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Technical Small cubic inch screamer

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by crowman, Jun 12, 2014.

  1. drtrcrV-8
    Joined: Jan 6, 2013
    Posts: 1,498

    drtrcrV-8
    Member

    NOW, Just to stir the pot :For a "small" v-8 ; why not start with a 215" Buick/Olds(or one of their Range-Rover 'children')? with careful selection of parts(& years of production) it'd be reasonable to get close to your cu" numbers with an extremely light motor. In roughly '64 Racer Brown built a 215" Buick w/Olds pistons(10:1 CR due to chamber shape), one of his cams & kits, & 4bbl carb that dyno'd 230+HP @ 6000 on gas, so with today's 'tech' advances HP shouldn't be a problem, & it certainly would get the "What-the-Hell-is-That"? when you 'popped' your hood! LOL
     
    volvobrynk likes this.
  2. Dawai
    Joined: Oct 1, 2007
    Posts: 263

    Dawai
    Member
    from North Ga.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uW03VD_KJxs My latest build, a 1965 327. Hard for me to think there is much better than a small journal 4" bore motor. The 1969 302's chevy's used to rule the roost, came with 2 4 barrels dealer option and a 4.11 gear with 4 speed. As someone said, a 283 steel crank, a 327 block. I had a 327 large journal balanced TRW rotating assembly in a 350 4 bolt main block, tried to sell it during some hard times, Finally a drag -boat guy bought it. It was apart, mic'ed and checked out, no mystery purchase for him. THEM TRW 11.5:1 forged pistons sell for a insane price these days, be warned.

    I had a 327 in a 3100lb car get 25 mpg on a trip up north. The pipes were a chalky white. (maybe a little lean?) I've had several 283's get that much. Never had a 350 get better than 15 (including the one I've had since the early 80s)

    THE 265 cranks, if I remember correctly were missing some of the weights that prevent cracks from forming, thou lighter, faster to rev, it'll be hard to find a good one. I can remember one dirt track car running a 265 crank, aluminum flywheel, 4" bore, and if I remember a 6.13 rear gear. It revved like a 2-stroke dirt bike with a ported piston and pipe.

    These new LSX motors, watching the "kids" build and run them, the next legends.
     
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  3. volvobrynk
    Joined: Jan 30, 2011
    Posts: 3,587

    volvobrynk
    Member
    from Denmark

    I know, I know. I Wasen't around in the early '60. My dad is from 59, so I'm way younger the 301-era. And non American ;-)

    What does DZ stand for, in DZ 302?

    There is only a few things that can battle with the sound of the AWESOME 301/302!
    Except for 2stroke husqvarna bikes, like the one Steve Mcqueen rides in "on any sunday", 2 cycle DD and a offy at WOT.

    I like the ideer of a BOR, mostly because I own one. :)
     
  4. crowman
    Joined: Apr 18, 2011
    Posts: 48

    crowman
    Member

    OK, here's what I"m building, A 1969 Opel GT , all moly chassis, 4-link , strange struts and a Doug Nash 5-speed. Figuring on about 5-86 gears to 6-00. If you have ever heard the old modified class run you'll know why I'm building this. In this day of 2-steps and throttle stops when you hear 10,000 rpm it pure music ! I want one ! besides, I crashed my AA/GS Willys again so it's gone, and I'm moving on.
     
  5. crowman
    Joined: Apr 18, 2011
    Posts: 48

    crowman
    Member

    I don't have the numbers with me but I have 2 steel cranks, both say 327 according to the part number. 1 is a 3.25'' stroke the other is a 3'' stroke.
     
  6. jimdillon
    Joined: Dec 6, 2005
    Posts: 3,138

    jimdillon
    Member

    DZ as in DZ 302 was the engine suffix code for the 1969 Z28. The 1968 Z28 was a MO 302 and the 1967 Z28 was MO as well (the crankshafts were different in many of the 67s and 68s). I had a 1968 Z28 and it is still one of the cars I regret selling. They were fun on the street and strip. I have a 327/365 today which has the same camshaft and they are fun to run the RPMs up even stop light to stop light.
     

  7. A 302 and a 301 are the same basic engine, a 283 bored .125. GM called them a 302 as a selling point they were or are really 301 and change.

