Register now to get rid of these ads!

Technical Shoebox clutch fork keeps disengaging. Why?

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by magnus13, Jan 31, 2020.

  1. magnus13
    Joined: Jun 1, 2013
    Posts: 141

    magnus13
    Member
    from California

    I'm mating up an 8ba flathead to a T5 using a 50 shoebox bellhousing and wilco adapter. I'm having problems with the clutch fork staying engaged in the throw out bearing. Is the only thing that holds the fork inplace is the flat springs that wrap around the two bosses on the fork?

    It's also got that tiny spring behind the fork holding it in place, but it's always coming out.

    It's there a particular way to install this? 20200130_215204.jpg
     
  2. daliant
    Joined: Nov 25, 2009
    Posts: 689

    daliant
    Member

    Post a picture of your clutch linkage, the geometry could probably be a little off.
    Or the retaining clips could be worn out and not seating properly.
     
  3. seb fontana
    Joined: Sep 1, 2005
    Posts: 8,392

    seb fontana
    Member
    from ct

    Post a pic of the wilco adapter too. How much of the original linkakage are you using?
     
  4. E5886FE5-82C3-4615-AC24-80E0190E882F.jpeg 462CA769-954E-41EA-B2A6-A394BE073D0D.jpeg Shouldn’t there be a pivot bracket inside the bellhousing for the fork to ride on ?
    There is one inside mine .

    Tommy
     
    squirrel likes this.

  5. I reread your post.
    It sounds like it is too much travel,,,going overcenter,,,maybe ?

    Tommy
     
  6. magnus13
    Joined: Jun 1, 2013
    Posts: 141

    magnus13
    Member
    from California

    Heres a picture with the wilcap adapter plate in between the trans and bellhousing.

    The bellhousing has that L shaped mount riveted in that the fork pivots off. It also has that thin little wire spring that hooks behind it to keep it from falling out, but there's enough play that the fork keeps pulling out of the throw out bearing clips.

    Seems like a weird design which makes me think I may have it installed wrong. 20200109_185951.jpeg 20200104_165234.jpeg 20200104_165240.jpeg 20200110_211539.jpeg

    Sent from my SM-G973U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
    Desoto291Hemi likes this.
  7. magnus13
    Joined: Jun 1, 2013
    Posts: 141

    magnus13
    Member
    from California

    Hmmm, now I wonder if I'm pulling on the linkage arm away from the tranny instead of toward it. I'll have to look at that. That could be enough to be disengaging it
    Sent from my SM-G973U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  8. Mr48chev
    Joined: Dec 28, 2007
    Posts: 33,718

    Mr48chev
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Release bearing, Fork and clutch plate (fingers) documented to match up with each other?
    I don't think that stamped flathead bellhousing I have hanging on the shed wall has a fork in it and it's too late to stumble around in the dark to check.
    That mix an match parts don't always match perfectly seems to happen fairly often when we work on these things.
     
  9. Well,,,it looks good .
    Have you manually cycled the fork through its complete travel .
    It really looks like it should work fine .
    I’m with 48Chev,,,,there must be a mismatch of components somewhere ?
    Is this going in a shoebox with stock linkage ?

    Tommy
     
  10. magnus13
    Joined: Jun 1, 2013
    Posts: 141

    magnus13
    Member
    from California

    No, it's actually in a 32 with a new linkage setup. The fork came with the housing, but the bearing came from Wilcap sized to fit the T5 shaft.

    Sent from my SM-G973U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  11. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 55,637

    squirrel
    Member

    Remove the spring clip, take a picture of it. Ask Desoto29Hemi to remove his clip, and take a picture of it. Compare pictures.
     
  12. 0EA6685D-7CCA-4537-AD43-5765D6838FCF.jpeg 6451845F-2CB0-4863-9CC9-7711CA09EB0D.jpeg Here are some pics of what I have.
    The first pics are of the fork centered in the housing,,and the back side of the fork with the spring and plate attached .
     
  13. C6B17290-33FE-408D-B4A7-A7E0BB698821.jpeg 44CD6588-8008-470E-A298-405CF78F6511.jpeg This set is of the spring ,plate,,and what’s left of the felt gasket off the fork.
    And the inner pivot bracket in the bell .
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2020
  14. 695C9E5B-1DD3-4E38-A350-AB7682AD3F94.jpeg C6B7754A-F6BC-4810-91A7-3A624E1D0360.jpeg 35C87053-F437-43CD-BA9A-CED737B79B3F.jpeg 4EA5F3C8-49C6-486E-B8D3-9DD2D42795EF.jpeg These are front and back pics of the fork.
    And pics of the spring that retains the fork to the pivot .
    Hope this was able to help .

