You may have an inadvertant point here. Some want to race the way racing was done in '50. Some want to race a '50s looking car the way racing's done today. A few seem to expect both to be the same class designation. I see that last bit as our only actual problem. And simple semantics as a viable response. Perhaps an inclusive designation (say like the already in use "HAMBsters") as an overview of the concept. Then HA/GR, SDRA, etc, as specific classes within it. Thus; HA/GR HAMBsters, SDRA HAMBsters, etc ........ you get the idea. I've known from my first involvement that this thing'll outgrow it's original intent. Such is always the nature of a novel idea (the HAMB itself for instance). It remains only to keep up with that outgrowth in a rational manner. To ride our tiger as it were. Gentlemen, this thing will be bigger than what it presently is. It's among us and won't be bottled up now. We can enjoy the internal dissent that growth factioning automatically brings or we can fall to it and surely see someone else do what we fail to do. That is; find a way to keep it all coherent during it's birthing pangs. Hell, four years is no more than a start for a proper fresh idea. It'll take time to become what it will, and it'll become that with or without any one of us. I also see an interesting facet emerging. There are those who (like myself) had started FED builds. I've begun three and finished none, each for different but common reasons. Along came HAMBsters and I finally found something close that I finished and am enjoying. I'm at a point in my life now where I could go on to another FED project with excellent probability of seeing it done this time. I shan't, as I'm getting what I wanted out of my HAMBster. But others've now found themselves in similar circumstance and are going on into FEDs. They've come to this through the HAMBster "stepping stone", for whatever their own reasons were. This "stepping stone class" aspect is yet another reason I see us persevering. Those continuing up the ladder will most likely look back fondly on the HAMBster rung on their way up. Indeed, Mr. Garlits himself has stated no less on this forum. He's also stated that he hopes we can keep the act together over the long run. Pollyanna perhaps, but I think we can. ps. "Choice of Motor, mmm let me see, could be Hudson, Packard, Cadillac or lightweight Ford........ probably 356 cube Packard 8 bored and stroked to 410 cubes." Dayum, I'll hafta find room for a second slant in ours. Guess the rails're gonna need ta spread a bit in back ......
Vector, HELP, HELP, HELP.....I think I just threw myself in the lion's pit and all I see are teeth and claws. However, the up side is everyone is responding and offering suggestions on how to get more HA/GR dragsters: cubic inch/weight Automatic/manual bias/radial ET limit/no ET limit Sorry if I pissed anyone off. But you have to admit it got everyone thinking and good things usually come from discussions. Ron p.s. I really do like flat motors. But if I built one I would try to make it a killer.
Well as obvious as it is to you , it is not a facft, I have read them and if you look back a few months I actually posted the location of said rules on this forum for somebody who asked . I was being facetious , my point was about continual rule changes .thin end of the wedge ......etc etc . The thing is people move on and move away , the rules get changed a little at a time and before long you are back in 2009 ........ I know everybody says change is inevitable............ but that is bwhat this whole thing is about really ...... backing it up to a time before those changes made it complicated and not fun any more. I guess what I am saying is Kevin Lee came up with a concept,Ryan picked a time in history to recreate, and now that recreation is being eroded a fraction at a time every time the rules get changed for another modern idea.... In my mind it is NOT progress..... progress would be moving to another class which allows the different things ..... Each to his own, and I am not trying to stop anybody doing what they want, I just want to know that the rules for HA/GR will be the same all over the world now and when I finish building and start racing.......... otherwise I won't bother . That is my answer to the question asked in the first post of this thread.and I am sure there are a lot of people feel the same way. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=382802
I'll admit to being a bit ruffled. You repeatedly infer that anyone slower than you has no interest in racing or competition, and it's just not so. You use that to justify modification of the rules to suit YOUR VERSION of "race" and "competetive" in an exclusionary way, all the while claiming the desire to expand our ranks. I guess it's ok to alienate a slower guy, 'cause he don't wanna race anyways. so my 238 inch flathead six is 171 horsepower THIS YEAR. Kinda like riot control beanbags in a .410 single shot. You're 347 horsepower this year- kinda like 00 buck in a 12 gauge over-under, both barrels at once, compared to my "bean bags". but what about next year? You dismiss me as not serious or not competetive, and yeah, It upsets me. I'd like to get my car built, run it, tweak it, save up some more $$, learn how to drive the thing, and maybe next year I come back with 200 horsepower and 1200 pounds. leave the rules as they are, leave your car to the HA/GR rules- maybe you miss a shift or snooze at the tree and my 20 gauge pump BEATS your double barrel. Then what?
