The Jalopy Journal
Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by need louvers ?, Aug 14, 2013.
Nice looking top!
Looks bloody good Graham. Any pics of the bows you made?
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Is Fred MIA?
He hasn't been around since June!!
Graham, that looks the cats Whiskers.......maybe i need one. JW
Fred had some health problems , heart I think ....hasn't been on another forum he frequented...
do you like the look?
Might want to talk to Pete Eastwood about the steering....
i think he exaggerated his sample drawing to make his point. i don't dispute the facts but based on his sample, the car would have 12-14 inches of suspension travel and used a short radius arm and drag link. it's the poster child for bump steer. how many buggy spring set ups do you know with that much suspension travel? the shorter the arms, the more drastic the arc also. just to prove his point.
i know i'll experience some bump steer. i don't think it will be the kind of lane changing, baby killing ordeal that pete makes it out to be. there are plenty of notable builders with cowl steering who are getting along just fine. to this pete says they are in denial. if my cowl steering proves too dangerous to drive, i'll change it.
I think you'll get along with it or you won't , you really don't know how much or little it will affect you until your on the road so good luck . Mine has a bit of bumpsteer but with the limited suspension movement , I don't really notice it anymore .........
Broke his arm in May 2019....last post early June 2019.
Hope you are OK Fred and back on here soon, you are missed. JW
Well, it's been a long time since I updated. I'm still healing from my shoulder fracture, but I'm getting better. Got my engine put in this morning A HUGE thanks to Resinator at CCR All the measurements I bugged him about were spot on. The engine and trans dropped right into place. I'm so freaking stoked.
Welcome back, Fred. That's looking really sharp. Hope to see a Video of the test drive or at least start up in the fairly near future. JW
Hi Fred.Welcome back.Good to see your posts again.Not to mention your avatar.
Good luck.have fun.Be safe.
Glad to see you on here again. Nobody deserves that ride more than you.
Great to see you back at it and posting again Fred, you've been missed! Hope you heal up completely and soon!
Hi Fred; T is looking good.
Fred, glad to hear you’re healing up and able to make some progress on your T. Thanks for updating us.
Just another bump...
It's getting harder to find under 9K buckets, even unfinished with lots of 'ugly'
I did come across this one which is far from what is the thrust of this thread, but still interesting and might be useful to someone here.
1925 Model T - $3000 (Grand Prairie)
1925 Model T Complete Complete. $3000.00
I just picked up this new project. Anyone have an idea who might've built the chassis? Looks well constructed but the front spring perch is kind of unusual, it wraps around the front crossmember.
I don't have a photographic memory of all the different mfgrs, but I'll point out other items that might help narrow it down.
1. front hairpins, with a flat bracket welded to the outside of the frame (no 'folded' sides to triangulate, for these, the rear brackets, the trans and the motor mounts.) Earlier, less expensive design.
2. Coil spring pocket at rear of frame. This is often an older design, since coil-overs were more popular later and easier to make mounts for. Since the early makers already had the pattern and an inventory of pockets, they would hold out longer or offer the 'classic' design.
3. Vega steering, not Corvair. Obviously later than early 70s. Can't remember when this started being big on T's, but it must have been at least mid to late 70s if not later.
4. That trans cross member and the LONG drop downs on each side. Looks like a typical basic tube member that was added by the builder. Otherwise, it would have a deeper drop so it tied to the rails better.
5. Appears to have a hole at the left front of the frame (at the round cross member) typically used for a friction shock, which aligns with the extra tabs on the front of the axle. Also does not have a common tube shock/headlight mount welded on.
6. Often, the front of the frame rails wound around the tube cross member, creating a drop down. This one, the diameter of the front tube is the same as the rail height. I've seen it done both ways.
example of the smaller diameter tube
So overall, it doesn't ring any bells for a complete kit. I have a feeling it was either a 'basic frame' completed by a home builder or entirely home built. The vega box, trans crossmember with drop downs and rear coil pockets all kind of point to different times. Is there any indication that there was a corvair mount just in front of the firewall, or a box mount straight under the front floor where a vertical box might have been mounted at one time (suggesting an update in it's past)?
A Bird is kind of close, (coils, flat mounts) but the front cross member and vega box do not fit.
There have been many business builders of these frames over the years. It does not ring bells for the big guys now (Speedway - used to be Total Performance, Spirit Cars, Ron Pope, California Custom Roadsters) Sometimes the bodies had a business card 'glassed in when being formed. That might provide a clue, although again, my guess is a home builder who could have sourced parts from all sorts of suppliers. That molded, deep lipped dash is another ID for the body maker. I think it was a commonly copied design, like this current body builder
There was Specialty Cars in Ca. a guy in Phoenix that built for years, many of the race chassis guys would do them as needed, and many others. The 60s thru the early 80s were the heyday for these kits. Most folded after 1-5 years building. It's a thin margin business.
