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Event Coverage TROG Bonneville ??

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by typo41, Jun 12, 2017.

  1. WiredSpider
    Joined: Dec 29, 2012
    Posts: 651

    WiredSpider
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    Last edited: Jun 16, 2017
  2. VonWegener
    Joined: Nov 19, 2009
    Posts: 783

    VonWegener
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    Ever since the "Kustom Kulture" thing became big graphic designers who were into hot rodding have been using the vintage logos like Champion or STP for their art. Since the art world and corporate America seldom collide this has never been a problem.
    I am sure Trog meant no malice and used the SCTA design out of admiration for what SCTA stands for but the fact is that SCTA should protect their design and Trademark if they did even trademark it. I think SCTA should send them a letter to grant Trog permission to use it this time and refrain from repeat usage in the future.
     
  3. Ryan, in years past you and dozens of other arts and graphics guys would have jumped down Mel and Bobbys throats for stealing the SCTA logo. We have had many threads in the 17 years I have been here about an artist or Graphic Designer getting ripped off. That is one of the main gripes I see about the Landracing regulars. The other is many of us are not sure the fragile salt can sustain this. I have nothing against their events, friends have done them. But I think this one is ill-planned. I see the USFRAs side of it, looking to boost numbers at their event, leta hope it works and the Salt benefits. I will throw down a challenge, last time I helped Tim at Bonneville we ran an Auction of cool art and stuff with folks from the HAMB and landracing.com attending. In a couple hours we nabbed about a grand for the Save the Salt foundation. Bobby, Mel.......just like Public TV fundraiser I challenge you guys to Double our contribution in like manner ;) FWAP (that is the sound of the gauntlet hitting the ground) More trad than a mic drop
     
  4. fourspd2quad
    Joined: Jul 6, 2006
    Posts: 666

    fourspd2quad
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I don't see it being an issue if Mel and Bobby took some of the flavor of the S.C.T A. logo and applied it to T.R.O.G. I wouldn't call it stealing just artistic license since they are going to Bonneville after all. It's not like they need to fool anyone. There will be droves of people there either way. Anybody who has actually been to TROG (and I have been to all but one) knows it is just a great happening that totally helps grow the interest of our hobby. Those guys had vision and went for it, good for them and us.
     
  5. plan9
    Joined: Jun 3, 2003
    Posts: 4,008

    plan9
    Member

    if regular joe rodder wants to go racing with SCTA/BNI he can buy-in with a less popular car. not everyone is going to be able to set a record with their blown fuel hemi right off the line, right? World of Speed or Speedweek is also just once a year...

    just an observation about race of gentlemen. guys building cars for it are doing interpretive reenacting, and its basically living history. it exposes some folks so far removed from the world of traditional hot rodding to maybe dig a bit deeper into what a hot rod is, and why they exist in the first place. thats a good thing, even if it does carry an element of showbiz bullshit with it.
     
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  6. RichFox
    Joined: Dec 3, 2006
    Posts: 9,889

    RichFox
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    You all realize that the salt meet that will be going on at the same time. Is not an SCTA event. It's a USFRA event. Different group. Different logo. Same idea.
     
  7. RichFox
    Joined: Dec 3, 2006
    Posts: 9,889

    RichFox
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    Here is the salt at 9am today. Look at the cloud on the hill. Check the truck on the left. You know you want to be here running your TROG car. The truck is probably checking out the salt for setting up the course. upload_2017-6-17_8-21-55.jpeg
     
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  8. 66gmc
    Joined: Dec 4, 2005
    Posts: 496

