Not necessarily trying to start a thread here, but considering the fact that a lot of you (like me) have other auto-related hobby interests outside of the traditional rod & custom box, some of you may have some good input for me. Here's the deal: I have access to a 96 caddy with a northstar. Runs, shifts, and stops fine. The body & interior are a little beat, so I can have it very cheap. I'm thinking about buying one of those sand car frames and running the motor & tranny, and just about anything else I can, off the caddy. Kind of a caddy themed sandcar. And I'm pretty sure that northstar makes 250+ hp which would pretty much haul ass in a sandrail. Yeah, what can I tell you...I was born in Murfreesboro Tennessee. I've got a little redneck in me. I've seen videos of these things doing huge wheelies out in the desert with like 4 people sitting in them. Crazy shit, looks like fun. If any of you have built one of these things, have experience grenading northstar v8's, or have any thoughts on the matter, I'd like to hear about it. Maybe this is topic of interest to some of you, maybe not. PM me or something if you don't want to discuss it here.
Moved from TN to FL, huh??? I just moved from FL to TN... Tired of Hurricanes, floods, Hurricanes, insurance companies, Hurricanes, low pay, Hurricanes, $3.50 a gallon for gas, Hurricanes... Got tired of rebuilding my house.
The caddy is not the problem, they run awesome in sand cars. Its one of the top choices as well as the ls-1....The trannys are QUITE expensive a good mendiola will run between 6 and 10 grand used. Just something to think about when you go into building a Big sand car. 4 Shocks cost right at 2 grand. But you can have a blast in one.
Never heard of one of blowing up. They are all the rage though in sandbuggies- the front wheel drive V8 fits oh so nice in the buggies rails. I hear they run pretty cool (temp wise) too with a fairly small aluminum radiator. Just be sure to yank the entire harness and dont forget the O2 sensors!!!
how bought the weight of the northstar motor-- anybody know that? would be great with good hp AND lower weight. -scott noteboom
WOW!!! 6 to 10 grand for a tranny!!!!! I guess I shouldn't be surprised that a special tranny is needed since the engines are essentially mounted backwards. I'm watching that idea go down in flames!
Is there any way to use the original Caddy transaxle in one of these, or are there clearance problems or something?
[quote='29MurrayTub]Is there any way to use the original Caddy transaxle in one of these, or are there clearance problems or something?[/quote] The transverse mounting is the biggest problem, not to mention that sand cars have 18 to 30" of wheel travel. All the components are specially designed for this.. I wont say It cant be done, but I will say it hasnt been done yet. I went for a ride in a twin turbo all aluminum 427 small block buggy this past Memorial day...Its by far the fastest car I have ever been in.
When I built my '53 Willys DJ-3A years ago I ripped out the Chevy V8 and got a Northstar from GM to slap in it. I forget all the particulars - have 'em written down if you really need them. Off the top of my head there are a few different versions. Earlier ones like your '96 have spark plug wires, and a few other differences than the later coil-on-plug models. There are also a few different power levels offered. STS coupes got the higher 300hp engine that made a little less torque and the 4-doors and bigger cars got the 280 or 290hp engine that made more torque with a flatter curve. Again, I can look it up if you need to know. Without all the emissions stuff you'd be looking at an easy 300+hp. As for some of your questions, most Northstars are in pretty good shape with up to 100K+ miles since they couldn't really overheat. Lots of redundant cylinder deactivation, etc. so Edna and Effie couldn't overheat it on the way to bingo. Do a cylinder leakdown test. If it's good you can add a turbo, feed it 6-8psi boost, and knock down 450hp with 7000rpm redlines all day. I wound up swapping my V8 Northstar for a 3.5L V6 Shortstar because of fitment issues, but the V6 is 300lbs dressed and wet. It think the V8 is about 425 or so. When I did my Shortstar I used Turnkey Engine Supply's harness with a GM MEFI 4 computer. The engine is tuned for about 260/260 power wise with a 6500rpm rev limiter. The company doesn't mess with North/Shortstar engines anymore, but I'm sure the programs are still in their computers if you want to buy a harness and computer from them. I think Colby was getting about 330hp with a light tune on the computer, maybe more. Or you can rip out all the Caddy wiring and computer and use that. Save you some coin that way. There are lots of companies making bellhousings for VW-type transaxles, or you can do a mid-engine buggy and mate it to a GM 4 or 5-speed tranny and get creative with a cut 9-inch rear and extended CV shafts or something crazy. I've seen rear ends with 1410 U-joints affixed to long-spline driveshaft components for a dirty way to get the power to the sand. Regardless, it's doable. I used a 2.8L bellhousing from a Camaro that I modified to mate mine to an SM420 transmission. Centerforce made the flywheel and I had a bronze pilot bushing turned down. Hydraulic slave cylinder is stock for Camaro. Or a TH700R4 with the 60-degree pattern fits with some mods. I'm sure you're familiar with them, but here are some companies for more info. http://www.mechtech-ms.com/gallery.php http://www.chrfab.com/ http://turnkeyenginesupply.com/
Northstar is 395lbs from what I have read. more engine weight comparison chart here http://www.mustangworks.com/articles/misc/EngineWeights.html
Dont waste your with a vw transaxle, there are none that will handle the power. The only vw transaxle that the bellhousing is removable is a bus, but its NOT strong enough. I've seen the 9"ers with cv's the engine has to be a mid engine or front, which dosn't lend itself to a buggy very well. 395lbs.... wow I would have thought 450 interesting.