    Tommy
     
  15. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 55,637

    squirrel
    Member


  16. I have no idea what this set-up is supposed to look like. But why does it look like the fork isn't properly engaging the collar of the T.O. bearing. Aren't the two lugs in the I.D. of the yoke supposed to be the contact point with the bearing collar? This pic makes it look like the rounded ends of the fork are showing wear from contacting the backside of the bearing. Wish I could see the other side of the T.O. bearing.
     
    Dan Timberlake likes this.
  17. Interesting issue. As the photos show the Fork has a detent that sits over the Fulcrum. The spring clip does nothing but hold things in place until everything is connected. With all adjustments correct it can't (shouldn't) come off the fulcrum. You said the throw out bearing came with the Kit. I believe there and the P.P. may be where your issue lays. I'm thinking to much travel at full release letting the Fork get to where the detent is near flat and pressure point on the bearing is on the outboard edge of bearing retainer letting the Fork push itself off the fulcrum. In other words to much travel forward to keep the fork lodged on the fulcrum.
     
    Desoto291Hemi likes this.
  18. Slow thinking here but last year I had a job come in that the Front bearing retainer in a T-5 kit was just to short and at the end of travel let the bearing retainer slip over the front edge and grab the bearing and it would not return. Had to extend the retainer 3/4". Might check yours against a stock Ford unit for length in relation to travel needed.
     
    magnus13 likes this.
  19. magnus13
    Joined: Jun 1, 2013
    Posts: 141

    magnus13
    Member
    from California

    The two lugs on the fork had a flat on it that pushed on the bearing. It's not wear, I just ground the flat off it to get better engagement on the bearing and so the clip can hold it.

    Is there supposed to be a little preload on the clutch fork as it engages the pressure plate fingers? I can see if that were the case, then it's difficult for the clutch fork to pull out because of the detent.
     
  20. magnus13
    Joined: Jun 1, 2013
    Posts: 141

    magnus13
    Member
    from California

    Thanks! Got some things to dig into this weekend!
     
  21. Dan Timberlake
    Joined: Apr 28, 2010
    Posts: 1,522

    Dan Timberlake
    Member

    I agree with Claymart. Only The pegs on the fork are supposed to contact the TO bearing.

    I think you have this style TO bearing. Note the fork style.
    https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/p...JFaWajYBwI_F0fOUAODT02Ztw02CbG7eFZ4FJBJcsziXQ

    I think you need a different fork, or a TO bearing more like this -
    http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/shop/1955/55csm06r01.html

    http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/shop/1955/55csm06r05.html

    http://pontiac.oldcarmanualproject....iac Shop Manual/06C-Engine Clutch/image2.html
     
    ClayMart likes this.
  22. magnus13
    Joined: Jun 1, 2013
    Posts: 141

    magnus13
    Member
    from California

    I assume the pegs are supposed to fit under those clips on the backside of the bearing, right?

    My TO bearing isn't quite like this one in your first link. Doesn't have the hook for the spring on top.
     
  23. Still looks like a mis-match of parts to me. A T.O. bearing something like what Dan Timberlake showed here ...

    http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/shop/1955/55csm06r05.html

    ... would look a lot more appropriate to me. And you wouldn't have had to grind any clearance on the ends of the fork.

    I suspicion that if you keep trying to re-engineer the parts you have to make them work, if you aren't already a "drinking man" you soon will be. :p
     
  24. magnus13
    Joined: Jun 1, 2013
    Posts: 141

    magnus13
    Member
    from California

    Haha. Yes I figured old Henry did it right the first time and didn't plan on some guy needing to fix it 70 years later. I wonder if I should go back to the original TO bearing and sleeve the output shaft to fit it.

    Sent from my SM-G973U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  25. Wanted to know if the stock T.O. Bearing had a tall or short housing so dug out a stock unit to look at. Wanted to back up my thoughts of being able to slide off the Fulcrum. Yes it will if it travels to far to release the Clutch disc. This should have nothing to do with your actual pedal linkage. Wrong P.P. and or bearing housing is only parts that can let the bearing move forward far enough to let the Fork slide off the Fulcrum. This is a photo of what I have that backed up my thoughts. Check your total amount of travel of the Fork. Past that the fork should not come off the Fulcrum.
    20200201_101651.jpg
     
    Desoto291Hemi likes this.
  26. This would be my advice if your still using the Ford P.P.
     
    magnus13 and Desoto291Hemi like this.

Share This Page

Register now to get rid of these ads!

Archive

Copyright © 1995-2021 The Jalopy Journal: Steal our stuff, we'll kick your teeth in. Terms of Service. Privacy Policy.

Atomic Industry
Forum software by XenForo™ ©2010-2014 XenForo Ltd.