to all shop owners.where did you find good help?

Word getting around is the best method.

Snap-on, Mac, welding & metal supply shops, etc -- let those guys know.

I've had good good luck with part-time / younger guys via UTI, MMI, etc.

Best folks I've hired are the retired ones! Ex-Boeing machinists, tool&die guys, etc -- typically 30+ years experience. Usually 3 part-time days a week to get them out of the house or 2 days full-time. Hardworkers with a good work ethic. Occasionally you can get them full-time for short term projects if deadlines happen. It's great having the experienced resource pool available when needed but not having to keep them on a regular payroll!

 

Hello..Hire a novice and train them..Pay good wages, and most important be fair..Your employees make you look good or bad...
Duane..

 

thank you for your words and wisdom.i can see where i have problems to work out,but gaining back control over the workers i currently have still doesn't change the fact that i need to find a source of trained hot rod craftsmen to help me build my next projects.

i am a young guy(35)who has been building hotrods for 19 years.all of those years have been spent honing my skills under the direction of my father.as he moves toward retirement,i am moving into the role he wants to get away from.

i believe that i have the skills,and the ego,to hold my own along side of any builder any where.that same passion is what i look for in someone to work in my shop.i try very hard to outdo myself on every job.to me,that idealism is what creates the best products.

my whole reason for this thread has been to find where guys of this same mindset can be found.

i am thankful for all of the replys.all of them have been full of wisdom.

thanks again,
-danny

 

I'm with you guys. Seems like a lot of people have lost all work ethics. They seem to come in when they want to, do as they wish, leave when they want with excuses and expect to be paid on time when the work isn't completed (which means the shop doesn't make money)... Please let me know when you find the right place to find good help. We've got 1 good DEPENDABLE worker besides my partner, NOT including me

 

In Indiana . I did this this winter part time in my home garage.

 

I would like to introduce myself Mark Davis director of the Metalcraft Tools Skill Center in Crossville, TN. Many know us for our metal shaping equipment and many for the short term training we have offered since 1988. Many issues face the custom automotive industry workforce is a big problem. Most training facilities force students to take automotive technology before they get to take what they want hot rod programs. In 1997 we expanded our program to train fabricators for the NC based NASCAR teams, with better than 90% of our students ending up in teams with-in 50 miles of our Hickory, NC TECH Center. Although the industries are similar performance fabricators use skills from a number of different trades one economic study in NC claims that motorsports technicians use over 20 NAISC listed skills including automotive technology. Trade schools teach these skills but have primary focus'. Most custom car builders don't need a welder but a fabricator that welds. We were able to meet the needs of some teams, while chopper, streetrod, muscle car, and even concept vehicle builders felt that the industry was falling short of talented workforce and many even tried to hire technicians burned out on racing. The top hot rod schools still feeling pressure from dealerships pushed students in that career direction. It's more important than ever to separate the industry training away from automotive technology the skills needed to succeed covers areas that would take years in trade schools and in the field hands-on experience would cost employers to much to justify. In 2005 shops throughout the country started to openly pursue metal shapers and fabricators. We trained instructors ,built teaching aids, work stations, to meet the needs of the hot rod industry, but in the eye of most institutions if its got wheels it a car, and that’s a blue collar dead end road. I have trained fabricators that make more money per year than the six year degreed administrators that choose to cut the funding for vocational programs. Because of the need for performance vehicle fabricators in our home state of TN our skill center has been approved by the state to offer a year long program that's a true hot rod program. 16 areas of study, 8hrs. a day, 5days a week, 1280 hrs. of labs, 640 of build team, 15 max students per class, for info www.metalcrafttools.com

 

good shop help..that's an oxymoron..

i've had some of the best help in so cal.til they have to actually do work..most the people want to stand around and talk about what they're going to do..

i have had the guys from overhaulin help me.those guys have the skills and they don't mind working the long hours..


but,recently..i had a little arguement with a little fire cracker of a pin -up.she told me she could work in the shop and fab and weld .i just started laughing...hahahaha.i told her to show up on tuesday and wear this.
------------------------
that's right nothing.

well,she showed up ready to work..and she been the best damn assistant i've had yet..it's going to be shitty when she goes back to school..but,we'll see.

until then..we're going to finish another car this summer..

then we'll start on her roadster.

