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Technical QUICK CHANGE HELP

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by Joemama, Feb 10, 2018.

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  1. Joemama
    Joined: Feb 13, 2004
    Posts: 48

    Joemama
    Member
    from Tacoma, Wa

    Looking for suggestions from the experts. I have a quick change that I need to install a new pinion bearing and cannot get the pinion assembly out try heating the entire center section to 350 and she didn't budge. I was wondering how are these removed with out causing any damage?
     

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  2. GearheadsQCE
    Joined: Mar 23, 2011
    Posts: 2,110

    GearheadsQCE
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    You did take the pinion retainer off didn't you? It's bolted inside the change gear cavity.

    You did just right on the heating. You have to let them heat soak at 350 for a bit, maybe 20 minutes. If you have a temperature gun that will tell you the actual temp of the aluminum.

    Once its hot, you set it with the change gear opening facing down. I use a piece of plywood with a couple of 2x4s.
    Sometimes it will just fall out due to gravity, sometimes you have to help it with a brass hammer or punch.

    If you can't get it out, send it to me. I'll give you $25 for the scrap and pay the freight :D
     
  3. Joemama
    Joined: Feb 13, 2004
    Posts: 48

    Joemama
    Member
    from Tacoma, Wa

    Thank you for the reply. Attached is a pic of the rear of the housing and you can see the pinion retainer is removed. But I could see that as a definitely a potential problem. I let it soak a 350 for 1/2 an hour with a thermal couple on it reading active temp while in the oven.

    I think I'm going to try to reheat and double check the temp. With my IR point and shoot.

    Then try to tap down on wood like you suggested. Hopefully she moves. Cross your fingers. Lol

    I will let you know about the scrap. o_O
     

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  4. GearheadsQCE
    Joined: Mar 23, 2011
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    GearheadsQCE
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    If it's aluminum (looks like it) you could go to 400. I wouldn't try it with mag.

    When you get it out, check back. I can guide you through replacing the bearings with a double tapered roller. More expensive, but bullet proof. You'll love it!
     
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  5. flamedabone
    Joined: Aug 3, 2001
    Posts: 4,440

    flamedabone
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    I block the housing up on the cover end, heat the pinon bearing area with a torpedo shop heater to about 350-400 and gently tap on the nose of the pinion. When the temperature is right, it will gently tap out, or fall out by gravity.

    Good luck, -Abone.
     
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  6. GearheadsQCE
    Joined: Mar 23, 2011
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    GearheadsQCE
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    ^^^^^^^
    If your wife won't let you use her oven.
     
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  7. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 16,093

    gimpyshotrods
    Member

    Yeah, don't do that with magnesium. At minimum, you could ruin the part. At maximum, you could ruin your life.
     
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  8. Joemama
    Joined: Feb 13, 2004
    Posts: 48

    Joemama
    Member
    from Tacoma, Wa

    GearheadsQCE

    Thank you for the help. I reheated the center section to 360 at 30 min insuring the area around the pinion bearings wear 350°. A couple of wacks and the pinion assembly was on my fab bench.

    I definitely want to heat about the double tapper bearing conversion?
     

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  9. grumpy32
    Joined: Apr 1, 2010
    Posts: 213

    grumpy32
    Member
    from Australia

    I wait till the boss of the kitchen goes out for the day.... then the big heating receptacle is all mine to do with as I wish

    Sent from my SM-G920I using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
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  10. GearheadsQCE
    Joined: Mar 23, 2011
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    GearheadsQCE
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    This exactly what I did many years ago. Wife's brand new oven, hadn't even baked one thing in it yet. While she was out, I heated a case and got the pinion out. The only problem was that the smoke set off the detector and the smell wouldn't leave.
    A couple of hours later she returned. NOT HAPPY!!!!!!!
    34 years later, I still have that oven (in my shop)
     
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  11. GearheadsQCE
    Joined: Mar 23, 2011
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    GearheadsQCE
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    Joemama,

    Here is the double tapered roller upgrade in a nutshell.
    Remove ball bearings from pinion
    Replace with modified cones and cup
    Replace nose ball bearing with roller brg.
    Install Posilock pinion nut
    Reinstall pinion assembly
    Modify bearing retainer
    Set pinion preload

    I'll have to check on the actual part numbers. I'm not trying to keep it a secret, but I don't want to tell you the wrong thing.
    When you get the bearings off the pinion, measure the diameter of the pinion shaft. Could be about 1.375" or 1.500". That will make a difference as to which bearing cones you will need.

