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Hot Rods Spalding Bros Repro, for "Too Tall" Ganahl.

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Marty Strode, Jul 13, 2015.

  1. Gofannon
    Joined: Feb 8, 2007
    Posts: 566

    Gofannon
    Member

    Very cool looking trans. According to this post: http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/x-shift-aluminum-trans-case.223047/ you can build one up from original Chevy parts, although with iron case (37 - 47 truck??). There was a late 50's close ratio gear set, I think used behind 348's, that should go in. It could be an interesting trans for any stovebolt powered track roadster. A poor man's in/out box.
    [​IMG]
     
  2. Gofannon
    Joined: Feb 8, 2007
    Posts: 566

    Gofannon
    Member

    While we're waiting for an update from Marty, here's a couple of quick change in/out boxes, with a stovebolt flavour. First one is Stelling, can anyone ID the one in the Wayne catalog?

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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  3. Marty Strode
    Joined: Apr 28, 2011
    Posts: 5,013

    Marty Strode
    Member

    Mike, Could it be a "Bell", I think Roy made gearboxes.
     
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  4. Marty Strode
    Joined: Apr 28, 2011
    Posts: 5,013

    Marty Strode
    Member

    My old pal Rosie, drove a pretty decent "Stovebolt" powered roadster ! 2012-07-03 170819.jpg
     
  5. Marty Strode
    Joined: Apr 28, 2011
    Posts: 5,013

    Marty Strode
    Member

    Well, I built a fixture to mock-up the rear axle location, using one of the sprint car axles we have. With a 750-16 tire, it helps to sort out the wheelbase proportions and final axle width. Our resident quickchange expert Bruce, and I have been in communication on rear axle bearings and methods. The body will be going on soon. IMG_5815.JPG IMG_5816.JPG IMG_5817.JPG
     
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  6. Marty Strode
    Joined: Apr 28, 2011
    Posts: 5,013

    Marty Strode
    Member

    I moved the engine ahead a couple of inches, and had some help today, so we set the body on. It all preliminary, but I think the rear axle needs to be moved forward at least an inch, that will require trimming the back of the frame rails. The body will need some stiffening and replace the RH door with a flat skin, like the original, before the permanent body mounts will be installed. More updates to come. IMG_5818.JPG IMG_5820.JPG IMG_5822.JPG IMG_5824.JPG
     
  7. Gofannon
    Joined: Feb 8, 2007
    Posts: 566

    Gofannon
    Member

    I never noticed that RH skin before. I've made new door skins for my 27 T and I'll assure you they are anything but flat. I'd wheel some up for you if I wasn't so far away, that and I've just got out of surgery for a hernia. Wife dropped me off at hospital at 7.00am, home by 1.00pm, it's now 1.40 pm. Looking forward to lots of HAMB time this coming week, so make lots of progress please Marty!
     
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  8. vintageracer37
    Joined: Sep 22, 2008
    Posts: 102

    vintageracer37
    Member

    Love Love Love this thread!!! OK, dumb question (I haven't seen this covered). What happened to the original car ? I can't imagine something that nice being scrapped. Just wondering.

    Nice work Marty!
     
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  9. woodbutcher
    Joined: Apr 25, 2012
    Posts: 3,211

    woodbutcher
    Member

    :D I`m in.Looks like another fun build from the H.A.M.B. family.
    Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
    Leo
     
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  10. Marty Strode
    Joined: Apr 28, 2011
    Posts: 5,013

    Marty Strode
    Member

    Mike, I had planned on wheeling out one, when I used the term "flat", I meant without the bead surround. Get well and stay tuned, we appreciate your advice.
     
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  11. Marty Strode
    Joined: Apr 28, 2011
    Posts: 5,013

    Marty Strode
    Member

    No one seems to know what happened to the original. Thanks for the kind words.
     
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  12. Happy to hear you are smoothing over the door opening as per the original.

    Marty has anyone to your knowledge tried tracking down Harold White? He worked for Ray Brown so maybe people who knew Ray may know something about the roadster or him. Also there are a couple of Harold White's living in the same area of LA, one 93 the other 83 which is the age range I would expect him to be now
     
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  13. 22 track
    Joined: Mar 23, 2001
    Posts: 314

    22 track
    Member

    From memory, Rod and Custom did a story on the Spalding car in their January 1973 issue on track roadsters, which included interviewing Spalding about several aspects, including the "cheater" frame. (Under the rules it was supposed to have a stock frame, but they built a new one to look like a stock frame because they thought it would be stronger.) When asked if he would like to find it and rebuild it for the street, Spalding said "no". According to Spalding, the car was just an old race car and was parted out, the body going to one buyer, the head to another, etc. So it no longer existed in any form to buy back. I no longer have this issue to verify all this, but I think it is correct.
     
