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Problem with help...

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Cutlassboy68, Jul 31, 2012.

  1. This didn't happen overnight it been coming on for decades. Big business found out that they could do better with part time help. Whatever happened to honesty & loyalty & a honest days work for a honest days pay. This is also a two way street where it works both ways.
  2. Cutlassboy68
    Joined: Dec 3, 2011
    Posts: 593

    from Boone, Nc

    Ok its not all younger people that dont have work ethic. Im only 23 and running my own shop, have been for 3 years. Basically been working alone all year but now im so backed up... Im an asshole of a boss though. I hate smoking and no smoking is allowed in the shop. I let them take a few smoke breaks through the day.
  3. burl
    Joined: Nov 28, 2007
    Posts: 733

    from Minnesota

    I run a machining buisiness but see alot of the same.Its really up to the owners/managment to make this work out or justr just causing your own problems.Its not just a younger generation it can be older as well that does not understand the work ethic we require to be competitive.We have taken on the task of training our own to get what we need.The first six months are dedicated to work ethic.If they dont make thorugh that it will never work out.Actually they ussually leave on their own.It does have a cost but if you dont do something about it you will just be the shop bitching about intead of the ones that everybody else would like to be.
  4. evilone0528
    Joined: Jul 26, 2006
    Posts: 539


    Im just down the hill from you in Hickory and its the same here too.I owned a shop for 11 years and had the exact same problem.I have taken a managers position at a collision shop and have the same problem here too!

  5. Been on both sides of this, I've hired "the best" and the "want to learn" types and just about everyone in between. I have heard it from disgruntled employees from other hot rod shops and feedback through the grapevine from some of my former employees.

    Fact of the matter is as a business owner, I have to balance between a customer that expects me to get a job done on time and on budget and keep an employee happy that wants to make top dollar and work at his own pace.

    It's finding the guys capable of working at the expected paced that is tough, and money is not a factor in this.

    I have no sage advice for any of you here, other than to keep looking.

    This shit is tough to do.
  6. evs1
    Joined: Oct 3, 2010
    Posts: 160


    Actually, it gets better. There is a scheduled 20 minute break at 9am and 2pm, which usually gets stretched into 30 minutes, plus a 30 minute lunch at 11, which turns into a 1 hour lunch break/nappy time. The 2pm break sometimes get's stretched till 3:30 quitting time, except for putting tools away. Showers start about 2:45, change into street clothes and sit in the break room till quitting time. Every morning management would have a planning meeting, then come over and tell us what we were going to do for the day. There goes another 1/2 hour. Then, around noon, we have another meeting with them so they can get info for the afternoon planning meeting.
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2012
  7. outlaw256
    Joined: Jun 26, 2008
    Posts: 2,023


    evs1 you gotta be makin this shit up. if all that happened there is no work going on!
  8. I got thinking about this after reading the preceding posts, and I wondered how it could be that a normal guy like me can weld, fabricate, machine, design etc. and realized that my point of reference might be wrong. I consider myself normal because I hang around with like minded ( and skilled) guys - and that's not who's out there for the most part. I took wood shop and auto shop in high school, and I'm not sure these are still offered in school. I "worked" in Bellflower Auto Center ( a speed shop) and then joined the military - what do you know, I learned a lot including self-discipline and I'm pretty sure the majority of the help out there hasn't been there - all in all, I've been blessed with tremendous opportunities to learn from others and saw them (for the most part) as good deals. But now we live in a very entitlement oriented society and are reaping the results. El Polacko has it right, this isn't an easy gig.
  9. hotrod40coupe
    Joined: Apr 8, 2007
    Posts: 2,562


    We need to bring back the draft. When I was growing up, you knew that eventually you would end up in the military. That is the greatest learning experience a young man can have. As I got older I would prefer to hire Marines because they seem to have a great work ethic and sense of honor.
  10. oldtom69
    Joined: Dec 6, 2009
    Posts: 532

    from grandin nd

    now read this thread and wonder why work is being shipped to China?
  11. Wat_Tyler
    Joined: Jan 30, 2012
    Posts: 82

    from right here

    I read this and compared it to my own experience, and a lot of us sound like my grandfather. I do more and more these days.

    That said, it's not just kids who can't/won't work today. I have a contract installing cabinets in apartment renovations, and I have my gig arranged so I can do almost all of it myself. I have a kid who helps me half a day when I demo the old units, and he works right with me. My son used to work with me on weekends, and I could count on him. I told him, simply, that there was no trust fund waiting for him and that he might as well find something he likes to do and wrap his mind around working for a living for the best part of half a century or so. I also told him to stay in school and get a degree in something that would lead to a professional designation. He did - accounting. He passed his CPA first time, got his Masters, and just got his first promotion after 22 months on his job. He makes 15.5% more than he did when he started. Apparently, he works quite nicely for them, and, yes, I do take some of the credit for that.