Great idea. Where's Ryan's input? If only he can do anything, we're wasting our time talking to each other when we have no ability to change even the most minor of circumstances. I think what a few of us are trying to point out that we haven't outgrown anything, we haven't grown into in the first place. How many 100% ha/gr builds are there, total? How many this year have been completed? 1? Boys, that ain't growth. <---Throws Ron a rope and a dull prison shank. I am of the opinion (and it seems to skew a bit each day as people bring up different points or ideas), that HA/GR is really a guideline, not a ruleset. 95% of us will never race each other. We are racing our little groups of friends. We talk it over with our friends and say, "hows this work for ya Harold? We'll I like it but I don't have any manual transmissions. If you guys want to build some crap, I'll toss in all the trannys".... and so it goes with regional variances. If it had to be 100% on the ruleset, there would have been no cars, no enthusiasm, no spirit in our area. As Ron mentioned, if it looks like a duck... And what is most important? Can't promote a car with an empty track. But if nobody is building anything, we can't showcase anything. If each year, and year after year there are fewer cars being built, then something is not right with the concept. IF, the idea was to grow it. Nothing has been eroded. The HA/GR rules are still just as they were... If more are built that don't apply to the rules, this doesn't put up a big question mark for anybody? People are interested, we're close, but they're not doing what we thought they all would. We're all interested. We're all here, but the builds are different to suit the regions and tastes of the builders. Be happy as it is, be proactive, or watch others be pro-active. Not much more to it than that. Ain't heads up racing we should be doing. Slow guys can beat fast guys all day long with a nice bracket car. My take on it is Ron is having a DAMN good time. And is just trying to show what is working in his area. And I think it's probably frustrating to put up ideas (whether they would work or not) and just have people say "this is how it is", and it's not even the right people saying it. Anybody with an opinion is gonna have an idea. Anybody that's taken their dragster to the track is gonna see some things that could be changed for the better. All anybody can really talk about is their own experiences. Doesn't mean anybody is trying to suit himself. It's all any of us know is ourselves. So it can be taken wrong. I'm in marketing... THAT'S why this whole thing frustrates me. I spend my life improving scenarios. To have a concept, and not do anything with it, or participate in it, is hard for me to watch when it's "possible" little things could make big changes. If we are happy with 12 rules matching cars worldwide, then there is nothing to discuss. But we don't know that....
Quote: Originally Posted by Old6rodder Thus; HA/GR HAMBsters, SDRA HAMBsters, etc ........ you get the idea. I've known from my first involvement that this thing'll outgrow it's original intent. "I think what a few of us are trying to point out that we haven't outgrown anything, we haven't grown into in the first place. How many 100% ha/gr builds are there, total? How many this year have been completed? 1? Boys, that ain't growth." But we have outgrown something. I referred to the concept broadening, not to specific car count. As such it's already in wider application than ever intended. I guess the nut of my lack of understanding is why so many need the title HA/GR when they want something slightly different. They want something else, but to keep the name of the rule set they're changing in the first place? Hell, I admire the SDRA and your own VGR proposal for coming up with unique titles for your own applications instead of hiding under the HA/GR banner. Gentlemen, HA/GR is a specific, with rules in place. HAMBster is a generic that can cover all of'em growing out of the HAMB start. If not HAMBster then something else, there must be ad savvy folks here that can come up with better than a pattern maker can. But then, I've already made that point and am only rewording it here. Perhaps I'm overly sensitive to it though, I truly hated 30+ years of every new deviation from rock & roll being labelled yet another form of "rock". I don't care for disco, island or rap but at least they had the cajones to select their own titles. Ahh, fuggit. My blood sugar must be down again ..............
