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Technical SBC pilot needle bearing question

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by deuce666, Sep 5, 2019.

  1. deuce666
    Joined: Jan 10, 2008
    Posts: 147

    deuce666
    Member
    from Oregon

    Thanks in advance for your help.
    I have a small block chevy with a T-10 4-speed out of the car. While the flywheel and pressure plate were off, I decided to swap out the pilot bushing with a pilot (needle) bearing. I used a GM part number and cross referenced to a Timken bearing 57060.
    the two sides of the Timken bearing are different (see two attached pics). I'm wondering if it matters which way to install this in the end of the crankshaft. I'm leaning towards installing so the side in pic "timken01" faces towards the input shaft and "timken02" faces to the front of the engine.
    Anyone know the right way to install these? does it matter?
    thanks again
     

    Attached Files:

  2. borderboy1971
    Joined: Oct 20, 2008
    Posts: 571

    borderboy1971
    Member
    from Canada

    I've never seen any service information that indicates which way to install it but I've always put them in smooth side towards trans. My personal opinion though, I'd put a bushing in instead. I've seen far too many bearings cause damage to the input shaft. Once the bearing loses it lubrication, it starts to chew stuff up fast. A bushing with oil squeezed into it lasts much longer and seldom damages the input shaft.

    P.s. I'm a journeyman auto mechanic and have seen quite a bit in my days.
     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2019
  3. Mike VV
    Joined: Sep 28, 2010
    Posts: 1,554

    Mike VV
    Member
    from SoCal

    See the larger radius on the O.D...?
    THAT goes in first..!
    You'd never want to push a sharp corner (very small radius) into a tight hole.

    Mike
     
  4. Rex_A_Lott
    Joined: Feb 5, 2007
    Posts: 940

    Rex_A_Lott
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    X2 on using the oilite bushing. Don’t outsmart yourself here. Good luck.
     
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  5. 427 sleeper
    Joined: Mar 8, 2017
    Posts: 545

    427 sleeper
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Install it the way you're thinking. That's how the were installed at the factory, tapered side toward the trans. It kinda like a pilot for the pilot.

    Sent from my SM-G892A using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  6. F-ONE
    Joined: Mar 27, 2008
    Posts: 1,859

    F-ONE
    Member
    from Alabama

    Bushing
     
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  7. AngleDrive
    Joined: Mar 9, 2006
    Posts: 673

    AngleDrive
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Florida

    X4 on the bushing
     
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  8. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 9,424

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

  9. Bushings worked perfectly for decades. I was going to go with the bearing also but once I looked it over good, I decided to opt for a new bushing.
     
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  10. jimmy six
    Joined: Mar 21, 2006
    Posts: 4,547

    jimmy six
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    My GMC 6's are stuck using an open ball bearing. I've gone to a sealed one with the same dimensions. I'd rather have an oil-lite but don't want to make one.
     
  11. borderboy1971
    Joined: Oct 20, 2008
    Posts: 571

    borderboy1971
    Member
    from Canada

    A true sealed ball bearing like what is used on medium duty trucks (heavy are likely the same), work fine. I've seen automotive "sealed" input bearings and all they have is a small lip seal that rides on the shaft....not effective. The clutch dust etc is what destroys the bearings, but a true sealed bearing is fine.
     
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  12. Desoto291Hemi
    Joined: Apr 21, 2009
    Posts: 634

    Desoto291Hemi
    Member

    Bushing please!!!
    Tried and true,,,,,old school,,,,cheaper and a lot less trouble!
    But,,,do what you want,,it’s your money.

    Tommy
     
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  13. I once went to change the clutch and pressure plate in a 6.2 diesel pickup. the roller pilot bearing was bad. So The owner went to get parts I told him a bronze bushing would be better. So he got one He complained about the cost. It was $40! I looked at it and told him take it back and get a refund. Went over in the corner of the shop and removed one from a small block. It was the same exact size. Installed the used bronze one I always put some chassis grease in the crank cavity behind the bushing. not enuf to hyd push the bushing just a little bit.
     
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  14. Doublepumper
    Joined: Jun 26, 2016
    Posts: 413

    Doublepumper
    Member

    Is the bearing supposed to be heavier duty? Is that why they're used in the bigger trucks? I have a hard time understanding the use of such a tiny bearing in that application. To me, they just seem too small, especially running on such a small diameter shaft as an input shaft pilot.
     
  15. Its not like the pilot bearing is in countinual operation. Its only being used when the clutch is released. The old bronze bushings outlasted the clutches and the engines.
     
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  16. jimmy six
    Joined: Mar 21, 2006
    Posts: 4,547

    jimmy six
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Spent years of my life changing bearings on electric motors. There’s a lot of difference in shielded and sealed bearings. Double and single. I never understood the use of the stock open ones on the trucks. Thanks for your input.
     
  17. Desoto291Hemi
    Joined: Apr 21, 2009
    Posts: 634

    Desoto291Hemi
    Member

    Hey old wolf,
    40 bucks for a bronze bushing?
    That guy was robbed!

    Tommy
     
  18. quicksilverart46
    Joined: Dec 7, 2016
    Posts: 438

    quicksilverart46
    Member

    I have had no luck needle pilot bearings . They are great for a short time then self destruct and chew up the pilot on the input shaft. Also the space age Kevlar bushings are a squeaky hard shifting mess too . Go with a Mcleod bronze oilite . GM and local auto parts all sell Chinese iron bushings . Pure crap too . A magnet will tell you if it’s bronze or iron. There may be others that sell bronze oil impregnated oilite bushings like Centerforce ,Ram or Hays but insist on oilite !!!


    Sent from my iPhone using H.A.M.B.
     
  19. deuce666
    Joined: Jan 10, 2008
    Posts: 147

    deuce666
    Member
    from Oregon

    Gents --
    Thanks for all your responses. They reminded me of the old adage, "if it ain't broke don't fix it". I kinda violated that one. Back to the bushing, and great tips on the oilite!. Mucho appreciated!!
     
  20. I used to make my own from oilite bronze. I may have a few unfinished blanks around, good tip above on the China crap out on the market today. Most new clutches come with them, the last one I installed I never bothered to check. I always install it with the biggest chamfer or radius towards the input shaft.
     

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