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Projects Paint Help - Epoxy Primer

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by SCOTT MacIntosh, Apr 4, 2019.

  1. SCOTT MacIntosh
    Joined: Apr 4, 2019
    Posts: 4

    SCOTT MacIntosh
    Member

    Hello guys, new here. Not working on a hot rod however, I am restoring an older tractor and am looking for some tips regarding painting it. I have already done the chassis and everything, and now I'm on to the hood and fenders. Since this is the most prominent part of the machine I would like to do a nice job on it. I've sandblasted the parts in question and am working on sanding them down by hand now to prep for primer. I would like to spray them with an epoxy primer for now, and then work on my bodywork later, as I work on it somewhat sporadically, I don't want it starting to rust if I leave it in bare metal (I can see the ocean from my front step, so things rust here easily). then once I get my bodywork sorted, lay down some urethane primer. top coat I'm leaning towards base then clear urethane? I do have a can of "OEM" acrylic enamel which has yielded decent results in the past. I'm pretty sure you can spray that over a urethane primer or at least I've been getting away with it.

    Am I going about this the right way?

    I have been to 2 local auto parts stores and was kind of encouraged not to use epoxy primer at all, and just use regular primer, wash primer or self etch primer. They said "nobody uses epoxy primer, you don't need that" One guy also told me that the epoxy primer HAS to be sprayed "wet on wet" and that once you spray it you need to put a topcoat over it almost immediately. He also said that it was "highly toxic" much more so than regular paints and that you had to either have a fresh air respirator to use it, or use it outside. All of this kind of confuses me, as everything I've read online seems to say nothing about any of this?

    Anyway, I'm a bit of a novice painter (totally novice I wont lie), so I'm looking for any advice I can get. It seems the more I read into this stuff the more my head starts to spin, then when I try to actually buy the products it just gets even worse.

    Thanks for any help.
     
  2. TagMan
    Joined: Dec 12, 2002
    Posts: 5,781

    TagMan
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Have you read the manufactuer's specific instructions for the product you're spraying ?? Every epoxy primers I have worked with a specific window of time to have any other coats (hi-fill, color, etc.) applied. I recall the last time I used epoxy primer, that window was 3 or 4 days. After that time, the primer had to be scuffed before additional coats of anything were applied.

    Good air mask (NOT dusk mask) is absolutely essential unless you want to spen the rest of your life pushing an oxygen tank around to help you to breathe and that's a good scenario compared to what else breathing that stuff could do to you.

    Also, don't mix brands of paint.

    Epoxy primer & paint are grea products and are used, as far as I know, a lot. You do have to read up on how to use them and to respect them. Also. they're too damn expensive to buy & use to ignore the manucturer's instructions......or so it seems to me.
     
    Frankie47 likes this.
  3. john worden
    Joined: Nov 14, 2007
    Posts: 1,392

    john worden
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from iowa

    DO not take any of the parts store advice except the inhalation warning.
    DO use epoxy primer. It does not require wet on wet. Acrylic enamel w/hardener would be an excellent choice.
    Your plan is sound.
     
    tb33anda3rd and Frankie47 like this.
  4. Oldioron
    Joined: Dec 12, 2018
    Posts: 515

    Oldioron
    Member

    From what your describing epoxy primer is what I would use. After sitting the window as described above it will need to be sanded before priming or filler work. After that urathane primer sand and paint with your choice of paints.
     
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  5. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 4,189

    anthony myrick
    Member
    from al

    1 Wear a real paint respirator
    2 Epoxy is great for resto/custom work. It dries too slow for production ( normal body shop) work
    3 Doing body work on top of epoxy is great. I recommend waiting a day before applying any filler
    4 never take paint advice from people that also sell mufflers
    5 epoxy Does Not have to be wet on wet only. Just sand like normal before top coating
    6 painting over a urethane or epoxy is fine
    7 always ask for the paint tech sheet and read it before use.
    8 always ask the hamb paint questions before trusting a guy behind the counter
    I usually epoxy over bare metal then do body work. I then use a polyester primer to finish up the straightness of the body. Then seal with epoxy before painting
    A urethane is also fine, depends on personal preference
    Paint choose is up to you. Enamel, urethane, base/clear all look great with proper prep work
     
    JNKYARDDOG_1 likes this.
  6. SCOTT MacIntosh
    Joined: Apr 4, 2019
    Posts: 4

    SCOTT MacIntosh
    Member

    Thanks guys, sounds like I did the right thing asking here.

    I usually use a 3M mask, I think its a 6000 series? has the cartridges on it. Is that sufficient or should I be using something else. Definately don't want to be pushing around an oxygen tank...
     
    The37Kid likes this.
  7. Pats55
    Joined: Apr 29, 2013
    Posts: 131

    Pats55
    Member
    from NJ

    The fact that you can see the ocean from your front steps and you are going to do this in stages I would like to offer little advice. If you leave the car in primer eventually it will rust whether it be a year or for five years. What I did with my 55, I acid washed it two coats of my primer followed by SANDABLE urethane or epoxy primer. And then your topcoat's..http://www.tnemec.com/content/news/...ime-at-coal-fired-power-plantsbr#.XKaiO5hKjDc This is how you put up a good fight with mother nature. Good luck with your project I painted that car in 2006 and is held up great
     
  8. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 4,189

    anthony myrick
    Member
    from al

    If you google the paint products name and part number you can find the tech info online

    If you have a pre 1965 tractor. Post it on the antiquated forum here
     
  9. Pats55
    Joined: Apr 29, 2013
    Posts: 131

    Pats55
    Member
    from NJ

    Sorry I didn't realize it was tractor fenders Ill go back to sleep now
     
  10. jbon64
    Joined: Jul 26, 2006
    Posts: 437

    jbon64
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

  11. SCOTT MacIntosh
    Joined: Apr 4, 2019
    Posts: 4

    SCOTT MacIntosh
    Member

    It won't be a 5 year project, I hope haha. It'll be done and painted hopefully within the next 6 months.