I'd love to see that Packard happen. Where are the Buick guys? I'd have thought one of those big 8's would have shown by now? Oh well, since Moparsled is planning for 2010, maybe he'll stick 3 brass Linkerts on his flatty for next year. That would be pretty, huh?
Hi 97, Do you want us to put out the feelers for that packard motor? I think we all would enjoy seeing that build, and shake down runs, and the smile on your face when you do that. Joe
HA/GR the CONCEPT can and has spawned a variety of offshoots. HA/GR, the CLASS has specific rules. SDRA, an offshoot that became a CLASS has specific rules. Ya pay yer money and pick a path. It ain't complicated. When the population of cars in any specific class gets large enough, and if there is a significant variation in e.t.'s then methods of equalizing the racing makes sense. I liked the way Goodguys VRA did Top Fuel. The top 8 qualifiers ran TF/A and the rest (8 only?) ran Top Fuel/B for that meet's eliminations. There wouldn't be any glory or satisfaction in sandbagging to win Top Fuel/B.
Mopar, A few years ago we were running a beautiful rear engine alcohol dragster on the 1/8th mile at Osborn, Mo. The car ran 133 in the 1/8th. We were in the final against a young guy in a raggedy-ass 62 Chevy with an injected SBC. I swear the injectors were not much bigger than 1 1/4 inch....old. I mean this car was LOW dollar all the way. Long story, short..... He kicked our butt on the lights and ran his number. After the race he came over and was beside himself cause he beat us. I was actually glad he beat us because he was so proud of what he had done. Had we been running heads-up he wouldn't have stood a chance. So you see, there are ways to equalize the differences between slow and fast cars. All of it is racing IF theirs some kind of equalizer. There isn't a race if one car is slow and the other is fast. Food for thought. Ron
so why do you berate the slow guys as being non racers, and seek to change the equalizers that are built into our set of rules?
Ron, Here's my take. The HA/GR guys appear to be happy with the numbers of cars produced and with the numbers that are attending races. It's not that nobody potentially cares about change. I suspect that they are not interested in change regardless of the outcome, high or low. Hence statements like "these are the rules, it's not that complicated". Which is fine. AND, this is the HAMB, nobody is gonna change anybodys minds... Me, I don't want to change anybodys minds. I'm not racing with you guys. I'm only interested in potentially help increase car counts and builds. That's it. If we have enough, we are good to go. Here, locally, we don't have enough, so we massaged the rules to suit what got peoples interest. Still HA/GR as far as we are concerned. And even though we are calling the Herminator a V/GR on the forums here, I'm putting HA/GR stickers on it. 2 reasons for that. As V/GR here, no flack to take for doing it wrong from the purists. With HA/GR on it at the track, the potential exists for people to find "something" on-line about it and get on board. To me, that's a win-win. I'm not sure why people are down on making them fast... It's a drag car, you built it to take to a track. you build a drag car to go as fast as you can make it go. Ain't a car show. Yet people always knock on the guys going fast. Take it as a compliment. You've got a big target on your back.
Mopar, I'm going to try this one more time. I guess I'm not making my point very well, or not at all. I'm sorry for the confusion. All I'm saying is it isn't a race when one car is a lot faster than the other car. If a 200+ mph Pro Stock lines up beside me in the other lane it isn't a race cause he's so much faster. Now if there is some way to equalize the E.T.'s (bracket race I guess) then if I cut a better light and run my number I can actually beat him. Then it would be a race. Otherwise it's an ass whoppin. And there aren't any equalizers in our rules that I know about. Vector, I think your right and I need to keep my mouth shut and just play with our car. I'd just like to see this thing grow and have more of cars at an event. So far there will only be 3 HA/GR cars here in Sept. at the big nostalgia race. That's what we had last year. Not much growing going on. Thanks for your support. Ron
Ah thanks guys but no thanks , I already have a couple of them.... the motors that is. I am an incurable collector of flathead stuff , got Packards, Fords, Hudsons, Indian motorcycles, Graham, continental,Studebaker and more...just a small obsession. ThePackards are stored in Surrey , BC along with my truck and other stuff I have for my North American trips ...... (there are also about 20 GMC motors there, they are not mine however. My freind and business partner owns them ,they are for his own projects so they are not for sale, but but I am sure I could twist his arm for one if I was going to build something with it.) I have one Packard 359 9 bearing motor two 356 motors and several 327s and 288s along with some transmissions and other parts. I also have a rusted out 48 Packard here in New Zealand which I have dismantled and begun building a lakes roadster with the running gear ...... many projects and spread all over the world. I would really like to live permanently in the USA and visit New Zealand a couple of times a year instead of the other way around. I have the place to build , the equipment ( most of it) and a lot of the parts required, all I need is a change in my schedule to give me the time in one place...