    66gmc
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    I dont understand some peoples negativity towards this event. I attended for the first time this year as a spectator and really wasn't sure what to expect. Where I am from there is an extremely small group of people who are into hot rods, and even less that are building traditional style cars. When I arrived in Wildwood on thursday evening I was immediately blown away by the number, and quality of period correct cars. I spent all of Friday wandering around and it seems everywhere I went I came accross more great cars. The cars and bikes werent just parked either, they were out cruising the streets of Wildwood.
    The racing on Saturday and Sunday was really just the icing on the cake, after Friday I could have gone home satisfied, because how often do you get to see stripped down period perfect race cars tearing up public streets?...you never see that where I am from.
    All the pictures and videos really cant do the racing justice, its something where you really have to be there to get the full experience. Its not just a bunch of hipsters leisurely driving down a beach, those guys run their stuff hard and there were plenty of break downs to prove it. Yes there were spectators who didnt need to be there (it seems like Sunday most of the posers were gone) but it seems like everywhere I went people were talking about how they could build a car or bike for next year. Any event that inspires a bunch of people to actually get out in the garage and build something is a success in my book!
     
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  9. Pete
    Joined: Mar 8, 2001
    Posts: 4,529

    Pete
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    I'm pretty sure Bobby has nothing to do with TROG any more.
     
  10. I may be wrong but wasn't the resurgence of the traditional thing helped by the culture scene?
    hot rod deluxe.jpg
     

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  11. VonWegener
    Joined: Nov 19, 2009
    Posts: 783

    VonWegener
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    That is unfortunately not true. By sheer idiocy on the part of SCTA the demands for safety equipment for both driver and car are governed by the record in the class. Lets say you want to run a stock '68 Mopar with a 383 and think it is OK to get a driveshaft loop and a helmet because your car will not go faster than 130 you are wrong and faced with making your low power car adhere to the rules for the fastest in B/Production which is something like 228 mph. Suddenly it gets very expensive. SCTA is killing off new blood to the sport by their stupid rules.
     
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  12. RichFox
    Joined: Dec 3, 2006
    Posts: 9,889

    RichFox
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    Which of course is why the USFRA has a 130 club. So what's your bitch? Or are you thinking of El Mirage? In which case you might look up Tom Finn and ask him what can happen in a 125 mph car on the dirt.
     
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  13. plan9
    Joined: Jun 3, 2003
    Posts: 4,008

    plan9
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    68 mopar with a 383.... how much money will that cost? ....and you are worried about spending cash on some safety gear? hahaha!!

    like Rich said... USFRA, 130 club....

    .... what are you waiting for?
     
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  14. RichFox
    Joined: Dec 3, 2006
    Posts: 9,889

    RichFox
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    VonWegener makes the point that he can't run his stock 383 Dodge at an SCTA event. And he is right. Nor can he run it at a NHRA national event. A NASCAR cup event, an SCCA event, or at the Indy 500. There is a reason for that. These events are for people who are willing to put forth the effort to have a car that meets the rules and is fast. Those who wish they could be racing with one of these organizations but don't want to make the effort remind me of those who want a participation trophy. He says he is a bike guy. It's not that hard to meet bike safety rules. But you do have to make some effort. I first went to Bonneville in 1966. I have never seen so many entries as they have now. SCTA is doing very well with their rules, thank you.
     
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  15. ELD
    Joined: Apr 11, 2008
    Posts: 653

    ELD
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    Bobby's 1933 Group are going to be quite busy with LA's iconic The Formosa Cafe restoration their biggest task to date.
    The Formosa was founded in 1925 by 1920s prize-fighter Jimmy Bernstein. The restaurant has a long history of movie star and film industry patronage due to its close proximity to studio lot across the street, which began as the United Artists lot and was later owned by Warner Bros. Generations of movie stars such as Humphrey Bogart and Clark Gable have eaten meals at The Formosa. Frank Sinatra is reputed to have spent many nights at the Formosa in the 1950s, pining over Ava Gardner. In 1991, the restaurant was threatened with demolition when its lease expired. Due to concerted citizen and preservationist efforts, the restaurant was preserved in its present location as a landmark. If you've ever seen any of Bobby's landmark restorations, Idlewild, Bulldog Cafe (featured in the movie The Rocketeer) and the depression era Highland Park Bowl that had a doctors office upstairs where you could get a prescription for alcohol and go downstairs to the bowling alley and have it filled. They do amazing meticulous time-consuming work.
     
