robsimmons
    Member

    There was a young feller sellin’ a go cart on Facesmash Marketblast the other day. The go cart wasn’t interesting, but the fiberglass body sittin’ on it was.
    I got this poor thing and set it on the ‘33 Chevy frame for some inspiration... CAD249D3-3ED2-496D-806B-F4B47EB92F7B.jpeg
     

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