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THE oldsmobile rocket 303 324 371 394 post to end all other posts, (lasalle related )

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by RocketDaemon, Dec 19, 2006.

  1. Yeah, those are the numbers I'm talking about. Those will tell you what the year the block is at least.

    As for the transmission, yeah, the Jetaway was used in the 98 for sure. The hydromatic was used in the base 88 in '56.

    It sounds like some things were switched around through the years. Maybe a '55 324 was swapped in to replace a blown '56, but the transmission was kept?

    It's hard to tell without knowing the block casting numbers.
     
  2. Here's the casting numbers that the late Olds guru Don_Wow gave us:


    1949--8A1001 TO 8A193864 H PREFIX=HYDRA MATIC
    1950--8A194001 TO 8A568689 H PREFIX= HYDRA MATIC
    1951--8C1001 TO 8C287312 B PREFIX= SYNCHROMESH
    1952--8R1001 TO 8R214478
    1953--R215001 TO R549482
    1954--V1001 TO V355083
    1955--V400001 TO V983275
    1956--A001001 TO A385513


    Head numbers that I know of:

    #2 1952
    #3 1953
    #7 1954
    #8 1955
    #10 1956

    I'm not sure about your 'J' prefix, but if it's actually a 'V', than it'd be a '55 block.
     
  3. Thanks for the info, Speedy.
    I'll have to look again tomorrow during daylight. Maybe I can make out some more.
     
  4. F&J
    Joined: Apr 5, 2007
    Posts: 13,222

    F&J
    Member

    Check the first letter again. Here is a partial list from DON_WOW. There is a slight ommision in Jerry's list though. He shows 56 as only "A" prefix. The A prefix blocks are the Jetaway equipped engines IMO. They had different cranks, so that's why it makes sense for a new letter.

    Now, the 56 base model 88's with the old Hydramatics: Those started with where the 55 numbers left off; so a 56 Hydra block will be an V code, not the A shown on his list. My 56 Hydra block was V and a bit over 1000000 in sequence number.



    1949--8A1001 TO 8A193864 H PREFIX=HYDRA MATIC
    1950--8A194001 TO 8A568689 H PREFIX= HYDRA MATIC
    1951--8C1001 TO 8C287312 B PREFIX= SYNCHROMESH
    1952--8R1001 TO 8R214478
    1953--R215001 TO R549482
    1954--V1001 TO V355083
    1955--V400001 TO V983275
    1956--A001001 TO A385513


    EDIT*** Hey Speedy, now I know why your name is that :) I type slower.. ha
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2012
  5. I just checked again, and I do see a V in front of everything.
    But there is a J too.
    Would make it VJ410775

    Maybe the J stands for Jetaway?
     
  6. F&J
    Joined: Apr 5, 2007
    Posts: 13,222

    F&J
    Member


    I learned, never say never....so I can't say that number is wrong. Read my post above about 56 V and A codes. Again, I can't say for sure what "might" have happened when they ran out of Hydramatics at some point? but still had some V coded engines, or unstamped engines with Hydra cranks? or had V stamped blocks that got a Jetaway crank because the Hydramatics were now gone? Who knows.

    On your block ID. I don't know if all 56 blocks carry the same exact casting marks, but my 56 block had the large "10" on each block side, and also at the block extension near the trans. Very noticable on mine. Mine did have the 10 heads as well.
     
  7. Yes, I've seen your post. Thanks for the clarifications.
    Would I see the castings on the block with the engine still in the (original) car?
    When you say block side,mdo you mean between the oil pan and the heads on each side?
    Maybe I can crawl underneath the car and find something.
     
  8. F&J
    Joined: Apr 5, 2007
    Posts: 13,222

    F&J
    Member

    yes, and the same sized numbers as used on heads, so they were easy to see.

    Hold on, I just thought of one more change on external details on 55 to 56 engines: Look at the front crank center bolt.... 55 had a smaller bolt thread and wrench size. 3/4" wrench size on 55, and I think the thread size was 5/8". 56 had 3/4 Thread size, so perhaps 7/8 or 15/16" wrench size?


    One more change in 56; the 55 valley pan under the intake was more or less flat, just a slight rise. The 56 was dished down or grooved lengthwise to make room for heat channel bumps on the bottom of the intake manifold.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2012
  9. F&J, I haven't been able to confirm the block number yet.
    It's a 56 Olds after all, and not a hoodless coupe... ;)

    Can anybody tell me, if this Edmunds 2x2 intake for 303 engines takes the small base Rochester carbs, or something else?