 

I am retired ..anybody hiring in the Middle GA area?

 

I'm getting ready to retire (63 years old) and there's nothing I'd like to do more than work at a hot rod shop. I might not be any good for much more than cleaning up but I'd be cheap, I'd be there every damn day to do it - and any other sh***y little job that came around. I'm not tired of working, I'm just tired of working at a job I've started to hate.

Look at some of us old ones...we know how to show up every day...we've been doing it for 40+ years.

 

If you were a little closer I would love to work at a rod shop,I do convertible tops and interiors and a little body work and some welding plus mechanical and electrical. I have too much stuff to pack up and move right now. Jeff

 

I read once that an employer should encourage all of his employees to field their resume every two years. I see alot of validity to that.

Have that guy who's always griping about not making enough money go out every two years and SEE WHAT HE'S WORTH. He'll either find the better pay, or he'll find out that he's not worth more, or that he needs a career change to make the bucks. Works the other way too- The guy's always hitting you up for a raise, and you tell him the $$ isn't there, or whatever, he sends out his resume, and comes back to you to give notice, he has a better paying offer!! Damn! maybe you better cough up the dough!

That goes on and on, but it works.

All that said, I am a seven year employee of a street rod shop. I love my job, but I'm always looking for ways to improve-- be it better money for my skill level, or aquisition of new skills, more recognition for my body of work, whatever, I'm constantly on the hunt for the next avenue of improvement. This absolutely drives my boss nuts!

are you THAT guy?

the boss who wants his employees to think they HAVE to stay where they are?

encourage your guys to go looking, if you're right for each other, they'll be happy NOT TO.

I've stayed where I am for seven years, maybe a little out of loyalty, maybe a little out of complacency, but all in all, it's been a lack of a better offer that's kept me here. I hear that echoed in some of the other posts- much of the hot rod industry doesn't have a better offer. I'm 100% positive that there are better offers out there, and believe me, I'll take one if it comes.

BTW, I'm not soliciting an offer from you, I'm only trying to say that you have to be the guy with that better offer when the right guy comes along.

 

this must be a texas problem.

-danny

 

Brent, I agree with you but you failed to mention one thing that everyone considers when looking/changing jobs, money. If you want the cream of the crop, be prepared to up the ante. The best go where they feel they're paid what they're worth and also a good work enviroment ect... Or, hire a young guy with an extermely high mortgage, at least he'll show up every day.

 

what he said: i've been doing this for over 30 years and so far my best help has been a retired machinest from GM he averages 20 hours per week, i have a list of what i need him to do and leave him alone, if there is a question i'm the 2nd one to know what the question is.

i've tried the young guns and it seems that after a couple weeks the trouble starts, either not getting to work on time or at all and they seem to develope an attitude of the boss is a dumb ass because they know it all.

i've tried the tech school guys and spent most of my time leading them around, even the ones that were hired to be the shop grunt:
things like empty the trash can,first you pick up the can(yes your going to have to take your hands out of your pocket) carry the can to the dumpster lift the lid empty the can in the dumpster, close the lid,put the can back where you got it,(you remember by the mill or ?)when you sweep the floor put what you sweep up in the trash can instead of leaving it in a pile somewhere. etc.

like i said retired guys seem to be the best, they have one speed but its a constant one and they also clean up after them selfs take a lot of pride in their work.

thats my two cents

 

