The Jalopy Journal
Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by merles_garage, Feb 23, 2012.
Yes, that's the website. He's looking around and getting prices. I'll pass the number on.
That's my website....cool, thanks!
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Cool "T" at Symco 8/10/13.
Soon Jeff, soon. Gotta gat a title and a few other things worked out, but maybe at the next mini bike get together I'll let everyone drive it around the area like the go kart...
Traditional T-buckets are the only way to go. The 70's kit car type T-bucket has been done so much I can hardly stand to give them a second glance any more.
So, one half of the attitude problem is solved on the bucket of ugly... Super late night sneak preview shot. Oh, and a sneak preview of tomorrow's entertainment!
Nice HOOPS! I like it!
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Bump For Harv117!
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: phoenix, az
</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #e5e5e5 1px solid" id=td_post_9148149 class=alt1><!-- icon and title --> Re: The bucket of ugly! A de-uglifying thread...
<HR style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #e5e5e5; COLOR: #e5e5e5" SIZE=1><!-- / icon and title --><!-- message -->Ya know it's funny Jeem, After studying this stuff as long as I have I've kinda come up with a few different "eras" in the T-Bucket evolutionary history.
1. Norm got his car up in late '54, and that era ran through about '60. Lot's of steel wheels, white walls, seriously exaggerated tail high rakes, long shifters, steel touring front half bodies are all hallmarks of the era. Lots of white interiors, although other colors were seen too.
2. Late '59, Bill roland bought Tommy Ivo's car from him and embarked on a COMPLETE make over that included new cobalt blue paint, Halibrand wheels, and the injectors were replaced by six Stromberg's. This seemed to be a pattern for builds that lasted right up to about '65 or so, judging by magazines of the time. The stances got a bit lower and flatter too, and I kid you not, if I randomly grab ANY magazine from that time period and hand it to you, almost any bucket you will see will have a white interior. American's were super popular too, as were semi-wide whites up to about '62 or so. Home made exhaust systems were the norm, too. The drags exploded in popularity in the early sixties, and I notice that "T" bodies on Altered cars became super popular about this time, and more and more of the street driven T-Buckets took influence from those cars.
3. Tom Booth put together "The Torsion "T" in '65, and had it ready for the '66 season. This to me marks the beginning of another era, as that is the first car I can recall that really ran motorcycle type wire fronts with no or minimal braking. Cragar S/S first came about in '65, and were very popular on buckets. Matter of fact, the July '65 Car Craft has three features and articles on buckets, and all three have narrow Cragars and narrow whites on 'em, months after they came out. That's also when dark colored interiors became the norm too. Blacks and browns, button tuft, biscuit tuck, anything but Roll and pleat. Tops started showing up again, And paints tended to metal flakes and the beginnings of psychedelic type paint started to happen. The two main types of T-Bucket headers we see to this day, the "sprint" and the "roadster", or "classic", became off the shelf stuff. This era lasted to about '70
4. Let it all hang out! Danny Eichstedt's "Leg Show" T hit the cover of Rod&Custom for January of '71, and the game changed again. This time proportions got pushed around QUITE a bit. Wheelbases got stretched out, bodies got shoved back a bit, Vintage brass trinkets got expensive, bodies got cut down, tops got tall, seating positions got exaggerated so that the occupants rode on the car, not in. Steering boxes got more commonly moved under the car giving the verticle steering column. Tires got wide, Skylark wires got widened, then Tru-spoke started making their wheels saving a step. Dan Woods was back from the military and dropped the "Ice Truck", and Contemporary Carriage Works was in full swing. Interiors now swung back even further and mohair and velvet were super common along with just general dark colors. Paint seemed a bit more subdued, although still very rich, high end candies and such. Quite honestly this is the era that most "kit" T-Buckets most closely follow to this very day. It was either the beginning of something great, or the end of cool T-Buckets as we knew them depending on which side of the fence you stood on. I see this era as running through about the last time T-Buckets were really relevant, say 1985 or so.
Jeem at this point is doubt either napping or rolling his eyes, 'cause he knows me. You don't dare ask a simple question about something 'cause I don't usually give simple answers. Suffice to say that this the OPINIONS of some one who has been an addicted reader/researcher/historian/idiot his entire life. Just like the little story I touched on briefly the other night to explain to Judy why we weren't going to do the interior in metalflake magenta multi-hue sparkle vinyl. I pointed at the rack with my '62 and '63 magazines on it, and told her to pick any two of them. Then I told her to flip through, find the T-bucket features and tell me what color the interiors were. 6-1 it was white!
We're sticking with about '64 as a build, it's gonna be white!
Ya know Jeem, a talented illustrator could easily do a Darwinesq drawing of the eveolution of the t-Bucket fairly easily... But where would we find such a man?
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HOT ROD CENTRAL LOUVER CO.
Taken from ..need louvers ? thread, this is about as accurate as one could get with the T Bucket transfomation or progression if you will as one could get.
I just came across some great vintage pics, will be posting them for the next few days.
Here are the first batch of pics, these came from pitorial magazines all dated 1970.