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  14. It would be interesting to know if the Spaldings meant they sold the car minus engine as its known the White bros ran the car at the drags in 1952 running a flathead Ford under Ray Brown Automotive sponsorship.
     
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  15. ago
    Joined: Oct 12, 2005
    Posts: 2,200

    ago
    Member
    from pgh. pa.

  16. 29AVEE8
    Joined: Jun 28, 2008
    Posts: 1,384

    29AVEE8
    Member

    The interview with Tom Spalding is in the Jan.1973 R&C. He indicates the engine went to an Ohio sprint car, the rear end to Nebraska, the steering gear and shocks were sold through Bell Auto Parts, and the body frame and shell were sold to "some fellow who put a flathead in it and ran it at the drags." "That's the last I ever saw of it."
     
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  17. pgan
    Joined: Apr 7, 2009
    Posts: 212

    pgan
    Member

    In answer to people asking what became of the Spalding car:

    The Spalding Bros. began lakes racing with a few different, creative cars. This, their 2nd Wayne Chevy, torsion-bar track-nose T (built with help from Johnny Hartman), started running at El Mirage, then went to the first Bonneville in '49, where they loaned their head (or whole engine) to Marvin Lee's City of Pasadena 'liner.

    When they started circle track racing it as the orange #43 in late '49/1950, this advanced-design T was nearly unbeatable, and I was always told (by old-timers) it was "The car that killed track roadsters." The truth (as stated by Tom S. in one of his interviews) was that roadster racing was already dying by then. Purse-paying races were few. So the car raced maybe 6 times in 1950. It was advertised for sale (no price) in the Aug. '50 HRM, didn't sell, so ran a few more times in '51. Tom also stated it "fell apart" in one long AZ race, and "got upside down" in an unavoidable wreck in another and had to be "straightened out."

    I think I have collected everything that has ever been printed on the Spalding cars (including SCTA programs and 12-Port News). When I interviewed Bill Spalding in '08 or '09, he gave me a copy of his typed, 125-page autobiography and family history. It devotes only one short paragraph to this car, talking mostly about how the gas tank straps broke on the "rough track" in Phoenix "when it was about to lap the field," but won its next five races. He ends with: "Because there was little money made in roadster events and a good chance of big problems, Tom parted the car."

    Well, thanks to a couple photos we have, plus the new great ones posted here by Gofannon, we know that the orange 43 car remained intact. If the Wayne Chevy was sold to someone in Ohio, we have no trace. If the open-tube Pat Warren Q.C. was sold, it was replaced by some other Q.C., as seen in one Gofannon photo at Pomona drags (what's the year on the license tag on that '40s Ford at right? I guess '52). I don't know who the "White Bros." were, but we know a flathead V8 went in the car, presumably with a trans/clutch.

    I was trying to read the lettering on the hood in that great color Gofannon profile photo. I've just realized it says "Ray Brown Automotive." Note it still has the dirt shaker in front of the grille. I think Ray said they track-raced it a few times before they started drags. Is that the White Bros. house? Whose trophies? But in the Pomona drags shots, the Ray Brown lettering is on the hood, the screen is gone, and so is the pipe up the right side.

    I recently found another photo of the car in a rods & tats mag called RebelRodz showing the car in the drag form, but with the aluminum hood stripped bare, and with dark streaks coming out of the louvers, as if it had just had a serious engine fire (and probably another before this). I would post this photo, but can't figure how, yet. Sorry (somebody give me a clue).

    Most track T's were converted to sprint car bodies. This one went to the drags for about a year that we know. Then what? It'd be fun to find out. But I figure the body became a new Toyota long ago.
    I'm more interested in building the duplicate.

    The one part I'd dearly like to find is the cast aluminum Ingles grille. I only know of four Art Ingles noses, and only remaining one is on the Barney Navarro car. Dick Kraft's blue car is long gone. I know who has the Wes Cooper car, but it's also missing the nose/grille. So that's at least three cast Ingles grilles possibly out there somewhere. It's unique. Anybody seen one? We've discussed a few hi-tech ways to reproduce one (Cad-Cam imaging, 3-D printing, etc.), but I'll very likely have Dennis Webb hand-fabricate one when he's making the nose.

    The only other part I'd love to find is a good, usable Spalding Chev 6 ignition (or even just the S-W tach drive adapter). Plus I'll have to find all those early S-W gauges they had in the dash--yikes.
    I do have an extra Pat Warren open-tube quickchange that Richard Munz donated to the project that turned out to be Model A instead of V8 (all I could use were the brake drums). It's available for sale or trade.

    That's it for now. Plenty more to come. Thanks for all your interest and some great photos.

    Pat Ganahl
     
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  18. Gofannon
    Joined: Feb 8, 2007
    Posts: 566

    Gofannon
    Member

    Pat, do you know anything of the Spalding's other cars? First, the GMC powered T roadster, which looks like the body may have ended up on Hartman's car??? And then what looks to be an inline powered A roadster that I have labelled as being Tom's. Note the "SS" on the nerf bar (Spalding Special??). This is not the same A roadster that had the Riley V8, which I think still exists in it's entirety.

