My son and I pulled out my grandfather, his great-grandfather's 1955 Pontiac Chieftan this weekend from the shed it had been parked in since 1964 when he started going blind. We had 3 generations working all day to get it out...long story tight quarters in a rural neighborhood. My son and I are going to take it on as a project car so I began researching several weeks ago. It appears that a 1959 389 will bolt on to the hydramatic transmission fairly easily. We would like to upgrade to that versus trying to max out the stock 287 and probably still not have the stock HP of the 389. This will be our first project car, and I know some about Ford's as my Dad is a big mustang fan but completely new to Pontiac and my son and I are very excited. Sorry for being long-winded but I found this "Eight classic V8's for sale" on craigslist and they are said to be 50's and 60's Pontiac V8's. As I said above we would love to find a 1959 389 to avoid a transmission swap also. I have read about the date codes at the distributor cap locations and asked him to look at those and he said 3 motors left and the codes were, C118, G229, J169. From what I had read the last number was the year it was cast, but then I wondered could that be 1959, or 1969. The location is a 4 hour drive one-way, and I would like to verify it more before I drive that far, although I think it is a very good price. So my long-winded question is there a way to verify they are 1959's easily before I drive there? I have attached pictures of the original 8 he had for sale so not sure which 3 he still has to see if anyone can ID by the pics. Thanks very much for any help!
The second and last pics are Buick v8 also known as Nailheads. Good engines, without seeing the casting numbers I can't ever tell the difference between the cubic inches. Also on the 3rd picture appears from what I can tell from the casting number on the intake it appears that one might be a 60 Pontiac. Maybe from a bonnevile.
OK thanks guys he said he had 4 total left. Three Pontiacs and a nailhead. So if they are pre-64 the "9" date code should be 1959.
'64 was the transition year to block-mounted starters, the late blocks have a cast ear on the back with two holes to mount the starter.
Yeah graveyard from what I read it appears most 59 intakes start with 5392*** so I may buy both 59's as parts or to resale to compensate for purchase. Thank you guys very much. I plan to start a project thread for our build soon.
By the way it is a 1955 Pontiac Chieftan 2 door post, and after starting our inspection after pulling it out found it had the apparently rare "heated seat" option even though I did not see it listed on the body tag under the hood. Maybe I was just reading it wrong.
1959 was the first 389 and the last with reverse cooling, water pumps directly into both heads and then through the block. I can see from the pictures that there is likely a '59 engine sitting there, the lifting loop cast into the front of the intake was a '60 and earlier feature and I can see the water pump connections to the heads. If the block date code shows it being cast in late 1958 or up to about August of 1959 and the head casting number is 531395 on the two center exhaust ports (1959 389 only) you're golden. Here's a link to my thread showing a 1959 389 in detail:http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/1959-pontiac-389.996461/ Just now saw one of the 2-barrel engines has the correct casting number for 1959 on the intake manifold - 532119. Go get it. Get a couple of them, there's likely more than one '59 389 sitting there.
Thanks guys! What do you think a "good" price would be for an early 389 like this? Thanks very much for the link to all the pics that was very helpful. I may hit you up on Messages as I hope to convert to Tri-Power if I get one of these. Here is the one I would really like to get, an original Tri-Power but it is 4 times as much and even further away...
So it seems this guy has at least 3 maybe 4 1959 389 motors. If I thought there was a big demand for these I would be tempted to buy them all.
In the '70s I put a '64? 389 Tri-Power in my "55 Catalina hardtop with an adapter "horse shoe" bell housing to mate it to the '55's slant pan" 4 speed Hydro that I rebuilt and modified. The adapter provided a starter mount and came with a flywheel spacer (I think) Cant remember who made it but it was common back then and the 389 with the Hydro was a great package.
If they're cheap enough and you have the room, buy 'em all. The '59 blocks are very strong, they are good candidates for high-HP builds. There are a couple of guys working on adapters to mate them to the '64 and later BOP transmissions:http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=732389 Would be a shame to miss out on that Tri-Power engine, gathering up an original set of '59 Tri-Power carbs and an intake might cost you as much as buying that entire Tri-Power engine.
1959 389's are hard to find but those looking for them are also hard to find. Being a one year engine always makes for a hard to find engine. If that is an all original tri-power it probably does make it far more valuable. If it's what you want, you are going to pay now or later.
I've seen bare 2-bolt main '59 blocks selling for $350 to $400, already cleaned and crack checked. These are for folks only wanting the block for a high-HP build, the '59 blocks are known for having thick cylinder walls, beefy main caps and a reinforced pan rail. A complete engine sold with the hope that all's well and usable for a rebuild might go in the $200 to $400 range. I paid less than $200 for mine, I drive a hard bargain.
I was wondering the same which would be better to go ahead and buy the whole tri-power assembly with trans all together or buy 3 engines and make some money on 2 of them to try to get parts together myself for a tri-power...He is asking $300 each if I take 3 of them the Tri-power with trans is asking $1200 obo for complete setup but may need rebuild...
I'd go six bills for all three 389s, it's not like buyers are coming out of the woodwork for those. Offer 8 bills for the Tri-Power engine. The carbs go for right at 150 each restorable and the '59 Tri-Power intake goes for about one Benjamin at best, not a popular intake because they only fit '60 and earlier heads. There's not a whole lot of performance intake choices for the early engines, grabbing up that complete Tri-Power setup and engine would be a wise move. Good luck, let us know how it goes.
So things have changed. The guy with the tri-power engine has come down on his price by over half from $1200 to $500. He apparently had someone low-ball him at $500 "because the engine has rust on it" and he got mad and ran them out of his shop. Since then he has removed the intake manifold and heads and found rust on the valve seats and cylinder walls, and also crushed the oil pan with the weight of the engine. He is now willing to take "$500 for everything disassembled". Looking on epay it looks as though the air cleaner alone sells from $300-$600 and then I would have all of the original tri-power carbs and linkage, and an extra transmission, and possibly block to sell. I could then buy the other engine basically just for the bottom end to use and sell the top half of it. So the way I see it I would break even or have little in 2 engines.
Be sure to post pics of your engine parts score when you get it all home. Would like to see some pics of the '55 project car as well. True that the air cleaners used on the big Pontiacs as opposed to the three small chrome ones on the GTOs are pricey, I have close to $600 invested in mine.
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