Ron, I think I get ya. Had the same thing happen to me with our low buck Civic build. Car runs 13.9-14.4 depending on the air. the only fun we ever have with it is lining up with some other 14 second car so you get a good race out of it. None of this let the other guy get a 5 second head start and run him down crapola. You want to look over and see another car, the whole pass. Maybe get a little "eye to eye" contact while making a pass... THAT is racin'. I'm with ya. With your power level, and HA/GR lack of promotion, you're not gonna see any competition for a while. My advice? Enjoy the big dog and also build a crappier car to play around with. The build is the best part anyway.
very nearly every one of your posts regarding the rules or build style echoes similar tones to the edited quote above. At first, I thought you just wanted attention, huge smoky burnouts and such, but this makes more sense. It's your nature to NOT leave things alone. Within the concept of HA/GR, this saddens me to no end. I've come to realize that I don't give a CRAP about such ambiguous notions as "in the spirit" or "traditional" or their easily distorted intentions. I don't care about "showing the folks" or "spreading the gospel". I used to think I did, but, as stated previously, I came here to try to feel what it was like to drag race a rail job in 1953, and that's pretty much it. Part of that feeling is seeing an equally vintage rail in the next lane. Have you ever seen that chick flick "Somewhere in Time" where Christopher Reeve transports himself back in time, really inside his own mind, but by trying to become a part of the past? He ends up blowing it by finding a modern penny in his pocket. HA/GR is kinda like that. It's all of our chance to transport ourselves back in time, by trying to become a part of that time, even if only in our own mind. That time is over. It is finite. What actually happened back then can't be changed. There were no smogger 305's, ratchet shifters, or NHRA legal 10 second Altered cages back then. Sure, the "crowd" can't tell the difference, but YOU can, and that's all that matters. How you gonna transport yourself back to 1953 with a 1990 shifter in your hand? so your point of view is that it's OK to water down the original idea of HA/GR with modern, more easily accessed parts in the "good" of promoting a class that maybe ONE guy in the crowd "gets" so that you can what? put on a better show? Make somebody more money? Dilute the true history of drag racing? the whole idea of compromising for the sake of easier marketing, frankly, makes me sick to my stomach. Growth is NOT the same thing as IMPROVEMENT.
