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Technical Suspension on my Model T

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Mario.g., Aug 29, 2019.

  1. Happydaze
    Joined: Aug 21, 2009
    Posts: 777

    Happydaze
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I wonder if the car was ever originally built with the intention of being actually driven.

    Looks to me that someone's been overly concentrating on the attention getting stuff, like chrome, without dealing with the basics like certain design and then execution issues (welding and finish thereof). Shame.

    Can we add the substantial absence of hairpin jamb / lock nuts, although comparatively minor to the other issues already mentioned?
    I feel for Mario g and hope he's not too overly committed into this that he's not able to put it right.

    Chris
     
  2. dreracecar
    Joined: Aug 27, 2009
    Posts: 2,799

    dreracecar
    Member
    from so-cal

    Your Akerman is all screwed up, the outside wheel in a turn is turning tighter (pinching/scrubbing) one quick look from the top looking down with the wheels at full lock will prove this. Ty-rod in front of the axle only makes this worse and with the disc brake setup, you cant get the ty-rod ends out any farther. From the centerline of the rear end out towards the center of the king pin with a string, the ty-rod end must be centered along that string either in front or behind that axle
     
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  3. joeyesmen
    Joined: Dec 24, 2010
    Posts: 434

    joeyesmen
    Member

    My T was built with 4 leaf springs across the front. It took bumps so hard, I would almost be ejected from the vehicle at higher speeds. So we removed one of the leaf springs -- now it has 3, and is much better over bumps. Also, running the front tires with less air (20-ish lbs) helps reduce the basketball effect.

    Simple test - place one foot on the front suspension, and should be able to create an inch or so of movement by putting your weight on it. With 4 leaf springs, mine would not budge. With 3, there is some travel up and down.
    [​IMG]

    Screen Shot 2019-08-30 at 3.50.46 PM.png

    Original set-up with 4 leaf springs - this was too rigid:
    Screen Shot 2019-08-30 at 3.57.49 PM.png
     
    irishsteve likes this.
  4. 2OLD2FAST
    Joined: Feb 3, 2010
    Posts: 1,617

    2OLD2FAST
    Member
    from illinois

  5. rustydusty
    Joined: Apr 19, 2010
    Posts: 999

    rustydusty
    Member

    Looks like his car was built as a "trailer queen" for shows, not as a "driver". Hopefully it can be re-engineered to work.
     
  6. 1946caddy
    Joined: Dec 18, 2013
    Posts: 1,475

    1946caddy
    Member
    from washington

  7. Andy
    Joined: Nov 17, 2002
    Posts: 4,447

    Andy
    Member

    That Speedway rig is an abomination. It is asking to fail. You never ever want a tube able with hairpins. I had a friend had a tube axle with split bones and he had to carry replacement perch pins. He was forever shearing them off.
     
    Ned Ludd likes this.
  8. pitman
    Joined: May 14, 2006
    Posts: 4,653

    pitman
    Member
    from Hampsha

    An old rodding bud had run ~ 16-18 psi in his T rears to get some quality of ride.
    (You can use chalk to put contact lines across the tread, check the 'footprint' contact, procede w/care in lowering psi.)
     
  9. proartguy
    Joined: Apr 13, 2009
    Posts: 341

    proartguy
    Member
    from Sparks, NV

    I agree with these comments. In addition I still stand by my comments on your other thread about the cooling issues. Unfortunately this is a vehicle constructed by someone without regard to proper engineering - but it looks cool, bought by a novice who wanted something that looked cool but did not know what he was buying.
     
    alanp561 and redo32 like this.
  10. irishsteve
    Joined: Jan 10, 2017
    Posts: 350

    irishsteve

    I agree with that.Back in the days of hardtail no shock absorber Harleys we ran 18 psi in the back tire.Saved on the kidneys.My modern bike runs 40psi,and the suspension provides the smooth.
     
  11. Mario.g.
    Joined: Jun 27, 2019
    Posts: 75

    Mario.g.

  12. Mario.g.
    Joined: Jun 27, 2019
    Posts: 75

    Mario.g.

    20190831_015212.jpg 20190831_015412.jpg 20190831_015540.jpg 20190831_015932.jpg
     

    Attached Files:

  13. Find someone who knows how to build a car either work with you to teach you or to just fix it. This is a hard project for someone with zero experience or knowledge of this stuff


    Sent from my iPhone using H.A.M.B.
     
    gimpyshotrods likes this.
  14. Mario.g.
    Joined: Jun 27, 2019
    Posts: 75

    Mario.g.

  15. 20190831_014805.jpg

    Did you happen to get any extra loose parts, with this front spring area ... at all ? Is there a reason, or did you know that it's disassembled a little ? Like attaching it to the suicide perch ...
     