    Bruce
     
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  12. Joemama
    Joined: Feb 13, 2004
    Posts: 48

    Joemama
    Member
    from Tacoma, Wa

    Bruce

    Thanks for the info. I gotta ask have you thought about doing a tech article? I could definitely use it. I'm not certain about how to set the bearing preload?

    Jeremy
     
  13. GearheadsQCE
    Joined: Mar 23, 2011
    Posts: 2,110

    GearheadsQCE
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    It might take me a few days to get it together. I don't have a Halibrand V8 case here to show but I think I can fake it;)

    Winters has the set-up procedure in their online catalogs. But it doesn't address the bearing change over.
     
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  14. lodaddyo
    Joined: May 5, 2002
    Posts: 1,089

    lodaddyo
    Member

    Sorry to hijack this thread but, i have a rodsville case i am about to build. Its gonna be set up with the ford pinion bearings. My question is, is the pinion support bearing used a stock ford bearing?
     
  15. GearheadsQCE
    Joined: Mar 23, 2011
    Posts: 2,110

    GearheadsQCE
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    I don't know if Rodsville bored their cases for the double tapered roller bearing. If not, you will have to grind the o.d. of the bearing race about .0015".
    My guess is that it does not. Ford used a fractional sized bearing (2.000" o.d. and 1.000" i.d. if i remember correctly.) All the Quickchange cases I have ever worked on used a metric bearing. This means that you have to turn the nose of the pinion to fit. Since you are already having to cut the splined end for the rear cover bearing, that shouldn't be a big deal.

    Do yourself a favor and use a roller bearing on the nose of the pinion. It's only about 100 times stronger than the ball bearing. I have them in stock if you need a source.

    I don't know if Rodsville bored their cases for the double tapered roller pinion bearing. If not, you will have to grind the o.d. of the bearing race about .0015".
     
  16. oldspeed
    Joined: Sep 14, 2004
    Posts: 894

    oldspeed
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    The way I switched over to Original Ford tapered roller bearings (Timken) was to have a machine shop make a sleeve whose inside diameter was .001 inch smaller than the outside diameter of the pinion shaft and the outside diameter the same size as a Ford pinion gear. Heat shrink the sleeve on and no other modifications are necessary. If you are using a Ford ring and pinion you need to have the end of the pinion ground to the ID of the bearing in the cover about 3/4 of an inch long.
     
  17. lodaddyo
    Joined: May 5, 2002
    Posts: 1,089

    lodaddyo
    Member

    This is what it says about the rodsville cases
    880BD848-EF5C-41CB-88DA-8537A457E16F.png
     
  18. GearheadsQCE
    Joined: Mar 23, 2011
    Posts: 2,110

    GearheadsQCE
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Oldspeed,
    That's a way to do that I had never thought about doing it that way. To make it clear to those in, the pinion you are talking about has a reduced shank for the ball bearings that were originally use in the Halibrand. The Ford pinion does not require a sleeve.

    lodaddyo,
    There is your answer, pinion bore is correct for the Timken bearing. The nose diameter bit still applies.
     
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  19. lodaddyo
    Joined: May 5, 2002
    Posts: 1,089

    lodaddyo
    Member

    Yep. I was pretty sure that it machined for the ford taper. Ill send you a message about the pinion nose bearing
    Thanks for the help
     
  20. GearheadsQCE
    Joined: Mar 23, 2011
    Posts: 2,110

    GearheadsQCE
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    I'm outta town for a couple of days. Maybe computerless.
     
  21. oldspeed
    Joined: Sep 14, 2004
    Posts: 894

    oldspeed
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    That is correct, I had a pinion for ball bearings used in the Halibrand. Thanks for the clarification
     

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