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Rag Joint vs. U-Joint

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Jeem, May 31, 2012.

  1. graverobber63
    Joined: Sep 8, 2004
    Posts: 4,134

    graverobber63
    Alliance Vendor

    On a side not, any of you guys building your linkage to colapse? I'm doing a 605 Conversion on my 62 Bel Air and was thinking of upgrading to the colapseable shaft
     
  2. Jeem
    Joined: Sep 12, 2002
    Posts: 5,885

    Jeem
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    No way. My column is rigidly mounted, pointed straight at my heart.
     
  3. S_Mazza
    Joined: Apr 27, 2011
    Posts: 363

    S_Mazza
    Member

    +1.

    I think Ford will install a rag joint up to at least 7 or 8 degrees off of parallel.
     
  4. Energy
    Joined: Jan 30, 2010
    Posts: 156

    Energy
    Member


    Can also find them on 84-96 Jeep Cherokee's (not the Grand Cherokee's). Can find lots of usable steering U-joints on early-mid 90s cadillacs too.

    NAPA used to be able to order you a rag-joint rebuild kit. Don't know if they still can.

    ;)
     
  5. Got one at Pep Boys for the Pinto for about five bucks just a month ago
     
  6. Elbopper
    Joined: Apr 29, 2012
    Posts: 109

    Elbopper
    Member

    I have this for sale 3/4 DD X 36 SPLINT
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2012
  7. Elbopper
    Joined: Apr 29, 2012
    Posts: 109

    Elbopper
    Member

    Brand new nver instelled BORGERSON #28-4
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2012
  8. Hotroddon, I know exactly what your saying, Ive seen that also on alot of OE stuff. Just call it like it is. If I, or anyone else would say it's ok to use a rag for just slight degree changes between the colum and the box would open a whole new can of worm's. Better to say, don't use, than have someone think that that one more degree of angle is ok then has a failer. No differant than them stupid, "Caution Coffee is Hot, you may get Burned" on cup lids. There's always a dumb one in the crowd that deserves what they get, but Laywers are more than happy to get them money.
     
  9. 40FordGuy
    Joined: Mar 24, 2008
    Posts: 2,907

    40FordGuy
    Member

    Ditto, to all that advise against rag joints !!!!

    4TTRUK
     
  10. Jeem
    Joined: Sep 12, 2002
    Posts: 5,885

    Jeem
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    Sooo you assumed you were talking to the "dumb one in the crowd"? I was asking a question to hot rod types (you know, the HAMB?). Not a bunch of lawyers practicing CYA.
     
  11. No not at all. What I'm trying to convey here is, there are people that run with a suggestion and assume that all is ok. Not aimed at you or others here that understand what is at hand here on this topic. Besides, these are your words on post #1 "Anyway, topic for discussion, debate, whatever..." and this to "Well, anyway, I'd love to come back and read some of y'all's opinions on this."
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2012
  12. JEM
    Joined: Feb 6, 2007
    Posts: 1,040

    JEM
    Member

    ...but if you call Borgeson, and tell them you're going to hook a column to a power-steering box or rack, they'll tell you to use a rag joint for noise suppression.

    Or one of their vibration dampers...
     
  13. S_Mazza
    Joined: Apr 27, 2011
    Posts: 363

    S_Mazza
    Member

    Dorman makes them. They have 2 sizes available. Neither one fits what I have, but at least they cover something. They also don't have the conductive elements that would be needed in some cars, where the horn was grounded through the column.
     
  14. many stock Ford application rag joints have a metal tab that goes across the bolts and creates a ground path from one side of the rag to the other.
     
  15. yruhot
    Joined: Dec 17, 2009
    Posts: 564

    yruhot
    Member

    If you use a aftermarket universal be sure to read the instructions about countersinking the shaft with a drill bit for the grub screw, phasing the shafts, a little locktight, and keep an eye on if for the rest of your life. Just kidding but you know how anything mechanical is subject to failure. Have Also been told rag joints are not for changing angles of the steering shaft. YRUHOT.............Doug
     
  16. drptop70ss
    Joined: May 31, 2010
    Posts: 1,167

    drptop70ss
    Member
    from NY

    I am in the middle of steeering setup on my current build and found this information written by a GM steering sytems engineer. He also has great pages on steering box information and specifications as well..anyway looks like the rag joint can do up to 5 degrees of angle. This is a word document so you will have to open it.

    http://jimshea.corvettefaq.com/?p=805

    For those who have replaced their rag joint with a universal and regularly drive your cars did you notice a difference in vibration through the steering wheel?
     