    I am regularly asked by passers-by for work. I ask them what they can do - general carpentry skills would be the requirement. They claim to have them, but a couple of questions tell me that they're usually bullshitting me. "How do you cope crown molding?" gets them every time. There is an industry answer that you know even if you can't actually do it, which at least shows you've been in the field. So I continue to go it alone.

    I watch the kids who work for the other contractors. Most of them are texting, talking, or piddling most of the time I see them. There is one guy who spends half his day on walkabout - I literally run into him 10 times a day. I routinely have to throw them out of my kitchens - they don't have the common courtesy to go work in some other room until I am done, and I'm not in there long. They put their tools and equipment right in my way without a thought for what I am doing. I don't get it, really. I learned almost all of what i know from watching someone else do it and then mimicking them.

    I would say that, if you do find a promising prospect, teach him/her everything you can and boost their pay as they become more competent in given areas - even if it's just a dime per hour. It gives them a sense of reward for progressing.

    I'm not bitter . . . really :D
  12. czuch
    Joined: Sep 23, 2008
    Posts: 2,688

    from vail az

    Give them a trophy at the end of the day, give them lunch, a good one not the baloney sandwich you eat. Tellem theyre great and you dont know how you made it work till they came along.
    My wife's daughter's boyfriend (?!) got social security for bi-polar. Fucker's 20.
    Tam went somewhere and needed some gas money. She works, I have a good job, it was between paydays and guess who had money? Mr. has no bills and SS!!!
    My first impression was with bi-polar he could work twice as hard and not get tired. wear one out, the other could take over. Turns out its just more 1 break time.
  13. bdridge
    Joined: Dec 4, 2005
    Posts: 15


    No cell phones and no fucking texting when they do come to work. I'm just saying......
  14. fab32
    Joined: May 14, 2002
    Posts: 13,985

    Member Emeritus

    X2..................and say that to a union man and you'll get a blank stare (or an offer to kick your ass). We've basically lost (or in the process of loosing) our desire to lead a productive life and replaced it with the desire to insist on an entitled one. I know that is not universal....yet,...... but the trend is picking up steam. I can hear the replies to that already so save your breath. We have already passed the mark of over 50% of the population having thier existance dependent on the less than half that are the prouctive portion of our society. Think that mind set is going to change any time soon? DREAM ON!! It's only going to get worse:mad:

  15. Rusty O'Toole
    Joined: Sep 17, 2006
    Posts: 9,475

    Rusty O'Toole

    Been hearing this ever since I retired. Last shop I worked at, the boss was out driving around, his wife and her girlfriend the accountant sat in the air conditioned office complaining about how hot it was, then the other girl finished sweeping the floor so she went and sat in the office, while I was sweating my balls off out in the shop trying to make enough money to support the 5 of us and pay the overhead.

    Meanwhile I was supposed to turn out work while there was no money to buy parts, tools or supplies. No gas for the oxy acetylene torch, no gas for the MIG, I ended up doing a complete body job on a rusted out Crown Vic using a spot welder and a sheet of body metal which was about all I had left. Cheap ass SOB wouldn't even spend $20 for a used trunk lid, I had to build the last 6" of it from scratch.

    All this for $8 an hour off the books no unemployment, comp or benefits. That was the last job I did for someone else. The shop closed shortly after I left, come to think of it that happened to several shops after I left.
  16. The big box store here has a sign that they test for drugs If you use don"t apply.
  17. boutlaw
    Joined: Apr 30, 2010
    Posts: 1,230


    Fab32, YOU Sir, hit the nail on the head!
  18. kscarguy
    Joined: Aug 22, 2007
    Posts: 1,583


    I remember the first body shop I ever worked at. I went in to apply, the owner gave me a blank stare and said I don't have enough experience, blah blah blah, and said goodbye. I left and he followed me outside to have a smoke. I started towards my car and he said, "Is that yours? Did you build that?". "Yes", I replied... "Umm, ahhhh, You start tomorrow..."