You know what... I agree with what you wrote, and it was well written. Just like you, I don't particularly care about anybody around, this ain't for attention. I do 99.9% of my street squirrel activities alone, with a smile on my face. It's not for attention, it's because things like loud engine noises and tire smoke make me happy. Add to this my abilities to make stuff, and guess what, after seeing a few HA/GR cars it combined all the things I like. I get to make stuff, and THEN FLOG IT. I've made cars before, but never to intentionally take it to a track and flog it. This is different than knocking out a frame and plopping a body on it. And not the same as putting a cage in a car you put a 4-link under. This is a different build. To this equation add in my job in marketing, and guess what, I'm asking a lot of questions. Not all of them popular. You're trying to take a trip down memory lane. I am too, but feel it would be more fun with a LOT of people going down it with me. For that, locally, we had to alter things. I'm already racing 4 speed cars, so that thrill isn't gonna give me the feel of vintage anything. I already get that thrill of rowing the boat (at 9500rpm). As to your thoughts on changing things that dilute history. Not everybody is gonna change things. Everybody is looking for something different from the experience. Look at BobW, his build is new, and although I don't know the date on the engine, has a clutch. and to me is pretty straight up HA/GR (and a darn fine build). You can't take a trip down memory lane if you aren't reminded to sometimes. People sitting around the house aren't thinking about building a dragster... You need to see it or here about it, and it has to infect you. And then you'll look for whatever it is in the project that attracts you. For me, It's the fabrication and one upsmanship of a clever build. And this whole thing isn't exactly easy for the average Joe. This also effects changes to builds. How many people can actually build a car from scratch... Not just a car, a RACECAR designed to be taken to high speed from scratch? Preferably made out of old crap? We've got a limited market there. And how many people REALLY should? Ever see all the web posts about bad fabrication? <shudders> Memory lane is different for everybody. You want to be "in the moment" For me, I want to build the car. Parts, schmartz... I built what appears to be a vintage race car, and for me, that's a win. We did it old-school, and I'm enjoying that journey. In my minds eye though, the next build has been tweaked, and it now has a clutch. Not because I care about that rule... But because I want to complicate the build and make it more challenging. There's no way I'm the only guy that takes his family to the carnival and can spend literally 3 hours staring at a ride and trying to figure out how to make it yourself. Not how it was made... how to make it yourself. (did that tonight as a matter of fact). In addition to marketing, I've made a decent living from race car parts I've invented and developed. Put all this together and you can perhaps see how it frustrates me a "smidge" to see no input or effort from people that should be. I enjoy building things, and enjoy the challenge of making things grow and prosper. It's possible I'm really NOT what the HA/GR needs or to be associated with it. And I'm cool with that. I might not have been a few months ago. But perhaps like Ron, I've kind of given up on puting in my 2 cents. That's kind of sad really. Passionate people are good for pursuits you enjoy. I'm mellowing on the whole thing. Remember, I type as fast as most people talk, so I always look like I'm ranting even when I'm just hanging out and typing. When it didn't take but a minute or two. Your comment on the 305 is valid, and even "I" have decided that may be for the best and I'm getting enough grief locally over it so I'm gonna bail on that idea. Back to the 250's. I know we didn't have ratchet shifters in the "day". But you know what, the last time I took my model A to the track, 2 outta 3 passes that stupid shifter went right from first to 3rd no matter how careful I was... I told myself, next time, ratchet shifter. Not trying to intentionally alter a rule, just trying to enhance my experience by learning from past problems. I turned down a SWEET running merc flathead today for $1000 with transmission. Because even though I know it's vintage and badass as hell, It's not what interests me at the moment. Gotta go with what makes you happy. I know dudes think the flatheads are badass, I would be doing it because THEY thought it was cool, not because I thought it was cool. Gotta be true to yourself. I'd have only done it to be cool in other peoples eyes. That's not right, and I passed on it. Took me all day to figure that one out. In fact, Ideally, I think you need to move up here. I'll build you a helluva nice car and you can race the snot out of it. That's a win-win. I've been keeping Coors light in the fridge for just such an occasion. Not because I drink beer, I don't drink or smoke ... but because I had to see that dam can turn blue like on TV... That's pitiful if you think about it... ...lol... (I have a shop tool addiction instead of alcohol or tobacco). Memory lane is different for everybody. Your moment is in the car. My moment is being around a 6-cylinder engine and imagining how my grandfather may have made engine mounts or how they very likely torch welded the car, how they made parts when there was no internet. "You cut that out with a torch"? That's my moment to be in. Just a little more insight into my wife's first husband.