    Tractor is not quite that old, late 70's.
     
  12. SCOTT MacIntosh
    Joined: Apr 4, 2019
    Posts: 4

    SCOTT MacIntosh
    Member

    I've read good things about the SPI stuff, I'm open to recommendations on brand. The local auto parts places have nason, and I think the other might have PPG but it didn't look like they had much stock if any. Haven't found anything else yet. I can get Eastwood online, I'll look into SPI.
     
  13. tb33anda3rd
    Joined: Oct 8, 2010
    Posts: 14,475

    tb33anda3rd
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    1. Connecticut HAMB'ers

    the paint companies use the term "wet on wet" and it is confusing. it does not mean the primer has to be wet to top coat it. what it means is, it has the ability to be top coated without sanding, and in the case of epoxy primer there is a time window. as stated above, once the window is closed it will need to be scuffed or reacted with the epoxy.
    your plan is good, carry on.
     
  14. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 4,189

    anthony myrick
    Member
    from al

    Spi is great stuff
    PPG is also great
    I use ppg industrial line products at school. The EPX epoxy is great and better priced than the automotive lines. The ppg defleet paint is a great cost effective product
     
  15. Paint_Rep
    Joined: Feb 10, 2017
    Posts: 59

    Paint_Rep

    PPG DP Epoxy Primer. Best in the business. Can do bodywork over or under. Can be directly topcoated. Best corrosion resistance in the game. Just remember, all epoxys have a recoat window. DP is seven days....which is fine, just a light scuff, and reapply a coat. That is directly off the P-Sheet. Sold it and used it for years!

    Sent from my SM-G960U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  16. FunnyCar65
    Joined: Mar 11, 2007
    Posts: 2,069

    FunnyCar65
    Member
    from Colorado

    PPG Viberance line VM 2050 epoxy primer, hi build and priced right!
     
  17. belair
    Joined: Jul 10, 2006
    Posts: 7,887

    belair
    Member

    I too would like to know what kind of or if a cartridge filter is good enough to spray spray epoxy with.
     
  18. My epoxy primer has a week window to put another coat on it. If you wait more than a week, the epoxy primer you've already put on the part needs to be scuffed [sanded] to give the surface a "tooth". This stuff is harmful to your health but I was able to use a common respirator with fresh filters. I also had a lot of ventilation. I also used a pair of paper coveralls and gloves just to be safe. My body man wasn't paying attention to the safety measures and ended up in the hospital with isocyanine poisoning...no joke.
    The finished product is my avatar. 34paintingparts.jpg
     
  19. Budget36
    Joined: Nov 29, 2014
    Posts: 2,042

    Budget36
    Member

    Brings up a good topic....suggested respirators to use with today's stuff?
     
  20. indyjps
    Joined: Feb 21, 2007
    Posts: 3,572

    indyjps
    Member

    Use epoxy, who's not gonna sand the primer on an old car... the advice you were given was for a production shop environment.
    Pay attention to the recoat window, you want to apply several coats of epoxy within the recoat window.
    I prefer to let it sit and cure really well, sand then apply a build primer, if you want to do it all at once just learn the recoat and use compatible products.
     
  21. s55mercury66
    Joined: Jul 6, 2009
    Posts: 3,261

    s55mercury66
    Member
    from SW Wyoming

    If you want to be safe, supplied air is the only way to go. Yes, I have painted with cartridge type respirators many times, over many years, but I am not going to say it's okay to do so. I have known and worked with a lot of dead painters, some of whom did not die a pretty death.
     
    Sporty45 likes this.
  22. tb33anda3rd
    Joined: Oct 8, 2010
    Posts: 14,475

    tb33anda3rd
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    1. Connecticut HAMB'ers

    be careful with too much build up of epoxy. one light coat is all that is needed. I have had trouble with it lifting in areas that were too heavy or "puddled".
     
  23. chopolds
    Joined: Oct 22, 2001
    Posts: 5,620

    chopolds
    Member
    from howell, nj
    1. Kustom Painters

    Your parts guys do NOT know paint. I use HOK KP-2 almost exclusively. It is an epoxy, but unlike the regular manufacturers type. You can sand it, easily. It fills scratches, and small pits. It seals, too. One product to do the work of 3.
     
    loveoftiki likes this.
  24. Look into PPG CRE epoxy primer...killer high build stuff. If you need to re coat scuff and shoot..this stuff sands awesome!

    A 3M 7192, 7193 will work fine provided you don’t use it past its exposure limit..people buy those and think its a lifetime purchase. Keep it in a sealed container when not in use. 30-40 hours of exposed usage is a good gage, maybe keep a record of paint times. Don’t wear it “till ya smell stuff”

    The real question is.....Where the hell do you live that you can see the ocean from your stairs and also have a tractor??? Sounds like Heaven
     
    SCOTT MacIntosh likes this.

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