    [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
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  19. Gofannon
    Joined: Feb 8, 2007
    Posts: 566

    Gofannon
    Member

    Here's what Pat is looking for:
    Spalding Ignition
    [​IMG]

    Stewart Warner Tach Drive (under the Mallory distributor)
    [​IMG]
     
  20. This is Jim Shores roadster. That's "Fireball" in the white coveralls. Brian "The mailman" Bauer now owns it.

    [​IMG]
     
  21. Stovebolt
    Joined: May 2, 2001
    Posts: 3,305

    Stovebolt
    Member

    So that's the postie's car from back in the day.

    Been a fan of it in it's present form for many years - but very interested in seeing it in its original form - seeing that it ran a 216" stovebolt 6 up to an early Ford drivetrain.

    Thanks for identifying this car Dean
     
  22. Gofannon
    Joined: Feb 8, 2007
    Posts: 566

    Gofannon
    Member

    Thanks Dean. Great to know it's another survivor.
     
  23. Pat, great info and insight why the roadster raced so few times.

    The Wes Cooper/Bob Hayes roadster still exists, wow! That bit of info I like the most.
     
  24. Just read through the whole thread and subscribed, I love cars being recreated and this was such a Hi Tech car for the time it's got to be a winner.

    Harley
     
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  25. D.N.D.
    Joined: Aug 15, 2012
    Posts: 1,385

    D.N.D.
    Member Emeritus

    Hi Marty

    Are those ' Meat Cleavers ' hanging up there in your shop, good golly miss Molly that's a lot of steel
     
  26. Stovebolt
    Joined: May 2, 2001
    Posts: 3,305

    Stovebolt
    Member

    And here it is now - sorry to run this way off topic, but I figure it's important to acknowledge hot rods from the past, wherever they turn up
    LARS_2012 176.JPG
     
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  27. 0NE BAD 51 MERC
    Joined: Nov 12, 2010
    Posts: 1,303

    0NE BAD 51 MERC
    Member

    I will be watching this with great interest . Anything Pat Ganahl is involved in is going to be great. I owe my car builders life to Pat! Back in the late eighties I had all but crossed over to the dark side building late model pro streets and slammed pickup trucks. But on a rare occasion when I went shopping with the wife , I happen past the magazine rack and low and behold a long lost friend from my child hood stare back at me [Pats 1st issue of the rebirth of Rod and Custom] and I have been a devout rod and custom guy ever since!!!! THANKS PAT!!! [ broke may heart when they shut her down again, and to ad insult to heart break they filled the rest of my subscription with Motor Trend! May they rot in H--------------ll ] Larry
     
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  28. Rockerhead
    Joined: Nov 16, 2006
    Posts: 321

    Rockerhead
    Member Emeritus

    I have enjoyed looking at this thread and it is nice to see the effort to recreate this roadster. It was certainly one of the neatest track roadsters of that time.
    Attached is a photo I took at Saugus in early 1952. It shows the White Bros. roadster on the north side of the track, when the roadster ran with the Ray Brown name on the hood. The photo shows that they were running it at that time. I also added the photo of my Cord to show that I was racing there that day which dates the first photo. Both phots look north from the pit side of the airstrip. Don
    img162.jpg img163.jpg img162.jpg
     
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  29. Marty Strode
    Joined: Apr 28, 2011
    Posts: 5,013

    Marty Strode
    Member

    Thanks for posting Don, every picture we can find will be helpful in getting this as correct as possible. It's also great to see the Olds and Merc in the shot as well. I have a 50 Olds coupe, but it keeps getting back burner status, maybe I can find the time, when we get this one done. Pretty slick looking Cord ! 2012-09-28 091022.jpg
     
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  30. Rockerhead
    Joined: Nov 16, 2006
    Posts: 321

    Rockerhead
    Member Emeritus

    img165.jpg img164.jpg Since you mention '50 Olds 88 I thought I would show more from that day at the Saugus drags.
    My daily driver, and tow car, was a '50 Olds 88 sedanet with factory manual shift (they used Cadillac transmissions). It was a great car (I would love to have it back). It is pictured here hooked up to the Cord. Attached also is a picture of the Buick engine in the Cord that day.
    I had just built the Cord in March of 1952. I ran it at Saugus 3 times in March and once in April. In May the Cord was lettered for the Lakes with my Russetta number. So this dates the ex-Spalding roadster photo as either March or April of 1952.
    I am looking forward to see your progress on the re-creation of the Spalding roadster.

    Trivia note: Tom Spalding ground a cam for my Hudson in 1948. Hudson engines were different because they used a radius tappet. However in 1949 the Hudson engine expired and the Hudson sedan received a big Buick transplant.
    Don
     

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