In my (never to be humble ) opinion this's the single largest limiting factor for the shebang as it stands, and the definitive reason for the low growth rate. Only a tiny percentage of those with the skills (already a small percentage of the hobby) will succumb to this particular enchantment when there are so many other facets of the hobby vying for their attention. It'll be the few with an urge to be off the beaten path in addition to their strip calling. It's also the one antithesis to growth. If it were to become wide spread and common those very folks would be less interested. I too enjoy the build (not "assembly") as much as, if not more than, the racing. I'm a scratch builder, the more scratch the better. I happily spend a couple days cobbling a bracket I could get for $6.00 at Orchard, for the fun of it and so it'll be unique. Hell, scratch builders in Sn3 model railroading are literally what started that corner of that hobby and what drew me into it 30 years ago. It grew, and they've mostly left for less populous scale/gauge combinations. There are now Sn3 "shake the box" kits, rtr locos, flex track, rtr turnouts and pre-programmed sound, but damn few scratchers in it. If I weren't in the best 3' club on the planet since it's inception 25 years ago I'd have left this hobby by now as well. I've no crystal ball, only my hopes. But should HA/GR turn as commercial as have skate boarding, hang gliding, paintball, several forms of racing (and the way float building's headed as well), I'll likely mosey on down the road again. I still have a few arcane scratch hobbies left on the ol' bucket list. So 'til this path becomes too beaten I believe I'll tinker with and run my toy.
HA/GR the three headed dragon: Building, Racing, Philosophizing. Preserving/experiencing the past, Going fast/being competitive & Restrictions imposed by NHRA inherently cause conflict, contradictions and unwanted alterations to a beautiful concept. If I could ignore NHRA rules and still race, I'd have a more historically representative car than what I just built. If I didn't care about wanting to run in the 12's or better, I'd have a more historically representative car than what I just built. If I had a lot of money, I'd have a more historically representative car than what I just built. Along with all the cyber-discussion, I had lots of internal debate before arriving at the build I just completed. My car is a compromise. Damn.
Now THIS is a post I can get behind. I too am a tinkerer, fiddler, and tool junkie. Though having you build me a car would never make me happy. It'd have to be me building it. I'm with you on the garage time- I've all but quit going to car shows and cruise nights in favor of putting that time in on a project instead. I like your self insight on the "flathead question" and I like that you made the right decision for yourself. BobW-- all of us have to make compromises on our builds. Good or bad, there are just some things that we can't or shouldn't, do the 1953 way. There are a bunch of reasons, and a bunch of compromises, and we've all been down those roads here on the board. My point was not to say that every car here should be 100% vintage in every aspect, though that would be incredibly cool, it's not realistic. But a reasonable representation, compromised only enough to achieve your goal, is. If you have not one single reasonable representation of vintage parts on your supposedly vintage dragster, what have you built? A brand new Kawasaki Vulcan is not a resonable representation of a '60 FLH, it's a mockery of one. It's a marketing attempt to use visual cues to allow the uneducated consumer to attempt to place himself next to something or someone he has no interest in understanding. I see Vectorsolids build in the same light- he may be doing it for the right reasons for HIM, but for the uneducated copier of his car, there is no reason evident in Vectorsolid's build, to even attempt to learn the lessons of history. That second guy will just build his "Vulcan".
Dang, Mopar nailed it - again. I can't help but agree, because my driver car follows that same concept. Different timeframe, but I'm careful to keep it pre'65 (the last year it hauled untaxed whiskey) as much as possible. I'm finding it entirely impossible to destroy the service station stickers in it that date back to the 50's. There is nothing like hammering down the road in that car, in a different time altogether. To echo another comment, the "build" part in terms of chassis, does intimidate the heck out of me. I've never done anything of the sort before and represents that dreaded "unknown" for me. I don't have the time, money, or resources to mess up on that aspect. I'm an engine man and am fearless when it comes to that end of the equation. How a vehicle is gonna be powered, doesn't worry me one bit, the vehicle itself - major worry. Ultimately, I'd like to have two. An SDRA powered by the Hornet 6, and an HA/GR powered by a Hudson 8. I really don't care how competitive the 8 would be - I just wanna be in the same mindset as Moparsled and have fun with it. For me, either class/designation is all about the engine - the chassis is very important, but secondary in my appreciation.
