Hot Rods Tunnel Ram over carbed

Do you have the vacuum pods tied together and have you changed springs in them ?

 

What did you do with the choke's ? disable them? remove them completely? Just asking as this hasn't been discussed. You need more timing like others have said. What is your'e idle vacuum reading? The power valves should be half that amount. I use 50cc accelerator pumps and # 31 squirters on my 600s , But every combination needs to be tailored. Also once you get it a little more dialed in you can play with the secondary springs. I also use the vacuum secondary lids with the vacuum nipples on em so I can tie em together so they open at the same time.

 

Damnit Swade ..you type too fast

 

1) Modify the timing curve with a distributor spring kit, lightest spring set that makes weights return home when engine is hot. (Note: Hot springs loose pulling power and if engine bucks at hot start up move up to the next stiffer spring one side) When your happy with the timing curve set timing at 36-38 all in.
2) Like Lumpy 63 said, Warm it up to operating temp and put a vacuum gauge on it to see what your pulling at idle, then install power valves that are 1/2 the number of your vacuum reading. Example: 12 lbs of vacuum = #6 power valves

 

Op How heave is your ride?
Are your heads set up for the camshaft?
What RPMs are you trying to turn?

All the answers have been given by others , it takes time to tune a tunnel or any other induction, under standing carbs are more then jet , squirter's ,
p valve. You are over cfm's with 600's or even 450's. . Your combo only need about 600-680 cfm's total . If it was me , cap off / disconnect both secondaries , or set secondaries to open a 1/8-1/4 of the way.because you don't have the cash for smaller carburetors and you want the tunnel ram look , reinstall out or box jets ( jets should only be +3 to 4 to - 3to4 out of box for jetting ) squirter's Cam & move to #2 on cam. Transfer slot relationship to butterfly ?
Set timing / experiment between 17. -22 degrees of static Timing with the help of a vacum gauge, adjust idle speed ( I like 1,000-1,200 even on automatic ). Adjust mixtures ( after hot more likely hard to start , hook up a button to starter solenoid so you can spin motor over to speed then @ same time turn key to on / run ) then play with the total @ 35 degrees total , all in by 2,400 or so ( is timing make @ 0 tdc correct ) Take for test ride, if all ok , add little more total , ( that means going back into distributor and doing some changes , creep up to ping on total then take 2deg out of total , this is on 91-93 octane , if running on 87 your total will be around 35 or so . Keep notes , pick up a trimming light with rpm & avance knob about $60 @ autozone we have not even covered air bleeds metering block and so on.
I did run Victor Ram SBC a much bigger cid then your set up with two 550s two barrels ,
Sidesaddle And I needed a little over 1,000 cfm's with heads flow over 330 cfm's & pretty much 1,200-1,500 stall On street almost 300 miles a week .It Took a lot of time with out a dyno to run correct

 

Simple and makes a lot of sense.

 

Yup. Starting to, at least. So, in theory, choking the ram plenum size with cause more vacuum, correct? Now that I am starting to understand it a little better, I WILL beat this bastard. I have 800 buck in this F'n manifold and carb set up. I really wanna make her work.

 

I love the Hambers! Who the hell else would know these details?!

 

I wanna really thank all who chimed in on this one. If I could afford it, it would have been a big block in the manger, but this was the engine that was all done, no hassles, had 300 hp, will always start, be reliable, and tout my 1800 pound, manual trans truck around nicely (at least I thought) Damn! Test driving it with the single 600 and a Edelbrock performer, this thing went like a raped ape. Once that ram went on, it is the classic example of show no go ( I know, folks warned me). I don't even mind a little less speed, as the thing is stupid fast (at least for me it is), but that damn bog is really lame. I just can't accept it. Thanks for all the help. I would love to say I will go out this weekend and mess with her but I gotta to-do list as long as this thread, so I will hafta note all the great suggestions and hopefully grab a Saturday to myself in the not to distant future and work over the hotrod.

 

Still have both manual choke assembs on the car, but open of course. Yeah, I guess I should pull those, right? But would that make so much of a difference? They are open. Please expand on the Pods references. Purpose and details. I am lost -really.

 

Awesome! Food for thought. Thanx!

