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Technical Strategy for hammer and dolley

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by lewk, Oct 26, 2024.

  1. lewk
    Joined: Apr 8, 2011
    Posts: 1,040

    lewk
    Member
    from Mt

    Help me with a strategy on where to start banging on this 1960 Chevy fender. I’ve read The Key to Metal Bumping and understand last in first out. I know it’s all being held by the crease. Do I work the crease or the soft low stuff leading to the crease? I started with the soft low stuff on a different fender and now have oil canning.

    IMG_4135.jpeg IMG_4132.jpeg IMG_4131.jpeg IMG_4133.jpeg IMG_4134.jpeg

    I think someone put a ratchet strap around the front clip and crushed the fenders.
     
  2. Turns
    Joined: Jan 3, 2009
    Posts: 109

    Turns
    Member

    I am fortunate to have learnt form some highly talented metal guys.

    The most pivotal fundamental shaping metal for me was understanding 'shrinking & stretching'. That is what I think of predominantly. The rest is skill, technique, practice, having the right tools etc
     
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  3. rockable
    Joined: Dec 21, 2009
    Posts: 4,695

    rockable
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Well, that sucks. I think you're going to have to use some force to push that inward dent (crease) out and then you can start working on the creases from shallow to deep. Since it's not on a car and you can't use a Porta power, I would use a block of tapered wood and a BFH to knock the deep part out. Nothing else is going to move until you unlock that. Just try to not add additional stretching. YMMV.
     
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  4. scotts52
    Joined: Apr 7, 2008
    Posts: 2,771

    scotts52
    Member

    If you are comfortable with welding, I'd slice that crease right down the middle. Work both adjacent sides, then weld it up. That looks like it stretched things. Now you not only have the debt fighting you, but also extra metal.
     
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  5. Wanderlust
    Joined: Oct 27, 2019
    Posts: 890

    Wanderlust

    I second cutting the body line through the crease, much easier to work out the rest and weld will shrink some of the inevitable stretch
     
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  6. rockable
    Joined: Dec 21, 2009
    Posts: 4,695

    rockable
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Personally, I would not start by cutting it. If you have any stretch, you can always heat shrink it out with a torch or shrinking disc. Those look like nice parts. Keep them that way. Go slowly and don't hammer on dolly and create further stretching. Put a sandbag under it and work it out from the backside against the sandbag.
     
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  7. Ive become a big fan of starting by pushing out the dent with a jack and a shaped wooden block if you have access inside the car. I had a tree limb fall on one car's roof and I used a floor jack and a 4x4 with a rounded end to get most of it out before hammers were even deployed. A hydraulic press could possibly work for smaller parts off the car. But I know you have the car in the shed, so start by bolting it on the car, take the wheel off for access, and see if you can push in the opposite direction it was formed. You may have to tap from the top if/once the car starts to lift off the ground. Once it is mostly out then use hammers and dolly but avoid the ringing bell sound as that is the sound of stretching which leads to the oil canning, then when it is close one can employ slapping spoons with a dolly and a bulleye pick to refine if you want it no filler perfect.

    This guys early videos from about two years ago are more how to and full of great tips for working dents and cracks with simple hand tools (later videos are more "watch me work" style): https://www.youtube.com/@CarterAutoRestyling/videos
     
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  8. alchemy
    Joined: Sep 27, 2002
    Posts: 21,488

    alchemy
    Member

    Fix the rough shape first before you worry about fine tuning the small stuff.

    I’d turn it upside down and cradle the outer edges of the dent between wood blocks. Then use another strong wood block as a chisel and hammer it down into the ridge to begin pushing the ridge out where it belongs. Hopefully the cradle will take the force of the hammering and keep the unaffected parts of the fender safe. And hopefully the wood chisel will not stretch the bent portion any more than it is.
     
