I'm finishing up my first rebuild on a 77 350 block for the 64 and now find that unfortunately I have a few "leftover" threaded and soft plugs. These came with the rest of the freeze plugs in the assembly kit and have yet to find a home for them on the block. I'm trying to determine which of these are "must use" parts or if different V8 chevy small blocks use different plug sizes and different threaded inserts so these are just "extra" parts in the kit: six threaded plugs (coarse thread), two "9/16" press-in soft plugs, and three smaller "EPO 108" soft plugs. The little threaded inserts I thought might go into the base of the block near the motor mounts but the threads appear not to match - and there's not enough holes for the six plugs anyway. The other press fit plugs I haven't noticed locations for during assembly yet: there were three other slightly larger plugs that inserted behind the cam gear, and I placed them correctly in the block. I know there's a plug that inserts below the main cap, but that's a 1/2" plug and I'm going to check with the machine shop to be sure they didn't already install that one because it wasn't in the parts I received. Any help appreciated as I'm not looking forward to pulling it apart again if i don't have to, but even more concerned about low oil pressure, block damage and leaks!! Ideally I could find a "map" of all the insert plug locations for this block - anyone know of a source? Thanks alot! hdh
The larger one should be the cam plug on the back of the block. the two regular size freeze plugs also would probably go in the rear of the block along with three of the threaded pipe plugs in the oil galleys. The three smaller plugs are the galley plugs for the front of the block and go behind the timing gear. If you had a machine shop rebuild the short or long block they most likely installed those plugs.
There NOT freeze plugs! Never have been, never will! Sorry, I cant help you with your question mate. Doc.
as Doc said..those plugs have been mis-labled all their life..they are plugs that go in the block to cover up holes that were put in the block to relieve the block of casting sand after the casting process of the engine block, and to have acess to machining certain areas of the block..like the cam passage..."Casting Plugs".. that was their purpose..not to relieve the block if it freezes. If that were the case..whay are there so many cracked blocks? Engine blocks were never ment to freeze..you should be running some type of coolant that doesnt promote corrosion or freezing..pure water in a cooling system is counter productive..it corrodes the internal passages of your engine, and it has too low of a boiling point.
Dose it realy matter what you call them!!! That was not the ? MR48Chevy is right that would be my guss as well hope it helps. And thanks guys for the Info
Ahh yes the old 3 card-monty on the engine plug game !! The 3 small press in plugs go in the lifter oil gallies at the front of the block behind the upper timing gear,the 2 9/16 press in plugs are for a later style block which you don't have,out of the 5 screw in plugs 3 go in the back of the block to plug the other end of the lifter gallies 1 goes in the side of the block right above the oil filter and the last 1 goes in the top left corner of the block between the cyliner head and the deck surface. And as said before the large press in is for the rear cam plug and the 2 smaller press ins are for the rear water jacket clean outs. The common practice at my engine shop is to bag all plugs from every engine and at clean up. Then at assembly time we replace every plug we took out. In the situation you are in I would go back to the machine shop and quiz them. Then before I took the engine off the stand I would prime the oil pump to check for leaks and adequate oil pressure. EP5x >>>>.
You may as well learn all the names cuz some parts houses use the old ones. Freeze plugs, core plugs, soft plugs are the ones I'm familiar with on the large ones. I've always heard the little ones called Welch plugs and oil gallery plugs. Probably more, but that's it for me....
One I didn't see mentioned...there is one plug (unthreaded) driven into the vertical oil gallery leading up from the pump. It goes above the tube leading to rear main and diverts the oil over through the filter, and then the filtered oil returns via another gallery to right above said plug. With plug in, all oil except that for rear main goes over to filter area, without it filter fills up but has no flow. If you skip this one, you will see and feel no immediate trouble, as engine has full pressure to all bearings and filter will be full when you change it, but you are effectively running without a filter!
Yup as this is the Hidden Plug that hardly ever gets taken out as most people don't even know it's there and this plug isn't in the kit >>>>.
Where exactly is the sausage capital of the USA?? Thanks you guys. This is why i really like this community - educated with exactly the knowledge I need to finish up, and even a bit more. I've been wondering why there are so many holes in the block. I deal with alot of molds for my work - but mostly plastic so no casting holes needed. Expect to get a straight answer from the machine shop on the 1/2" soft plug under the rear main cap that funnels oil through the filter. If I'm not satisfied with their answer, replacing a few gaskets to lift the rear main cap and check is not too bad. I greatly appreciate the help! hdh
I haven't had my head inside an SBC for years. I'm at work and can't check a block or the excellent oil illustration that's in some of the books...but from memory, isn't the plug at the top of the block in back the same passage as the secret plug above the rear main area?? If my memory is correct, you could drop in a long rod from above and verify lower plug by how far the rod can go... Can someone post the diagram that shows the oil passages from pump to top at rear of block?? I think it is in the GM performance book and several of the how-to-hot your Chevy books.