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  16. Those stupid safety rules save lives. EVERY one of them has been written with someones blood.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2017
  17. WiredSpider
    Joined: Dec 29, 2012
    Posts: 651

    WiredSpider
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    Exactly!!
     
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  18. onekoolkat1950
    Joined: Mar 23, 2008
    Posts: 1,864

    onekoolkat1950
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    Ditto


    Sent from my iPhone using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  19. Mike
    Joined: Mar 5, 2001
    Posts: 3,462

    Mike
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    [QUOTE=". The other is many of us are not sure the fragile salt can sustain this. I have nothing against their events, friends have done them. But I think this one is ill-planned. I see the USFRAs side of it, looking to boost numbers at their event, leta hope it works and the Salt benefits.[/QUOTE]

    This is a huge concern, this should have been the focus of my original post. I've seen the photos and videos of the TROG events in New Jersey and at Pismo Beach. I see the cars throwing big rooster tails and leaving big ruts in the sand. That's the whole idea, and a big part of the fun of TROG races, and that's great. That kind of activity on the beach is not a problem, mother nature will take care of things in short order, a few days of the tide coming in and going out will completely eliminate any trace that a car race occurred there.

    It's different on the salt. The salt crust is only an inch or two thick, it doesn't take much to strip that away and gouge into the mud/dirt below. It can take years or even decades for mother nature to repair any vehicle caused gouges and restore the salt crust. The people and organizations that race on the salt regularly go to great effort and take great care to prevent this kind of damage from happening. Anyone seen peeling out or doing donuts, etc. at Speedweek will almost certainly be admonished for doing so by racers, SCTA officials or the BLM (BLM will probably hand out an expensive ticket also).

    If the TROG races at Bonneville occur in the same manner they do on the beaches, it is very likely that this kind of damage will occur. As stated above, this kind of damage could affect that area of the salt for years, and I also worry that this may result in a lasting, adverse effect on those who race there on a regular basis as the TROG folks go home and SCTA, USAFRA, Mike Cook Shootout, etc. may be left holding the bag.
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2017
  20. Well, we had our SCTA Board meeting last Friday and the last item on the meeting was the TROG issue. SCTA sent letter to Mel, telling him to not mention SCTA in any of their advertising, web sites and facebook material. They want nothing to do with the event.
    Sound a little harsh? Not if you are trying to protect your own identity and reputation, and your safety image.
     
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  21. Mike
    Joined: Mar 5, 2001
    Posts: 3,462

    Mike
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    Makes sense.
     
  22. RichFox
    Joined: Dec 3, 2006
    Posts: 9,889

    RichFox
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    Come on Mike. You know that the USFRA are not dummies. They were founded in '76 to save speed trials on the salt. I joined a few years later. '79 or 80 I think. USFRA is still a major part of the Save The Salt effort. There is no way the TROG cars will be using the same course as WoS and SpeedWeek. Or anything else for that matter. Note the entrance just behind the girl. It doesn't look like that now. The sky is not falling. 11826012_876782349035949_640628671167792305_n.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2017
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  23. Mike
    Joined: Mar 5, 2001
    Posts: 3,462

    Mike
    Member

    e
    I hope there is no problem, but my concerns are quite legitimate. If the BLM is unhappy with the effect that the TROG races have on the salt (as the California State Parks Dept. was at Pismo Beach), their could be repercussions for the groups that regularly race there. The TROG organiszers have nothing to lose, while the SCTA, USAFRA, etc., could be negatively affected for the future.
     
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  24. RichFox
    Joined: Dec 3, 2006
    Posts: 9,889

    RichFox
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    Then I believe the proper place to direct your concern would be to the USFRA. They are locating the TROG course. And will be in attendance during the TROG meet. You can bet that they will be keeping a close eye on what happens there. When USFRA responds to your concern, I hope you will share their reply with the HAMB readers.
     