    I should have ran away, it was one of the worst jobs ever.
  19. Well said.
  20. 34toddster
    Joined: Mar 28, 2006
    Posts: 1,481

    from Missouri

    Benno, you might want to tell everybody where the tat is located:eek:
  21. evs1
    Joined: Oct 3, 2010
    Posts: 160


    No sir, it is all true. It was like being in a twighlight zone move. It was also one of the biggest chemical/polymer production companies in the world. I was at the flagship sight, it had 6 plastics manufacturing plants inside the facility. I always wondered how they kept their doors open.
  22. 1959apache
    Joined: Nov 22, 2009
    Posts: 2,627


    Well I have machine shop experience have a mechanical engineering degree have a lot of car experience and am looking for a job like you mentioned. People don't want to hire me because I am overqualified and are afraid I will leave for something better. Move closer and I will work for you lol
  23. Cutlassboy68
    Joined: Dec 3, 2011
    Posts: 593

    from Boone, Nc

    They should all be burned!! I completly hate cell phones!

    Forgot to mention my genius that came in to "apply for a job" I guess is what you would call it last week...
    I was blocking out a car and i see this shadow behind me. Figured it was last flunky seeing what i was doing. I kept working, and a few minutes later I turned around. Theres this kid standing there. and I ask can I help you? All he said was, "Can I work here?", not hello my name is... or hey there are you looking for help... I responded back, I dont know can you? What can you do? and theres something about that question that stumps every one. I love it!
  24. I know your pain! I used to work in the Hi-Tech world and the details of my resume scared many employers away. The figured they couldn't afford me and if they did hire me I would leave in a heartbeat for someplace else. I found that if I dumbed down (or make the resume a little vague) my experiences and qualifications I would get more offers. Once I was employed for a while my skillset would speak for itself as well as my demeanor. I always got better than average raises and never had a negative review.

    Don't lie, just don't be as detailed as you would like to be on your resume. Watch what you post on Facebook or the like too! Have several resumes of different flavors tailored to the exact company you are applying for. Even better if you can find out who the HR person is. A couple anonymos phone calls asking the receptionist who it is works or look at the website for clues. I have called numbers listed asking for Allan in HR. They say "WHO?" Play dumb and say I have a note saying to call Allan, is that not the HR managers name. They will almost always come back saying "No Allan but there is a Sam what-his-face".... BINGO!

    Good luck!
  25. Why work when you can get welfare just for being lazy or squirting out kids or you can work a meaningless job for a while & then get unemployment for years. Gotta love liberal socializm
  26. Special Ed
    Joined: Nov 1, 2007
    Posts: 6,562

    Special Ed

  27. I've been on some jobs like that - sort of. Extremely adverse working conditions, and it was 5 mins on 25 mins off with 6 crews of 6 guys. During the off time we helped the guys suit up for their 5 min shift and unsuit after.
  28. Cshabang
    Joined: Mar 30, 2004
    Posts: 2,458


    "You want steady, reliable help? That will be a family man with responsibilities.
    You want cheap help? That will be inexperienced
    You want good help cheap ? They will have issues and addictions
    you want the best ? They want and deserve top $$$.

    The family man wants, needs a steady check, some type of medical, and no 1099 BS.
    The inexperienced help need to be taught and watched like a hawk.
    The guy with issues who is good will tax your reputation and try your patients (pun)
    The best pretty much call their own game and don't have to put up with your crap. They will make you money if you treat them right and set the deal up right. They are machines and if you maintain your crap they go and produce quality."

    I couldnt put it better myself..I like to think Im in the last department, but as Jimmy White once said to me "I may not be the best, but I sure as hell do my best" Im always learning, will be till the day I die, only makes me a better fabricator and person...I dont include the rise in monetary worth, but Im not gonna sure as hell helps when Im setting my goals haha
  29. Rattle Trap
    Joined: May 11, 2012
    Posts: 358

    Rattle Trap

    My Wife and I owned a bar for ten years. I can only remember a few employees that did the job well in all of the ten years. Most were caught stealing in one way or another.

    I have been working at SPAWAR here in San Diego for the last six years. The things I see amaze me. I wasn't there two months and we had a full on drug raid. Yes a drug raid at a federal facility. I was starting to wonder where the hell I was working by the end of the day. In six years time most every guy that was working there when I started has been fired for a dirty piss test. And you want to talk about lazy. I still don't know what some of my co-workers are actually supposed to be doing.
    I am one of those weird guys that likes to work. I enjoy working. I get great reviews every year. Which is pretty easy to do around a bunch of slackers. Most days I am off doing my own work and keeping to myself so I don't get pissed off at some know it all moron trying to tell me how to do MY job when he has no clue as how to do his own.
  30. Zeke
    Joined: Mar 4, 2001
    Posts: 1,716


    And you seriously think the military needs more retards deal with. I got out because the Army became a daycare center for adults.

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