    [​IMG]

    Thanks, Martin
     
  10. F&J
    Joined: Apr 5, 2007
    Posts: 13,222

    F&J
    Member

    Many old setups on that intake used two Stromberg "Aerotype" carbs AAV 26 or was it AA 26 model? See pic below of a car I saw with those.

    Roch small base I think is the same pattern. Like 99% sure.;)
     

    Attached Files:

  11. F&J
    Joined: Apr 5, 2007
    Posts: 13,222

    F&J
    Member


    Edmunds must have gotten the idea from the factory twin carbed 41 Buick straight 8's. Buick used 2 of the same Aerotypes. 40 stude, some Cads, etc. The carbs have SO MANY little pieces...and the rebuild kits came with a hundred parts :) Some were 3 bolt bases, most were 4.

    2G /2GC rochesters are SOOOOO simple, and work so nice
     
  12. INTRUDER
    Joined: Mar 3, 2007
    Posts: 206

    INTRUDER
    Member
    from NW Indiana

    Was a book ever printed on
    HOW TO BUILD 394 motor?
     
  13. deucendude
    Joined: Oct 31, 2008
    Posts: 593

    deucendude
    Member
    from norcal

    Hi, Looks like this is the right place for Oldsmobile tech info. Here goes, I have just got an Olds Engine and trans combo. The Block casting number is 561747. the stamp on the left side between 5&7 is 7R239123. the heads are number 16. The intake manifold is 571145. The starter is on the right side (passenger). It has an aluminum adapter and a Muncy 4 speed. I know the bellhousing and stuff is aftermarket. What engine is this and is it something that was put together. Will this combination block and heads work? Thanks, JIm
     
  14. langy
    Joined: Apr 27, 2006
    Posts: 5,735

    langy
    Member Emeritus

    I looked around when I started my 394 but never found anything, I found Tony at Ross racing engines was better than any book !!!
    For instance I ordered a oil pump from Egge and it was the wrong one, I phoned them about it and they said all 394's were the same, infancy several experts told me the same, they are not !!! Mine is a 59 which is different to the 60-64 394's

    .....

    ...


    Posted from the TJJ App for iPhone & iPad
     
  15. Paul
    Joined: Aug 29, 2002
    Posts: 15,159

    Paul
    Editor

    bringing this back up with a bitter sweet memory,
    'was digging through my old messages looking for some long lost clue to a project
    found this instead

    ........................

    Hello Paul,
    I like to talk and bullshit about engine builds. I can tell you what I have done , what worked ,what went south, and you can pick out your own path. What I say is purely my experience. I'm 68 and still learning, only owned olds all my life. Worked with friends and others on sbc,bbc, pont,buick,caddy,flatheads,and early hemi---no fords or wedge mopar.

    RODS- Olds rods are forged and very stout, don't think you need after market unless it is an all out race engine.I polish the beams untill they look like chrome,recondition the big end,get the bearing clearance out to .003 . Side clearance is critcal ,not enough is the main cause of bottom end failure. Side to side clearance should be a minimum of .016 --if not get them machined. Balance will be needed after all mods to the bottom end.

    I like to polish the bearings with solvent and gray scotch brite pads to remove the dull coating--rod and main bearings.This leaves a minute small scratch in the surface to hold a film of oil on the bearings. Anal -yes, but thats me. OH ,,Cleanless is next to Godlyness.


    I also like the 371 crank size better than the 394---303 and 324 are good too. Cost is less than buying after market rods witch must be checked the same as stock, Arp bolts will finish up a pretty good set of stock rods.

    PISTONS- A forged piston is a must I think if your running a boosted engine. Had a friend with a 6-71 on top of a 394,low comp, mild cam ,street car . He didn't pound on it and broke skirts on three pistons inside of 400 miles at a max of 8 # boost. In 1970 I built a 394 with twin turbo's that dyno'd 1260 @7400------milled stock pistons down to get comp at 7.2----saving money yeah right---22 to 24 # boost --broke skirts off 5 of the slugs in 50 miles pounding on it. Bought solid skirt forged pistons custom made --ouch--- no more trouble. All the stock pistons broke right below the oil ring where skirt starts.

    Olds has a head bolt pattern that gives six points of clamping force around the hole. Never had trouble holding a head gasket. ANAL AGAIN firm believer in coating the gasket with alum paint and installing while wet. O- ringing is not needed on an olds --just me-- unlike other engines with bolt spaceing unequal to to olds.

    Heads---#8'S with the smaller ports to line up to your manfold is a good idea I think . Any time you start to build boost your over 100% of what a natural induction will do. Wouldn't worry about a super port and big valves redo---that huffer will fill in the blank spots.

