The Jalopy Journal
Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Outback, May 1, 2006.
How about these?
looks like a home spun F-head OHV conversion for a model A... the machine works looks killer, but why did you go with such tall lifter towers?
last time i went down to Crowers shop, he was building an OHV conversion in a very similar manner.
i actually get to post some bangin news: i am going to leave work early today and pull the rad off of the T and start installing a new distributor. THen i am taking the seats to an upholstry shop. finally.
To fit beneath the tall rocker covers...
These are the first production run of these by a company called Belcher Engineering, run by Gary Miller out here in the corner of the UK. Using no drawings, the F head has been designed step by step on the mill!
Machined in two sections and glued together creates the waterways, final porting done by hand.
Currently underway are cast rocker covers and manifolds. And maybe a name... any suggestions?
These are the guys doing this - I was doing nothing more than some wishful passing by with a camera...
I forgot you had them pictures.
4 in, 4 out crossflow. Nice!
And - just to prove it all works, here the prototype head which has had regular, almost daily use. Look Clark - SU's!!
hmmm...belcher engineering...to bad "frickin overhead" is already taken.
i will be interested to hear how it runs. way to expensive for over here as the exchange rate sucks ass in our direction.
Wow...they look great. A homegrown 4-port!
Any figures for them? Price or hp?
Not sure. I reckon it's grab a comfy chair, take a deep breath and give 'em a call. Go on, y'know you want to...
ok, i have all the requisite items and performed the necessary steps...so what'll she do?
itty bitty banger news- new oil pump in prep for the rebuild- old one was cracked near the dist gear.. T-minus -very soon- on the rebuild- will keep all posted. Great stuff this month at "The Meet"...
Wow!! Nice looking heads, so when you say "glue" what would the substance that is being used?? Loctite or similar??
As for the F head what are the figures on them, are they worth the extra expence over a full ohv??
I have some half finished patterns for an F head, however was wondering how worth while is the performance increase??
I'm really just a newbie in the banger world, I know it might be considered sacrilage questioning the 4 port, which includes the Riley however I'm a little interested in people opions....
Some good stuff here!
Well - didn't have time to stay long and ask all the right questions last night, I'll find some more out today if you like. Suffice to say, with my shallow pockets, and stock A bottom end, don't think I'll be getting one of these any time soon.
I think they're doing 6 production heads at the moment. I'm thinking they won't know the full price until all the manifolds and rocker covers are cast. Only guessing though - drop 'em a line.
I know they put the prototype engine on a brake before installing it. I'll try and get figures later. Must have been worth it to build some more though...
Are you saying they put the engine on a Dyno?
I certainly don't have the cash to buy one, but I guess I'm jus interested, they are a mighty fine lookin bit of work,
Yes - dyno, showing my age, water brakes indeed...
Actually, the engine they had on the dyno, was the last one they built with a Riley 2-port. Andrew at Belcher's who runs the prototype head on his A reckons it easily gives the same power as the Riley head, and probably more.
Pricing should be very competitive with the Riley head I'm led to believe.
They were getting some pretty crappy figures from the 2 Port.
102, should have been more like 130-150 bhp.
Maybe - but comparing the 102 to the 86 from their Thomas headed engine is a fair percentage increase!
The dyno is run by Randell's, quite respected engine builders themselves amongst the competition fraternity, and normally realistic figures. You can't really compare 2 different dyno's but the Belcher results with a Thomas head aren't far from those by Ron Kelley.
That much from a 2-port? Are those Charlie Yapp's figures?
I'd be interested to hear what HAMBer '4-Port Riley' gets from his.
I wasn't doubting the dyno, was just expressing an opinion that 102 BHP wasn't that impressive from a OHV.
I wouldn't call a 16 BHP jump by going from a flathead to an OHV a good percentage!
I got a 10 BHP increase just by tweaking the jets on the rollers!
I was only 2 brake down on their figures of the OHV with a mild flathead (Head, Carbs, Header).