These cars have no build dates listed wih the pics, but I doubt that any were more than 5 or 6 years old when photographed, but i'm just guessing. Chips timeline looks to be spot on, the paint, tire and wheel selection, stance, etc.
It seems as they evovlved the axles and brakes changed from beam and drum, to tube and disc, or no front brakes at all as Chip mentioned. The suspension, interior, drivetrain, stance, paint, interior, as well as many other styling points, while keeping with the trends were up to the owners choice or what he thought was cool. Anyway here are some of the first ones, enjoy, more coming.
Note, dual coilovers, wood box, shortened turtle deck, 23 back window, no front brakes.
Awesome man! The one in the upper left was called "The Dodge T". That's a full blown dodge 340 hiding under all those Weber carbs, and one of the most tasteful psychedelic paint schemes ever.
Some more...Kinmont brakes, fade paint, tube axle and drum brakes, steering wheel position, wood bed and other wood accessories, wild grille insert, rectangle headlights and of course white interior.
Some more, no brakes again and they had so many different rear window cut-outs, Maltese cross, diamonds, square, oval, etc.
I thought that looked familiar
Building new headers right now but here's mine at the mo.
Post 705, center top is waaaaayyy significant! Remember Tommy Ivo's beautiful bucket? Then Bill Roland's reduex of the same? Well, this is the next step... Hy Rosen bought it from Bill in late '63, and delivered it to Barris... Dear God. I'd post more but it makes me sad. Fortunately, it stayed in the family always and was restored to Tommy's original configuration in the late '80s
Damn, there has got to be something in the water down there! How in hell do you guys keep building spot on perfect T-buckets? More pictures PLEASE!!
OK, I am a big fan of the turtle deck as it gives the car a longer look without having the front axle way out there, as well as mimicking the shape of the tub, this one gives me T fever. Does anyone have any other pics or know anything about it?
Also, this one has the rear axle about a foot further forward than the Chan T, it works for me, some might not like it. The wooden balls on each side of the tub, to help with getting in and out?
Wood balls more that likely covering the studs to mount top bows.
And top right is Dennis Debenedictus car, There were photos of it in Hot Rods '67 Oakland coverage, so that should help date it. The Dodge Fever T was in Hot Rod in '69 or '70, I'd have to check. Both sixties T bucket icons. the purple car is familiar too, I have magazine coverage of that car as well, but would have to look it up to know the date/magazine. Thinking it was in Hot Rod in '69.
IIRC, this was a Dragmaster chassised car.
5 and 6 are the famous "torsion T" pretty sure 7 is Andy Brizios.
Last two in post 705 are actually a T coupester from Oregon, featured in Hot Rod in '67/'68. I'll try to find it. #1 is Tom Thimis, Southard photographed it at Oakland '67. The purple car in shot #4 was in Car Craft in '65 or '66.
So much awesome stuff going on in this thread lately!
The purple car in the top set of photos with the top and cycle fenders was in '64 or '65 Car Crafty as "Lil' O Bucket". The blue one in the same picture set was actually a coupe with the top cut off, and was also featured in that same time period, and a couple of others. I have seen that car with four different tire and wheel combos over the years. It would be fun to kinda piece together what combo it ran when and see the changes over the years. I'd be willing to bet the pictures here are about as early as they get with that car, '63 or '64, 'cause the next set of wheels were Astro slots in about '65. Ya, and I think Goerge mentioned Tom Booths Torsion "T" that I cited in my evolution piece above the other day. That seems to be the beginings of the motorcycle wheel craze on buckets, even though I have seen one from a bit earlier, like about '62 in a magazine. After Booth's car hit, that exploded.
I have to correct something I just posted! The blue coupe/cutoff, I think the pictures are post '67 as George stated as I was writing my reply. Look at the Blue streak slicks on the back, that's just about the time they came to be. Even better, check out the radials on the front wheels...
I have been DIGGIN' that car since I was eight! One of my all-time favorites. Cant recall the owners name right now, I'm chalking it up to major jet lag.
If you don't find it soon, I may have time tonight.
Yup, and Knutsons "Novel T" showed up in Car Craft and R&C right after that, also with the cycle wheels, that was when it really took off. After that, it was actually unusual to see a T-bucket with front brakes. Thats why the cars that REALLY knock me out JUST pre-date that era, the Penry car and Dick Thompsons Pontiac powered car especially. Both had drum front brakes and 6" wide five spokes on the front. Debenidictus car had the same deal, and is another car I have loved since I was a kid, but I always felt the wb was a little long, and it had too much gingerbread on it. I am more knocked out by the proportions of the Thompson car (see attached pic) than any of them, including Penrys, but it had cowl lights, which I dont care for. If you could just combine the 16x10s and WB of Thompsons car with the cleanliness of Penrys, IMO you would have mid-sixties T bucket PERFECTION. the Thompson car looks like it has the 3" chop we are discussing on your thread, but with the posts vertical. Thats it for me, thats THE LOOK. Thompsons car and Penrys both had 6" headlights as well, something modern builders would NEVER do. You know, not cool and all that...
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