It appears that the maroon body was finished earlier than the Purple frame, again pointing toward a possible update. Could be two different components gathered to sell as a pair too, although the notch for the spring pocket looks pretty well matched in the pic.
The T bucket plans site has a bunch of info, but you have to search for it.
Speedway has a T bucket catalog that has a bunch of good info even if you don't buy any parts.
They also have a lot of youtube videos, like
Speedway Motors Guide to Selecting Spindles
so you can ID the spindles as early Ford, not Chevy.
and Speedway Motors Yellow T-Bucket Assembly
so you can see the components like the dash that are different than yours.
There is another forum just for these https://tbucketeer.com/ , but you are already on the best forum for old cars!
Try not to go too crazy
That is excellent information. Thank you for taking the time to write it!
Glad to help get another one out of hibernation and on the path to driving!
The firewall arch cut is also a clue to the build, but why it's so large, I have no clue.
Check for signs of how it was plumbed and wired, but it sure looks like it was on the road some, or maybe just mostly finished and left outside. The underside will show chips, road dirt and grease/oil from the drivetrain if driven much.
There doesn't appear to be any master cylinder mount on the frame under the floor or a spot on the firewall, another clue the chassis was updated. I'd personally try to get that trans cross member squared up unless it is a historic car that should be restored as-is.
I'd suggest getting the body out in the sun and taking pictures with it washed off and still wet (to mimic a good clear finish) and post those asking for any history. That paint is pretty unique, hopefully someone will remember it and be able to give you more info.
Did you get the rear axle, springs and hairpins? Are there any upholstery fragments left to help ID?
Can't tell from the pics if it has mounting holes for the windshield.
Just a little addendum , speedway motors was selling tbucket " kits" in the early 60's long before Mickey Lauria (total performance) built his first T , besides those mentioned, don't forget P.S.I. , Ford's obsolete , Andy Brizio, ( Andy's instant Ts) ,CalAutomotive , Ted Brown Chassis , S.P.E. . I'm forgetting some , also the guys who popped molds off other guys cars( thousands) , and anybody with a buzzbox building frames............ Point is , without documentation ( and even then it's not 100%) knowing where your bucket came from is sometimes impossible ! Just enjoy it !!
True, but Speedway really slowed down, then bought out Mickey, IIRC.
Mickey, as I recall, went to 'the next level' by providing Manufacturer's Statement of Origin (MSO's) for his kits, making it easier to get the paperwork done. Lots of places just sold the parts. You could get titles back then that would pass DMV, so it wasn't as tough as it is now.
There were more shops in the midwest, too. I remember seeing them and figuring that the cost of crating and shipping would be almost as much as the basic kit! So I would dream shop closer to home.
Yeah, why work up a complete new master when you can just pop a mold off the other guy's body!
That's why I mentioned the dash. It was one of the features that varied from body to body. Some had ribs or other unique features at the back of the tub too, but I didn't get to see enough of them to begin to ID that way. Most would have a complete back section, some notched a little or have flanges to fit the turtle deck or bed. Quite often the dash was a separate part to ease windshield fitting, allow different options and make the body making process easier. Lots of variations even with the same maker's line, from simple to high-end, and changes over the years.
There isn't a good single stop resource for the history of these, people were just building them! This thread is one of the better resources for early stuff, it's a shame it's not more documented. Guess I should pull out a few old mags and list ads. I don't have the deep libraries a lot of folks here do, but I can start.
Gonzo, we would love to see more pics and hear of your plans.
Florida Rod Shop in Crystal Beach/Palm Harbor Florida was building bodies,frames, parts etc also back in the '70's
BTW, Those screwdrivers used for kingpins won't work well!!!LOL
Thanks for all the replies, this is why the HAMB rules. Just for the record I'm not trying to imply that this car has any historical significance. My guess is that the chassis was never on the road for the same reason others have mentioned, there's no indication of brakes, wiring, fuel or exhaust ever being done.
The body on the other hand may have been, while there's currently no floor or bracing in it there is some evidence that maybe there was at some point but it would've had to have been cut out, possibly when an owner down the line decided to channel it. Either way it's a neat little body and I'm excited to own it.
As for the plan I'm currently thinking 55 Olds (which I already own and have used in the past), 700 R4, steel wheel with pie crusts, tall windshield with braces running down to the frame and 58 Chevy posi rear (that came with the project).
Here's a few more pictures.
Speedway gas never built there " kits" in house , they've always been a retailer , they contract out bodies , chassis, etc. , Total did the same , CCR still does much of their own except bodies , spirit is pretty much self- contained , RPM does some , buys and resells alot from speedway,
Gonzo , one thing that bothers me is that spring mount,. Most everyone I've seen has been gusseted , yours just doesn't appear strong enough , in one photo if appears to be bending ???
Anyone know where I can score a set of those single center bolt friction shocks? The ones I've found have two mounting bolts.
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