  25. Blues4U
    Joined: Oct 1, 2015
    Posts: 4,476

    Blues4U
    Member
    from So Cal

    It's hard to believe, in an area as large as the flats, that there isn't a small area to hold drag races, that even if there was damage done to the surface, that it would harm the areas used for the time trials in any way.

    As far as the Cal State Parks dept being upset about damage from the cars on the beach, that is asinine. The damage done by the storm itself was magnitudes larger than any damage done by the cars. That is just fucking ridiculous. You do realize that people drive on this beach all the time, right? And there is an area for off-road vehicles just to the south of the area used for the races. You think they don't do any burnouts in the sand? :D :D :D That is one of the most ridiculous things I've seen on this forum.
     
  26. They sound like a bunch of Hoodlums!:eek:
     
  27. RichFox
    Joined: Dec 3, 2006
    Posts: 9,889

    RichFox
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    Report from the salt
    [​IMG]
    Re: Salt today

    « Reply #3 on: Today at 07:56:07 PM »
    [​IMG]Quote
    Got back last night then went on a road service call to a Tour Bus, sorry I'm late Sparky. [​IMG]
    Well it has good coverage but it's really thin. Right off the ramp at Lands End there is brown showing through for about 1/8 mile then it starts getting thicker. There's been enough public traffic going out there it has actually tracked & packed an entry road for about 1/2 mile towards the dyke. There was at least 25 Joe Public vehicles out there on Saturday & most of them were making passes & three of them were stuck in the $hit over on the north side.
    I did basically the same thing I did last time, started between Lands End & the dyke & made a straight line to the right side of Floating Mt, stopping every 1/2 mile until I was 8 miles out. This time I just drilled the top with a hole saw since I know there's nothing under the dirt/mud to a depth of 4ft & found variations from 1" to just a thin skin of salt. Most of the surface is pretty ruff from water movement & has settled out small high's & low's leaving more salt in the low spots & less salt (1/8") on the high spots. If you touch those thin high spots with your finger they collapse leaving you with dirt that is still higher than the salt. There was a about a 1 1/2 mile area of that 2yrs ago when I tested out there, now it covers 2/3 of the whole salt flats. The line I take puts me roughly between the combo course & the Cook course.
    The short course area was still pretty wet due to being closer to the Mining drain so I didn't go very far out there to avoid doing damage but the thickness seemed more consistent for obvious reasons, $hit flows down hill. I came back down the mountain side of the long course & it was about the same as the trip out.
    There's no standing water, it's all gone over to the mine ponds which look really good from a mining standpoint right up to the plant. [​IMG]
    Sid.
     
  28. Mike
    Joined: Mar 5, 2001
    Posts: 3,462

    Mike
    Member

    [QUOTE="Blues4U, post: 12102464, member: 273585"
    As far as the Cal State Parks dept being upset about damage from the cars on the beach, that is asinine. The damage done by the storm itself was magnitudes larger than any damage done by the cars. That is just fucking ridiculous. You do realize that people drive on this beach all the time, right? And there is an area for off-road vehicles just to the south of the area used for the races. You think they don't do any burnouts in the sand? :D :D :D That is one of the most ridiculous things I've seen on this forum.[/QUOTE]

    I agree, that's ridiculous, but common sense and logic often don't figure in when it comes to dealing with government agencies. I recall an earlier post saying that the TROG organizers were required by the state of California to pay someone $25,000 to keep a certain species of bird off of the course so they could be allowed to drive their vehicles on a beach that people are allowed to drive vehicles on all the time. No common sense or logic there.

    The BLM is usually reasonable and fair with the groups that race at Bonneville, but how they may react to any issue is never certain.
     
    Blues4U likes this.
  29. Ryan
    Joined: Jan 2, 1995
    Posts: 18,931

    Ryan
    ADMINISTRATOR
    from Austin, TX
    Staff Member

    I feel like I don't know enough about this stuff to really have an opinion.
     
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  30. RichFox
    Joined: Dec 3, 2006
    Posts: 9,889

    RichFox
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Never stopped anybody else.
     
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