  9. RodStRace
    Joined: Dec 7, 2007
    Posts: 5,617

    RodStRace
    Member

    I agree that pushing the deep part out would be the start, while stopping during this at times to work the high edges of the crease down. A thousand words would just be an overview of trying to explain the process. I suggest watching good metal shapers and seeing how it's done.
    Kyle at www.youtube.com/@CarterAutoRestyling/videos does some pretty great stuff using minimal tools but as he shows, it takes talent, knowledge and 'feel' to know how and where to bang. You can search for other videos and find the person who makes the most sense to you.
     
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  10. lewk
    Joined: Apr 8, 2011
    Posts: 1,040

    lewk
    Member
    from Mt

    Thanks for the ideas. It had never occurred to me to cut. I think I’m going to push it out with wood and try cutting as a second option.
     
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  11. 49ratfink
    Joined: Feb 8, 2004
    Posts: 19,257

    49ratfink
    Member
    from California

    I'd pop that out using a piece of steel plate maybe 3/8 thick, 3-4 inches wide/square and a hammer.
    I'd round the edge of the plate with my grinder.
    lay the fender in the dirt and pop it out from the inside.
    once that is back in shape the other parts will fall back much closer to where they are supposed to be.
    then use standard hammer & dolly techniques to get the rest.
    it MAY still need a slice to get it to go where it belongs.
    that repair is much simpler than it would first appear

    you should read the key To Metal Bumping more than once
     
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  12. Hutkikz
    Joined: Oct 15, 2011
    Posts: 170

    Hutkikz
    Member

    Mount the fender on the car.
    Apply generous pressure to back side of the deepest dent.
    Gently tap the the high spots around the outside edges of damaged area.
    it will magically slowly unfold in the reverse of how it was dented.
     
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  13. Wack or push this area out first
    IMG_2634.jpeg
    I’d wack it with a block of wood and hammer.
    This old metal is EZ to work. It’s gonna stretch in a place or 2.
    No reason to cut with access from behind
    Or bolt it back on and push from the inside
    It’s just metal. You can break glass. You won’t break this fender
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2024
  14. Hammer (mostly a ball peen) dollys, torch, and a shrink disc.
    IMG_2635.jpeg IMG_2636.jpeg IMG_2637.jpeg IMG_2638.jpeg
     
  15. lewk
    Joined: Apr 8, 2011
    Posts: 1,040

    lewk
    Member
    from Mt

    Pushing out the crease has already made a huge difference.

    IMG_4158.jpeg

    Thanks again for the input
     
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  16. Mr48chev
    Joined: Dec 28, 2007
    Posts: 34,896

    Mr48chev
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Follow what Anthony says to do, he is the guy who teaches kids how to do body work.
     
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  17. Kids is the key word. :):)
     
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  18. ronzmtrwrx
    Joined: Sep 9, 2008
    Posts: 1,284

    ronzmtrwrx
    Member

    Yes. And he also has experience in a high end shop, so he knows what he's talking about.
     
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  19. ronzmtrwrx
    Joined: Sep 9, 2008
    Posts: 1,284

    ronzmtrwrx
    Member

    And arent we all just a bunch of big kids? :D
     
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  20. ronzmtrwrx
    Joined: Sep 9, 2008
    Posts: 1,284

    ronzmtrwrx
    Member

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  21. rockable
    Joined: Dec 21, 2009
    Posts: 4,695

    rockable
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    You're over halfway home, now.
     
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  22. lewk
    Joined: Apr 8, 2011
    Posts: 1,040

    lewk
    Member
    from Mt

    Thanks again for the advice. I didn’t want to start banging on the wrong spot. I got it roughed in and then got rained out. It’ll probably be next weekend before I can mess it again. I feel like I’m off to a pretty good start.

    IMG_4168.jpeg IMG_4169.jpeg IMG_4170.jpeg
     
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  23. RodStRace
    Joined: Dec 7, 2007
    Posts: 5,617

    RodStRace
    Member

    Really glad you got it moving in the right direction!
    The 'cut it' guys scare me. Fully finishing a weld is harder than just working the metal for most.
     
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  24. rockable
    Joined: Dec 21, 2009
    Posts: 4,695

    rockable
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    You are way ahead of the game.
     
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