I would love to see it too. I hope someone can post. I would prefer not to have to pull the pan... Called my motor guy who is checking with the machine shop, unfortunately no answer today. The rear galley plugs threaded in fine, but the remaining are a size too large to thread in on the side. I'll have to get some smaller threaded plugs for the inserts on the left side of the block in front of and above the oil filter. I think I remember the block having an actual bolt in the threaded hole just above the pan line mid way along the block. I assume one of those threaded holes above the filter are for oil pressure sending unit? If so, is it the one closer or further away from the filter. Kicking myself for not taking more detailed photos of the block prior to sending it off.
Picked up some more of the external plugs to fit the block today along with a How To Hot Rod Small Block Chevy book which I've read a bit of this evening. Hope to install the motor next weekend and, perhaps with if I continue to take my time and check everything it'll run well with a little luck.
I'm in San Jose,but I drive over to Santa Cruz every Thursday to play cards with my friends. I can drive over early and have a look if you want,I've built a couple engines in my day.
I appreciate your offer! If I don't get it figured out this week I'll definitely have you by! Turns out the engine shop did not put the soft plug in above the oil pump nor did they provide it in the kit. Neither makes sense, but both easy to fix. One question I do have you can probably answer: How long will i have to spin the drill to pre-oil the motor well? 5 seconds or a minute, or...? Does it matter which way it spins - clockwise or counter? Thanks! hdh
I just finished fixing a car where some bonehead left out the oil galley plug and no oil pressure, now 60lbs. I have had a few blocks come back from the machine shop without the plugs in but most shops will replace them when they do the machine work, always check and make sure they are all in. much eaiser to fix out of the car rather then in the car!!
Easy enough to check, once you know it's supposed to be there, huh! I just pulled the rear main off and there is the fresh new plug properly installed by the engine shop. I guess they forgot or probably just covering themselves saying they didn't install it. How important is it to get the oil pickup on the pump brazed to the body?? I haven't searched that, but thought for sure you guys would know. I have it set 3/8" from the pan, but the tube doesn't feel overly tight and I don't want any oil starvation issues! Going to flip it back over and try to finish the the top end assembly tonight. hdh
For what it's worth, here's a sweet little tech thread on oil pump tube brazing... http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=174901&highlight=brazing+oil+pickup+tube Have to get that taken care of tomorrow. hdh
An issue on tube is how it was installed...a proper tool that hits a lot of the ring will get it in tight, beating on an open end wrench will beat it up and leave a sloppy fit... Vizard's how-to-rebuild book shows a beatiful tool that is nothing more than a piece of pipe with some careful grinding (following his detailed sketch) so it comes in right past the tube and engages a lot of the ring. Mine took me 10 minutes to make and worked perfectly. If you also get his head, cam, crank, and carb books your head will overflow with Chevy knowledge!
It just gets better - I appreciate the tip! I think I used a modified bicycle handlebar piece to 'tink it into place, but wasn't confident really driving it home, so it's probably not as fully seated as is should be as you note. Wondered if I could find a tool that would be more confidence inspring, but the idea of dialing in my own sounds better. I'll look into it. Thanks, hdh
From memory...don't have book here...Vizard ground the end of a pipe with same ID as OD of tube to about a 20 degree angle so it could go over tube as close to parallel as possible, ground out the minimum possible cove on the side to slide it over, and fine tuned the contact area for max contact. Get the book...worth it in many ways, but the driver design was really clever and easy! Far superior to one I bought.
DON'T FORGET THIS ONE!! I didn't see it mentioned, but it's partially covered up by the drivers side head gasket towards the rear of the block.
Oh yeah I mentioned that one in my description but I forgot to say that YOU'LL ONLY FORGET THIS ONE ONCE !! As the oil leak and the mess will stick with you for quite awhile >>>>.
The ones mentioned behind the cam sprocket need to be "staked" after installing. First, make sure you don't drive em in too deep, then use a dull chisel and stake around the hole to create an obstruction for the plug to hit if it tries to pop out. (Unless someone's tapped them for pipe plugs)
Tht'un's a gusher! If you have headers, you may well notice the flames before you notice the oil! And just to add something, a few SBC blocks have ANOTHER outlet around front of manifold, maybe for an alternate oil pressure switch? Never figured out original source or reason for that one. Someone told me truck application, but no documentation.
Never liked brazing or welding on the oil pump. My solution, after setting pickup to proper depth of course, is to fab up a small tab with a hole that goes under one of the oil pump cover bolts, then bent around and shaped to intersect with the pickup tube a half inch or so from the pump cover with a sort of curl formed in the tab to match with at least an eighth of the tube circumference. With the tab firmly bolted down by the pumpcover bolt and the tab, which is of .050-.060 mild steel, fitting snugly against the pickup tube, it only takes a little heat to braze the tube and tab together. It's a good solid securement for the pickup tube with much less heat on the pump or cover. Dave
An here's a toast the a good man and ever so exellent engine builder, Engine Pro 5X!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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