 

Guys

1800 pound car, cam is mild rv cam hydraulic cast 194/150; nothing over 5500

 

This is what I was talking about. You will note they have removed the valley in the center of the top plenum So, I have a thick air bladder with a pump which can be locked once filled. I am thinking if I stuff the center or block it off somehow, I will be chocking some space from the plenum and giving direct shots of air and fuel to the cylinders (granted one carb for 4 each). If I block the center as an experiment, should get the same effect, correct? Thoughts?
https://www.realstreetram.com

Pork

 

You do know that intake & carb combo is likely to wash the lube from the cyl walls and cause premature wear on your engine?

 

Look up Holley part# 20-73 this is the quick change covers with vacuum nipples so the secondarys open at the same time.

 

But remember dont worry about that until you get the other drivability issues sorted

 

Or you can drill and tap the lids you have for threaded hose nipples ...

 

Not unless there's something wrong with the carbs .....

 

Springs return home when engine is hot ????what , they pack there bags and move back home with Mommy ????

 

By reducing the plenum volume , you'll increase air speed in the runners keeping the fuel/ air emulsion in suspension....but......you'll make it more difficult to get the same VOLUME of the fuel/ air mix to each cylinder..,...some will be rich , some lean.... ,Long port runners make more power , short port runners are better for response , on a carbureted engine ......that's why modern fuel injected engines put the injectors( fuel/ air emulsion) at the intake valve and have long port runners , emulsion control and runner velocity .......

 

Progressive linkage ALWAYS results in 4 lean cylinders and 4 rich ones ( except at WOT) and the result is less than stellar throttle responce.....

 

Linkage is currently, and had been one to one. Every time I ran it with the second carb off sightly it was much much worse. I will run the dizzy with the zip ties on the advance, and push 30 for all in on timing to see how it goes . I am really thinking of buying a plain old Torker manifold and using the best of the 600s with the 35 squirter. I bet she would go like hell.

 

Get the timing up to 34° minimum...30° will do nothing ....
Why are you worried about the advance , it's not part of the equation with your foot on the floor ??

 

You are getting there, as yuo say coming to grips, as you have no idea how to actually tune a Holley lol.. Not meant as an insult, but you are creating some of your own problems- you keep talking about choking it off- not a tuning tool. First off, you are wanting an engine that looks and sounds "bad" that is not- TR and a Poser (yeah, I came up with that one) cam that makes noise first and power second, and a lame long block are not a good mix, except for making a little noise. You can make it run better, but at some point you need to accept the best you will get with a lousy engine combination. First, put the carbs back stock, jets, shooters, and correctly adjust the accelerator pump, and set the idle screws at 1-1/4 turns out to start. Stop thinking about "choking" (?) things. Then, as has been said several times, get some timing in it- set it about 36, should run pretty good for a starting point. That was probably the worst problem from the start, other that the Poser cam, and you dinked with the carbs to correct a timing problem. My old buddy was an incurable "dinker", we used to say he did tune-downs, as everything he touched always ran worse after he dinked with it LOL. Those plain-jane #1850 Holleys are about the most universal, forgiving carbs you can find, work on mild engines and 4x4s very well, and on hotter engines with very little work- we use them on 427 2x4 setups all the time- my avatar car has a pair. Don't worry too much about the secondary's it will probably never work hard enough to open them- and make sure both carbs open exactly the same. Get is baselined and stop dinking lol... It should run fairly well with the timing in it, then get a vacuum guage on it and adjust the idle screws to max vacuum, turning all four the same amount, about 1/8 turn at a time, and give it a minute to stabilize and watch the guage. Given the TR and poor cam, you may have to run it a bit richer than max vacuum- you are trying to band-aid a poor engine combo. Give the 600s a chance, they are not the problem- as you have noted, there are plenty of not-bad engines running around with twin 600s on a TR, but a putzo longblock isn't gonna run well at 28 degrees

 

What is the cranking compression?
Maybe pull the timing cover and advance the cam to give it more.

 

A.I doubt that'll help
B. He's already in over his head , let him get the carbs and timing straightened up first

 

Being demeaning and name calling sure doesn't help
Turning all the idle screws the same amount is an exercise in futility , senseless !

 

I think you will be much better off with a single carb.

 

A vacuum gauge is your best friend....

 

All springs loose some of their strength when the engine gets hot. Example: the circular choke spring when warmed relaxes and opens the plate Experienced that when using both the lightest springs (included in the GM distributor spring re curve kit) they worked great until the engine warmed up, about 50% of the time had to go back and put one medium on because they did not have enough strength to return the weights to the base of the curve (home) where the normally are at rest cold home is where you sleep I still try the two lightest 1st, with a performance cam I like to advance early as possible with out hard starting.