  17. Back during my early years of hot rods rag joints was all I ever used,,today I lean toward the universal joints.

    Why,,because the rag joints for the most part are obsolete and I won't use a old worm out one,,and to me the universal joints are clean looking although they tend to magnify any vibration you might have. HRP
     
  18. 40FordGuy
    Joined: Mar 24, 2008
    Posts: 2,907

    40FordGuy
    Member

    Steering, brakes, tires,..... I'd never "cheap it" on any of those,........

    Just my thoughts....... 4TTRUK
     
  19. VoodooTwin
    Joined: Jul 13, 2011
    Posts: 3,455

    VoodooTwin
    Member
    from Noo Yawk

    When did U-joints for steering make the scene in rodding? I have a couple on my '33 truck's sterring system, and to be honest I hate the way they look (shiney polished stainless, I wish I bought the little blackened steel ones). But with a Vega box, I don't have many other options.
     
  20. Don't have an answer as to when, but like all thing's in the beginning. Such as, when the first person altered they're frame and moved there box, whatever was in the hardware store or war surplus was game on.
     
  21. [​IMG]

    Oh my God, man! That joint is huge! :D
     
  22. [​IMG]
     
  23. Ebbsspeed
    Joined: Nov 11, 2005
    Posts: 5,406

    Ebbsspeed
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Way back when Moby Dick was a minnow, before everything scared us, I used to rebuild rag joints using a chunk of the rubberized belting that farmers used to run machinery with, from the PTO pulley on the side of the tractor. I know of one I rebuilt that is still in use, after 35+ years and unknown miles. And if I recall correctly, there was a bit of an angle between the column and sector. They do have a built-in fail safe in that two pins on one side of the joint will engage in slots on the other side, and still provide loose, but usable steering.
     
  24. Jeem
    Joined: Sep 12, 2002
    Posts: 5,885

    Jeem
    Alliance Vendor

    Naw, that wasn't the point. I was wanting to hear thought about the viability of a rag-joint in a nearly straight setup because in my mind IF a u-joint ever let go, you have NO connection with the steering at that point. Most rag-joints offer a fail-safe that would hopefully let you limp to the side of the road with a modicum of control.
     
  25. need louvers ?
    Joined: Nov 20, 2008
    Posts: 12,906

    need louvers ?
    Member


    About the late seventies to the mid eighties. Before that rag joints were the common thing.
    Some of the upline builders over in L.A. started digging up thses cool little joints I'm assuming in aircraft salvage and surplus joints that were common over there. As I said, that was late seventies. Seems to me that Borgeson started marketing their u-joints too us in the mid eighties.
     
  26. need louvers ?
    Joined: Nov 20, 2008
    Posts: 12,906

    need louvers ?
    Member


    Wouldn't the mear presence of you behind the wheel constitute a "medicum of control"?! Especially directionally? :D LOL, note the use of a smiley face!
     
  27. Jeem
    Joined: Sep 12, 2002
    Posts: 5,885

    Jeem
    Alliance Vendor

    Ouch. True, but ouch.

    One thing though, I'm pretty damn sure only 3% of y'all actually READ my opening post. Ebbspeed(?) why couldn't you have read and replied to this much earlier on?! hahahaaa
     
  28. jcmarz
    Joined: Jan 10, 2010
    Posts: 4,636

    jcmarz
    Member
    from Chino, Ca

    x3, Apples and Oranges. I support you on this Johnny Gee.
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2012
  29. need louvers ?
    Joined: Nov 20, 2008
    Posts: 12,906

    need louvers ?
    Member

    Dude, in the situation that you mention I wouldn't have any trouble in my heart and soul putting a rag joint in. It had been done 6.4 bazzillion times in years past. A U-joint is a much cleaner looking deal though. Rag joints always screamed "dug it out of a wrecking yard in '73" to me.
     
  30. Do you mean it looks "traditional", then and not GoodGuys standard issue? ;)

    ~Alden
     

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