There has been a few independent dyno runs of the 2 Port. One guy in Australia had 150 BHP, the average seems to be around the 130 mark.
Then again Charlie Yapp quotes from 80 BHP upwards. 80!
Some banger stuff turned up recently:
For Model A carbs, you generally need a 13/32" socket to break loose the gas adjusting valve; this seems to be a problem to find, and people are grinding open ends or trying nearly-right metric godless communist wrenches.
I've been using Snap-Ons of truly ancient origin, probably discontinued long before I was born, but I just noticed I had a Mac deep 6 point 13/32 that is perfect for the valve AND seems to be new--it looks current and is clean and shiny. Corner your Mac man and see if he can produce a "M13L" socket. Please report back here if you find out its status!
While you have the Mac man's attention, try him on SC2 (excellent quality 97 jet wrench, just maybe...I got one from them a few years back) and SC8.
The SC8, I am guessing, is a double double-D wrench likely for 1980's computer carbs, but it is a perfect fit for both early and late Trico wiper motor nuts! SC1 is a nifty handle for small carb tools, and has a split screwdriver end for those funny Ford coil nuts...
Please let the crowd here know if any of these are still available...
Carb news: I was reading Vince's excellent banger site, here on one of the carb pages: http://idisk.mac.com/forever4/Public/pages/zenithBcarb.htm
Slide down to the flow chart...
I believed that some of my Zeniths looked like the Model B variant made as Model A replacement, so I made up a simple gauge for 20 and 22 MM venturis to check out the heap of Zenith scrapiron. 22 was for model B, 20 for necked-down B intended for A use.
The first open carb I grabbed was an industrial B variant of unknown application...my gauge dropped right through and hit the floor...
It was a 26MM B venturi, the biggest shown in the chart! The chart shows venturis from 16 to 26 for this carb. Somewhere out there, some poor bastard has a 16 and is wondering why his Model A has a top speed of 35 after he spent all that money for a B carb...but I have the top secret big one, the hot setup for cheating in XX stock class...just thought this was an interesting find.
Literary discovery: I haven't found any ancient goodies lately, so I sent off all my money to a resto parts place for some currently available books.
Carb stuff: Lots on A and B Zeniths, some info on Tillotsons.
Model A Carburetor BC-1
Zenith Carburetor Rebuilding BC-1A
Zenith Carb Restoration Guidelines BC-3
These are three current books: The first is an older manual that is a cheap and useful mechani's guide.
The second is MUCH bigger, with lots of detail photos, tool tips, etc. Magnificent, heavy B coverage.
The third is really for resorers, a good solid book with great detail on the many little production A variations and wht they belong on for the 100 point resto. All are damn fine reading.
I got mine from Snyder's, probably all your favorite resto places have them.
Also bought a so-so book on A engine rebuilding, one on generators and starters, AND found my old Dyke's encyclopedia fold out chart on model A stuff--that one is available in repro too.
T progess...no pictures cause the flash went dead on the camera.
Pulled the radiator to put a new distributor on. The engine is a '17 so finding a distributor that fits is hard and sure enough my spare doesn't fit.
So i either have to buy a new aftermarket one or...today sucked.
I striped the '26 Chev 4 down to use as a dummy block. Dis-membered a '30 Chev chassis to use. In the next couple of weeks I will hopefully have my 1/4 panels which are on a slow boat from the US. Lastly I need to buy some RHS this week to build a chassis Jig.
Some mock-up pics.
whippet radiator shells = the duece shell for speedsters! (i got one too)
Whippet radiator shells are an awesome design, I like them more than the Deuce shell.
This is the car I'm basing my project on, Giovanine/Spurgin '25 Chev Roadster
i like the three piece hood. i have a whippet that i am going to use on my speedster. though with a few modications.
maaaan! that thing is dead sexy!!!
update....fur biscuit and i talked trash,hit switches,and ate ice cream.then i finished tacking my exhaust together.
I bear witness to the glorious luster which nate's newly polished head and side cover cast out towards the darkness of the evil billet clad roadster utility vehicles
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