    Tim_with_a_T and jaw22w like this.
  16. fastcar1953
    Joined: Oct 23, 2009
    Posts: 1,610

    fastcar1953
    Member

    some of the hairpins are missing jambnuts. rear hairpins probably wont last long. watch the welds for cracking.
     
  17. When was the last time anything that's supposed to move got any lube? Not one of them we can see has any sign of grease or oil witch attracts dirt. Dirt's missing buddy, big give away. And ya, you really want jamb nuts on every fastener that threads into a piece of tubing that adjusts moving parts. I have seen the threads pulled right out of the tube from constant thrust and braking without the Jamb nuts. You probably should do a little inspecting of things before just adding the nuts.
     
  18. This is the 45 degrees your shackle should look like, circled on rear as an example and two red dots on front. It's hard to find a photo of mine showing it since it's not normally something you take photos of. 20190902_012029.jpg 20190902_012126.jpg Screenshot_20190902-011807_Gallery.jpg
    Screenshot_20190902-011934_Gallery.jpg
     
  19. Please note proper Jamb nuts on all points on swade41's hairpins as well as his Heim Joints.
     
    swade41 likes this.
  20. raven
    Joined: Aug 19, 2002
    Posts: 4,195

    raven
    Member

    Why is there a gap between the front main leaf and the other six leaves?
    r


    Sent from my iPhone using H.A.M.B.
     
    kidcampbell71 likes this.
  21. It doesn’t look like there is a center bolt in the front spring...this car is a cluster fuck...


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    Blue One likes this.
  22. Blue One
    Joined: Feb 6, 2010
    Posts: 9,722

    Blue One
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Alberta

    And on top of that no u bolts holding the spring to the perch :eek:
     
  23. redo32
    Joined: Jul 16, 2008
    Posts: 1,468

    redo32
    Member

    On the first series of pictures there is a pinstriped cover over the suicide spring perch and you can see the u bolt peeking out. He is obviously taking things apart.
     
    jimgoetz, swade41 and Pist-n-Broke like this.
  24. Come on guys, give him just a little credit here for at least knowing his car has issues and he's asking for help. Had he actually driven the car without the spring fastened in place there would be a totally different problem, probably more than one.
     
    jimgoetz, swade41 and Cosmo50 like this.
  25. 2OLD2FAST
    Joined: Feb 3, 2010
    Posts: 1,617

    2OLD2FAST
    Member
    from illinois

    Also note the insufficient stud length on the spring pivot ( does not extend through the self locking part of the nut) and the lack of a sufficient diameter,/ thickness safety washer on the right spherical rod end. And I honestly don't understand how the rear shocks function at all .....??
     
  26. Your right...clearly he has it under control.


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    Blue One likes this.
  27. It's amazing it's been on the road for 12 yrs now without issues from Canada to Missouri, the stud only comes in one size, I ordered from 2 different companies and both were the same, maybe the off the shelf bracket is to thick, must be it, I should of just used 1/8 inch instead. As far as lack of sufficient size or thickness of washer on the right heim, how about opening your freaking eyes, that's the steering arm on top, do you think the center of the heim is going to fall through that ??? On the bottom it certainly has a big enough washer and locking nut, good grief man.
     
  28. Torana68
    Joined: Jan 28, 2008
    Posts: 1,078

    Torana68
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Australia

    Don’t spose someone would offer to drop and help the guy out? Must be someone near by .....
    My 5c focus on one end and get that sorted then move on to the other shiny end.
     
    kidcampbell71 likes this.
  29. Third DodgeBrother
    Joined: Apr 18, 2009
    Posts: 180

    Third DodgeBrother
    Member

    Springs are fairly cheap. My first step would be to scale the front and rear axle, carry a tape measure to the car, then call the guys at Posies. They'll solve your problems with length and spring rate. Shocks can then be sized and matched to the spring.

    I'm not fond of tie rods in front of the axle, but half of the buckets you see have them. They work. Correcting Ackerman will cost you a pair of steering arms and a longer tie rod. I'm not sure that will have an effect on ride, but handling and tire wear will improve. With all the metal to metal contact in your set up, noise harshness and vibration are a given!

    Shock angle. The outside end of the axle will pivot upwards around the inside tire contact patch. The shocks, ideally, should be mounted at right angles to this movement. This usually has the shock canted inboard ten to twenty degrees. Additional angle decreases the effective rating of the shock. It's hard to see how a shock could be stout enough to work at the angles on EAZ-4217! Put a tie wrap around the bottom of each shock shaft. A hard drive then measures the movement of each, and assures the shock shock is not bottoming out.
     
  30. 2OLD2FAST
    Joined: Feb 3, 2010
    Posts: 1,617

    2OLD2FAST
    Member
    from illinois

    AFA the stud length , you don't have a way to weld a tube to a bolt ????
    AFA a safety washer. , I can't see it
    AFA the shocks , no comment ???
    AFA 12 years , some folks are lucky ....
     

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