First of all, if you're on a tighter budget and not going too agressive (sub 400hp in a light weight rail with standard duning paddles,) a built VW transaxle will work just fine (guys are running them on the strip, pushing 'em into the mid 8's in the 1/4 mile.) The trans are popular for sand use, as it's real easy to flip the ring n pinion for mid engine, light weight, shift linkages are readily available, as are adapters to many engines. That said, even built VW trans get pricey... I've ridden in plenty turbo vw rails running major HP and the trans hold up ok. If you're going agressive (over 600hp w/ major tire) take a look at the Lenco transmissions at www.lencoracing.com. The ST1200 is great for most. For the truly insane with more hp and money, check out their CS1 box-- those are big money. Yes, the fastest ride i've ever been in was a sand car. a 1200hp alcohol turbo chevy w/ a air shifted Lenco. Up Oldsmobile Hill in Glamis.... i describe the experience as an explosion... like being shot out of a gun. and, wow, i didnt expect the northstar motor to be so light at 395lb. -scott noteboom
http://www.transmissionadapters.com/ i thought he was on the hamb at one time.. but any way they put a northstar in a feiro.
Damn, I think I just peed a little. Maybe I just need to chuck all of this shit and move to California. So, you're saying an adapter could be used to hook one of those modified VW transaxles up to a northstar? And when you say that they're also pricey, well, how pricey are we talking? Better yet, if you have any links where I could check them out that would be cool. Thanks for the responses.
My boss has a homebrewed mid- engined sandcar . He runs a Hilborn port injected 437 SBC on alcohol + a little nitro for flavor . Its hooked to a built 'glide and uses a greek coupler to hook it to a very modified open 9" centersection with inboard disk brakes and 35 spline IRS ends he had Strange build, uses 1350 joints inner and outer, I'd guess it has 20" of rear suspension travel and 28" up front . Like I say it is homebrewed and looks it but is a real kick in the butt to drive and has whupped up on some of the more expensive sand toys out there. I think the Northstars are pretty common in this type rig because of their weight to HP but one of the baddest I've seen is a roots blown Subaru with a trick EFI system , he was running the next to largest Mendeola Transaxle and flat killed the ring and pinion .
Yikes, im really contributing to off topic here-- as this is nothing about traditional hot rods.... and i'm revealing my past as a former VW fag .... but, to continue my sin: I've seen the VW trans adapter to many different apps. However, the last time i was intimate with VWs (as a kid I used to work as an engine builder for a race shop) was about 17 years ago-- and the Northstar wasnt used then. Im sure it's been done though... As far as cost of a fairly built VW trans-- it can cost $2000+ quick when done right. If you're serious, i'd call someone who is still deep in the mix. I'd recommend you talk to Garth at Wilson Machine Works-- as he's really into the sand game-- both the dunes and the 100 yard sand drags: Wilson Machine Works 565 Westlake, Ste. 300A Encinitas, CA 92024 760-436-7131 If you talk to him, tell him the tall kid (who is no longer a kid) Scott who used to work for De Coppen Bros says hello. Good luck. Now let's talk about some traditional hot rods and customs.... -scott
http://www.funco-motorsports.com/northstar_v8.htm Heres a site I found that sells them with the northstar as a engine option.
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