    They can be built to have low end grunt or be a screamer. Depends on cam/head/intake selection. I had a '69 Z-28 302 motor in a '64 Chevelle once. You are correct it would not get out of its own way until you got the revs up, it started to come alive @ about 4K.

    As for the small displacement motor 278 cubes would be the easiest to build by destroking a 283. I would have to get the slide rule out to tell you what stroke you want, but it could be done by having a steel crank ground offset. Either by welding up the journals or by making the rod journals smaller. You can get about .010 by turning your journals to .030 under.

    The only reason I can see to build on that small is to make class racing. But I do like short stroke big bore engines.
     
  8. plym49
    Joined: Aug 9, 2008
    Posts: 2,803

    plym49
    Member
    from Earth


    Did anyone ever make a 180 crank for a SBC?
     
  9. xracer40
    Joined: Jun 20, 2010
    Posts: 308

    xracer40
    Member

    In the late 70's I bought a 277" that was built for the M/P class. If I recall correctly the crank was destroked .90 and the block was bored .60. It had Brooks pistons and aluminum rods, Modello heads, tunnel ram with 2 4bbl's. The roller cam was a Racer Brown exp. grind, it had no part numbers anywhere. I had it in a 67 camaro w/4spd. I had a lot of fun with it, that motor would rev to moon.
     
  10. Not entirely so,I had at one time (peprwork,known history and all) a 1967 302 factory crate motor in my coupe which was a MO designation. twas a 2 bolt main! Very rare! Wish I still had it!!!!
     
  11. woops of course I meant paper work...
     
  12. 1971BB427
    Joined: Mar 6, 2010
    Posts: 7,051

    1971BB427
    Member
    from Oregon

    The old 301 SBC wasn't all that popular when it was first built from a 1/8" over bored 283. But once the 327 blocks hit the market and guys started tossing 283 cranks in them, the cost got cheaper, and the blocks ran cooler. They also had a much longer life with the thicker cylinder walls. The later 301 version built on the 327 was a much more common stroker, and I saw a lot of them prior to Chevy building their DZ 302. After the factory version hit the streets, it seemed like everyone stopped building them at home.
     
  13. Dawai
    Joined: Oct 1, 2007
    Posts: 263

    Dawai
    Member
    from North Ga.

    A thought.. I may call later today.

    So, Brindle brothers auto parts in Dalton Georgia. In the early 80s I was married to a blond that kept me so broke I could not pay attention. I walked into the back of his storage room there on Morris street store (moved now) and there was FIVE (5) 1969 chevy 302's in crates unopened. I had just bought some new valve springs for the 882 heads I had on "the magic" 350.

    I tried to buy, offered to make weekly payments, go to work in the store for one.. That old fella maybe gone on now, the main store was moved to Chatsworth Hwy. I bet someone, perhaps someone who does not know the value of "those engines" has them now. For a moment the old man was like a kid who had a Big Sugar sucker and other kids "wanting it" and for a moment, the center of attention.
     
  14. theHIGHLANDER
    Joined: Jun 3, 2005
    Posts: 8,283

    theHIGHLANDER
    Member

    I remember reading a story about an M/P Camaro titled "How to win a losing class" (or something close). This guy ran a 3100lb car with something like 287CI. They showed his stack of "spares" in the back of his shop, something like 2 dozen or more 283 cores. I lost the mag decades ago when my ex simply threw away my box of books while I was at work.
     
  15. crowman
    Joined: Apr 18, 2011
    Posts: 48

    crowman
    Member

    Not looking to build any sort of class car, we have a stick shift group locally and I'm going to run with them.
     
  16. Speedwrench
    Joined: Nov 21, 2009
    Posts: 1,030

    Speedwrench
    Member

    I'm not sure who made the crank - Moldex, I would assume - but there was a flat crank engine that ran a few shows with the USAC sprint cars in the early 70's. I think the concept was to get a horsepower increase due to improved exhaust pulse timing. I don't remember it being run more than two or three times and the driver said that it had a vibration that was so bad that it put his hands to sleep during a thirty lap feature on pavement.
     
  17. plym49
    Joined: Aug 9, 2008
    Posts: 2,803

    plym49
    Member
    from Earth

    How cool would it be to run one with a flat crank? I'm sure the balance problems could be resolve - figuring out the ignition (two four cylinder distributors) could be fun if the motor was kept traditional - with EFI it would be easy....
     

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