In racing you have racers and guys who work for race teams. The racers know if you finish second you lost, the guys who work for the team get to tell the girls at the sports bar that they work on race cars. Racers are not motivated by money,but being the best,fastest, building the trickest part,out smarting the other racers, putting it out there with pride knowing that if it is the best ,you have raised the bar for the others and being racers they will respond. Smart car owners soon understood that if these guys were comfortable they would get the best of the best. If the wolves were not beating on the door total consentration went into the project, good work enviroments ,state of the art tools,materials and parts , a work place without contravercy ,allowed these guys to enter a creative zone and performance flurished. Car builders are not to different , even the best builders are not about the money but the build, if your are good ,money is the by product. American hot rod builders have that defining mind set that next time it would be neet to try this or maybe that, thinking of how to build that ultimate ride. On the other side is the cookie cutter hot rod shop owner that needs employees to assemble cookie cutter cars for owners, that want a hot rod because it's fashionable , these business 'also have a challenge finding quality help. Although the growth of the industry in the past ten years is based on the fashionable side of the marketplace the one off car market is gaining strength in income numbers ,with the demand of both types of employees at a premium.

 

You can train a hard working guy to do the job, but you can't train a guy to work hard, it seems some are just born with it and some are just lazy or want the easy way out. Good luck in your search.

 

Seems to me, that most of the Employers AND Emplyees think they can have an ideal situation.

A situation which is an acceptable compromise for both sides is pretty damn good....

Also, I dont see how micro managing capable help can be a real sollution.

Explain clearly what you want done, and then leave him the fuck alone.

 

Which part didnt you get?

 

Over the last day or so this has become an interesting post. Brentin10uhc has really hit the ball over the fence with his comments and I find that he's very on target with his idealogy. We can all learn a great deal from what he has said. I've been in business for many years and have heard this arguement and discussion before. Its a business issue that isnt just relegated to the automotive field.
The "Millenium Generation" is currently entering the job market and they are bringing with them a new series of employment issues. They were constantly told at "little league" how great a job they have done, wether they really did or not, and now they are expecting to be told they did a great job by just getting to work, regardless if their on time or not. This is not my imagination talking . It was the topic of a 15 minute program that was recently aired on NPR. Big Business has already identified this as a major employment issue for this country. Hiring todays youth is going to present a number of challenges that many in business are not ready for. Yes ,there are good hard working kids out there. its just going to be more difficult to find them.
Being a business owner isnt for everyone .It takes a special person that has the discipline and foresight to make it successful for themselves and their employees.

 

Instant Gratification...that's part of the problem !!!
The good job talk, even though you really don't have a friggin clue.

How many people do you meet anymore that want to bust their ass, get dirty, and learn? NOT MANY, they want instant gratification.

I saw this in another post, but can't find it....Fresh out of Whymoaning Tech and expecting $25 per hour. Instant gratification.

BUT...there's another side to consider. If they want to learn and they got a work ethic, then you can teach them. When you do the training, you'll get exactly what you want/need. Then when some guy splits, you got one to replace him. Apprentice labor is cheap, and if they don't work out...see ya. The flip to this is there aren't many shops who want to take on an apprentice, oh I know.....'we are to busy to train somebody go try a tech school.'

Tech school, prepared and ready for instant gratification.

 

Brent makes many very good points and I agree with his philosophy in general.

There HAS to be a leader. The leader must have control. Everyone HAS to know what is acceptable and what isn't.

Years ago I ran a very succesfull shop. We were always backed up with work. I had to fire a really good guy because he broke one of the rules. (he came in drunk) Although it hurt our output in the short term, it was the only thing to do. I couldn't have everyone start breaking the rules now could I? It actually motivated everyone else to work a little harder because we were now a guy down.

The beauty of that shop was that for the most part, everyone there was really good at their job. Everyone knew that as long as they played by the rules and worked hard, that they would have a good paycheck. If you didn't play by the rules, you were gone. Just the way it was. No bad apples to spoil the rest.

 

Build cars for a living.....?.... Shit man that takes all the fun out of it.

 

Not to mention tech school doesn't teach you what you need for a rod shop or the like. I'm 22, don't live at home, pay my own bills and don't have the time for a tech school even if there were one to teach me the skills I want. No one wants an apprentice, they're too busy, too lazy or in my opinion will only teach me the half assed way to do something. I had one guy tell me he'd be willing to take on an apprentice once he was done with his current one. Told me to keep in touch. I did, and guess what, when it came down to it, too busy. I can't work for 6.15 an hour and pay my bills. Sorry, it doesn't work, not to mention if I'm going to bust my ass learning from you, I expect to have a job when I'm done, not pushed off elsewhere after half assed training. And no one is flexible around real world hours. They want you to do thier work, make them money and have ALL the fruits while you can't afford to put a roof over your head.