Always been a tinkerer and tool junkie myself. Need more room in the garage to fit the projects, because the tools take up so much space. Yes, our car will have a "modern style cage" to allow us to run out here on the left coast, but the rest of the parts have as large amount of "vintage" as we can find. The time travel aspect is what brought us to this place in life. As for the "Kawasaki Vulcan" aspect you have scored a direct hit. The "Looks old/new parts" concept feels the same to me as a glass '32 roadster on a new chassis with a Jag rear, IFS and a GM crate motor with fake Olds valve covers. One more place for the "Gold Chainers" to go. Don't worry about the chassis build, just take your time and keep it simple, it ain't rocket science. If you rush things you may get done and say "I should have done it different" so go slow, measure a lot and enjoy the journey. And yes.......it is all about the engine, (and that flathead straight 8 will sound beautiful)!
good stuff, good reading. All of us are just adding opinion to speculation. We could be done, completely with all of it if somebody (rules dudes) would simply say a few things on the matter, and we could point to it when ideas flare up. Out of curiosity, just how many 100% HA/GR cars are there? I'm sure it could be calculated, I think all the build threads are here. 1) Are you happy with the car count we have? 2) Do you want to make the build easier for the sake of increasing car count? 3) Do you want to see it grow, or is it good, as it is? Answers to those will stop a lot of debate. Without knowing what they are thinking, we are guessing. Without their participation, we are speculating on what they are thinking... that never works. As a group, I'd say we are in agreement that we're having a good time, so we have that going for us too.
.Based on the original concept of HA/GR yes I think I have/Had one. In any event its a real live un adulterated 1950 digger that I have to date many hours of love and labor invested. It would have been faster to build one from scratch but I have already got this one and am going for it. So far every piece is 50's and I am looking forward to running it. I don't have a clue what RPM the fatty will run or how fast it will be with the 6 inch tires but its not being done for speed. Its for the adventure of doing it like I did in 1952 and I don't remember much about it because technology got to fast to keep up. I know for sure I will never run bracket racing or index. Its a heads up for me or a single pass. If it was fast I was after I already had that so speed is not the issue. I am equipped with a 39 transmission so speed shifts are not expected and if we all have close to the same old 50's crap we should all be close to equal in et and MPH and if not we need to learn to tune a little better. By stacking more and better transmissions and later type motors we prove nothing other than a money game that has killed heads up novice racing. Regardless of what or where the rules go I am going to complete this digger and will run it in Nostalgia some place and hope to do the Hamb event if it will pass there requirements
If drag racing had not been allowed to fragment into so many different classes and variations within classes there would be no need for psuedo racing ....in the form of bracket racing. If everybody built to the rules, and came up against the natural limits of those rules, most times that comes down to traction..........in the case of HA/GR I think the equalizers are , tires, transmission strength and weight. Everybody has the opportunity to build to the limits or decide how far they want to go . Ya build what you think will win the race, if you lose ya go home and "improve" it (within the rules) and try again next race.....if you win you go home and bathe in the glory of being the track/state/world champion and wonder what you have to do to stay on top, if it gets too boring move up to another class ....isn't that the way of racing? I am sure a HA/GR car can be built lighter than many current builds , still within the rules, there are $6000 stick shift trans' out there that will not break in this context , but we are stuck with tires 6" wide , bias ply "street" tires. Great there is the limiting factor to build and drive to. Everybody seems to be running Cokers, that is fine but there are other tires the same or similar size out there like these http://store.coker.com/825-16-b.f.goodrich-4-5-8-ww.html Would they make "the difference" ?????
6 inch tires will not overcome 150 horsepower difference !! 6 inch tires will not overcome 100 plus additional cubic inches !!
Well put, the part people seem to miss these days is "within the rules", the general trend is more towards "if the rules don't fit my ideas, change them". As for those factors of tires, transmission strength and weight, it seems those options are often overlooked. There have always been different tires that worked better but nobody seems to take the time to look for options, thinking more along the lines of having a "spec tire" will solve the problem when in reality different tires will work better depending on gearing, driving style and horsepower. Transmission strength varies and again depending on driving style and horsepower, the options are out there, and weigh is dependent on the builders style and concept, (within the rules and safety requirements). The game has always been about pounds per horsepower no matter how else you look at it.
The Jalopy Journal