    Damn I'm windy,old farts are like that LOL, thanks for letting me rant, always enjoy your posts.

    curently have two 303's,,one 324,,two 371's,,two 394's one 330,, two 350's,,,one 403,, one 425,,two 455's yes I'm nuts------thanks for the chat Jerry Weger DON_WOW
     
  16. Blownolds
    Joined: Mar 31, 2001
    Posts: 2,335

    Blownolds
    Member
    from So Cal

    I don't know how I ran into this old thread, and sorry to bring back... but it is a good thread.

    Just to add to it:

    NO, not all valley pans interchange. The '59-64 ones are bigger than the '49-58 ones.

    I have seen an aluminum Chassis Research one for '49-58, and I used to own a magnesium M/T one for '59-64.
     
  17. Blownolds
    Joined: Mar 31, 2001
    Posts: 2,335

    Blownolds
    Member
    from So Cal

    Quote: Originally Posted by ocfab View Post
    "Has anyone used a J2 trypower intake on a 324? Can you milli down the heat crossover and weld a plate to cover the hole to clear the valley pan"
    Also to add to the thread's discussion:

    I once saw a running engine with '55 #8 heads (don't know what block) and a factory iron J2 intake. Don't know what was involved in fitting it on.

    But yeah... what Paul said...
     
  18. GOATROPER02
    Joined: Mar 22, 2006
    Posts: 2,059

    GOATROPER02
    Member
    from OHIO

    There are 3 different size valley covers 49-56,57-58,59-64....they are not interchangable as most after market companys advertise them.....
     
  19. Blownolds
    Joined: Mar 31, 2001
    Posts: 2,335

    Blownolds
    Member
    from So Cal

    Never knew that '49-56 and '57-8 weren't the same size. In that case, I don't know what the Chassis Research one was for. I do know it was mounted on a 394 utilizing another plate underneath it so that it would bolt on.
     
  20. F&J
    Joined: Apr 5, 2007
    Posts: 13,222

    F&J
    Member

    If you did want to use a machined J2 on a pre-57, you need to use a 56 valley cover. It does have the indented area to clear the heat riser bulge on the intake bottom.
     
  21. blackrat40
    Joined: Apr 19, 2006
    Posts: 1,167

    blackrat40
    Member

    Thanks for the post of your letter from my pal Jerry Weger(DON WOW), Paul.
    Jerry was a walking compendium of early Olds knowledge.
    For the guys who didn't know, Jerry passed over a year or two ago.
    He's probably schmoozing with Kettering and Ransom Olds nowadays. :>)
     
  22. langy
    Joined: Apr 27, 2006
    Posts: 5,735

    langy
    Member Emeritus

    Your definitely correct, I got an Eelco for my 59 394 and had to add a plate underneath that is 1/4" bigger all the way around.
     
  23. Blownolds
    Joined: Mar 31, 2001
    Posts: 2,335

    Blownolds
    Member
    from So Cal

    That's pretty much how I saw that one Chassis Research one mounted on a 394. Cool car, it was in a little English Lloyd.
     
  24. The_Stig
    Joined: Nov 30, 2012
    Posts: 54

    The_Stig
    Member

    I only know if you can't:

    http://www.precisionenginetech.com/products/2009/11/13/trans-adapter-for-early-olds/

    [​IMG]
     
  25. mr50s
    Joined: Jul 26, 2009
    Posts: 59

    mr50s
    Member

    Hey All,

    Does anyone know anything about custom early Olds headers (for 303 and 324 cu. in engines) being sold by noxiouscustoms.com out of Minneapolis, Minnesota?

    Do they fit, how well are they made, and can you use them only on stock or only on modified installations? Anybody out there running them yet?

    mr50s
     
  26. I don't know anything about the noxious customs headers, but check out the slick headers Matt (SaltFlatMatt) has at GearDrive. Tight fit, super solid piece.

    Support a fellow Hamber!

    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1385951926.316009.jpg

    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1385951938.825306.jpg


    Sent from a typewriter.
     
  27. The_Stig
    Joined: Nov 30, 2012
    Posts: 54

    The_Stig
    Member

    Matt's headers look cool and flow gas certainly better than stock. However, equal-length tubes make the best headers. Anything short of that is a waste of time
     
  28. Koz
    Joined: May 5, 2008
    Posts: 2,315

    Koz
    Member

    Those headers are the nuts! Sort of feed my Sandy Belond fetish!

    I'm back working on my 324 for the roadster and amazingly my headers look very similar to the above. I know equal length is the way to go but Sandys' just have the look!
     
  29. nochop
    Joined: Nov 13, 2005
    Posts: 2,003

    nochop
    Member
    from norcal

    I'm interested in those as well for my coupe
     

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