 

Viva La Medico

 

Anybody here ever take Psych 101? Remember Mazlow's Hierarchy of Needs? Money is important, but it isn't the only thing that matters. Once a person's basic needs are met, they begin to look for the intangibles-appreciation, respect, growth, etc. Pay must be enough to provide an acceptable standard of living, but more money won't retain a worker who feels unappreciated.

Your best advertising and source for good help should be the satisfied people who already work for you.

 

Unfortunately you fail to recognize that is how some owners are and why even a seasoned business can be prone to failure. I am intrigued by the underlying tone of "them" and "us" in your reply. That said, I am sure to fan the flames of the age old argument of Management versus Labor. Let sleeping dogs lie, there is absolutely no need to argue that.

 

I agree,
In the thirty five years I've been employed in the automotive field, "explain clearly" is one of the things I have found most lacking. Followed closely by multiply "priority one" assignments. Tell me what you want done , give me a clue about your vision of the completed project. I can give you what you want if I understand what you want. I'll do what it takes to make it happen, better than you expect it.
I want to learn new skills. I want to take on new challenges. I want to push myself to the next level.
I know you have a big nut to cover, I know you have to make money to stay in business. I know to obey the rules. Your not the first guy I've worked for.
Be clear, be fair, I'll do my part.

There is my .02 cents

Craig

 

Brent- I agree with a BUNCH of what you're saying, but I'm going to take a second to defend my position here.
It's not just about worth- and it's not meant to be a "put up or shut up" either direction. As an employer, if you've done your managerial job properly, as you have outlined, you are expressing your own confidence in your own ability to provide a stable and happy environment.

I'm not saying to my employee " hey man, if you don't like it, git the fuck out"

I'm saying "hey man, I believe in providing you with the best possible environment in which to do your job, and I am confident that I am doing just that"

that disgruntled guy isn't the guy that this is aimed at either- that guy either needs to hit the bricks or be tossed out on 'em

and your point B)-- it DOES take an employer time and money to mold an employee-- BUT-- that doesn't mean that that employee OWES you loyalty for it- you EARN that loyalty by providing the right kind of environment (and yes, leadership, as you have said)
you pay him to work for you to YOUR standards, that's as far as that training goes. He owes you nothing for it, and if he can't work to your standards, you discontinue the paychecks. End of relationship.
if you've done your job as his employer correctly, he'll have no interest in fielding that resume.

but if you constantly remind him that he's there to work for YOU, and that he OWES you loyalty, and that you are AGAINST him trying to improve himself in whatever way HE chooses, I'm betting he'll go ahead and mail that envelope.

I guess what I'm really trying to say, is that it's more a mindset of performance than anything else- as an employer if you perform your job properly the employee will have no interest in sending that resume, and as an employee, if you keep that thought in the back of your mind as you perform your job, you will know whether the environment you are in is right for you or not, and hopefully you won't need to pass out that paper!!

 

just a few reminders...

its easy to think of being able to goto work as a priveledged opprotunity, but if the priveledged opprotunity is the same everywhere else in town it will never spawn any sense of loyalty or dedication.

lead by example. its hard to jump a guy for laying out when youre gone for 3 hours at lunch. i dont care if you own the place or not.

a realistic deadline = no overtime, everytime.

if you have hired people because of what they know, let them do their job.

if you feel you have to hide things from employees you probably dont need employees. transparency means a lot to everyone.

if you say its so, then make it so. always stand on your promises.

 

I'd like to know where to find a good shop to work for! I'm sick of struggling in my shack behind the house and "borrowed" shops! There ain't shit for shops around here unless I wanna swap fenders and do panel blends on hondas all day!