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Hot Rods Paging Pgan - Build thread for the sedan?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Boatmark, Nov 5, 2017.

  1. Malcolm
    Joined: Feb 9, 2006
    Posts: 7,470

    Malcolm
    Member
    from Nebraska

    @pgan I'm enjoying following along with your progress and thought process. Making good headway!

    A short socket with extension through the hole in the axle flange usually works here, too -
    [​IMG]
     
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  2. pgan
    Joined: Apr 7, 2009
    Posts: 187

    pgan
    Member

    Yes, I was careful. After reuniting engine and trans and setting up my barnyard hoist, I did get the engine/trans installed in the chassis. no360.JPG
    It's definitely a tight fit with the 700R trans and as much of the stock X-member as we retained.
    no362.JPG
    Now I get to start bolting goodies onto the engine, starting with manifolds and pulleys
    no364.JPG no366.JPG
    No chrome of polish here, but selected colors and fasteners. I like the bare-metal look of the early valve covers; what do you think?

    no368.JPG
    Here's one totally off topic, 'cause I know there are a couple of pedal-collectors out there. The one on the left I made in high school metal shop, after tracing my size 13 pointy-toe shoe on a piece of 1/8 steel plate. The one on the right I just got at the Eagle Field swap meet. Never seen anything like it, but had to have it since I was born in Visalia, CA. The guy claimed it was the operating pedal for a bead-blast cabinet.

    no369.JPG
    Next up, exhaust system, then gas tank and fuel lines, after appropriate paint coatings, of course. But today's Sunday. I'm going for a hike in the mountains.

    Later, Pat
     
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  3. pgan
    Joined: Apr 7, 2009
    Posts: 187

    pgan
    Member

    P.S. Malcolm--You're absolutely right. I do this so seldom, I tend to completely forget what that hole is in the axle flange for. Quicker and easier with a ratchet wrench.
    PG
     
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  4. louisb
    Joined: Oct 13, 2008
    Posts: 935

    louisb
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Could nickel plate the valve covers. Get about the same look.

    —louis
     
    Tim likes this.
  5. Dave Mc
    Joined: Mar 8, 2011
    Posts: 1,835

    Dave Mc
    Member

    Jethot coating looks good too
     
  6. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 12,189

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    Those are pretty sought after if they were OEM chromed Chevy covers, not that the plating was great but still cool looking.
     
  7. Atwater Mike
    Joined: May 31, 2002
    Posts: 9,775

    Atwater Mike
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Great choice for the most beautiful of the Fordors...the '33. Love the 'scoopy' grille, a bang-up job straightening and rechroming it!
    Just thrilled that your son Bill had a hand in this build, Pat. You and Anna will look good in there...
    -"Uncle Mike"
     
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  8. Stovebolt
    Joined: May 2, 2001
    Posts: 3,258

    Stovebolt
    Member

    Love that Jimmy McGurk 5 carb intake on your "picture-board" Pat.

    lots of great parts - 5 carbie adapters and 5 97's make it a very desirable piece.

    I just bought one that has been modified to suit a Stovebolt head - the outlet holes were welded up, and re-drilled in order to suit the smaller port spacings. It's on the water at the moment, can't wait for it to arrive.
     
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  9. teach'm
    Joined: May 8, 2005
    Posts: 287

    teach'm
    Member
    from Tucson, AZ

    You may have mentioned it earlier @pgan, but are you planning to run a mechanical fuel pump with the Hurst-style front mount, or did you plumb in an electric pump? Thanks, great fordor.

    -Ryan
     
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  10. pgan
    Joined: Apr 7, 2009
    Posts: 187

    pgan
    Member

    Ryan, since you value teaching, this simple question deserves a slightly complex answer. The Hurst-type mount is big, bulky, and old-fashioned. And it puts a bit more stress on the engine/trans connection (but not much). Plus it negates use of a mechanical fuel pump. So I asked Bill why he used it. He said it was to allow proper mounting of the Vega steering box. You can see the box is mounted right where an engine sidemount would go, and steering linkage angles are excellent. Steering is very important. The fact I wanted rams-horn exhaust manifolds might be a factor.
    I'm a strong believer--especially on hot rods--that simpler is better. The engine is a low-po 307. This is a cruiser, not a racer. I would have much preferred a stock mechanical fuel pump. For one thing, they shut off if the engine quits for any reason (I torched the J-2 Olds engine in my '32 Chevy thanks to a big S-W electric pump). And they hardly ever quit when the engine is running (unlike electric pumps).
    That said, my '32 roadster has an electric pump. It is mounted under the body, near the tank, and it has an in-line filter and an adjustable pressure regulator. I've had no problems with it. But it's imperative to mount a good-quality fuel pressure regulator with any electric pump (or any high volume/pressure pump), and set it so the pump doesn't blow the float needle off the seat in your carb(s), leading to flooding and possible fire. This also requires some sort of fuel pressure gauge. See? It's getting complicated.
    Plus I carry a spare identical electric pump under the seat in the '32, as I will in the '33. Why is obvious.
    Mounting the gas tank and fuel lines in the '33 will be one of the next steps, so I show more then. You probably thought this was a simple question.
    Thanks, Pat
     
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  11. teach'm
    Joined: May 8, 2005
    Posts: 287

    teach'm
    Member
    from Tucson, AZ

    Thanks for the detailed reply @pgan.
     
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  12. Looking good Pat. Good to see the pics of your roadster on the internet at Early Times and LARS with the mag wheels. I like the car both ways


    Sent from my iPhone using H.A.M.B.
     
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  13. Boryca
    Joined: Jul 18, 2011
    Posts: 604

    Boryca
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Detroit

    Interested to see your exhaust routing, especially with that brake system. Thinking a lot about this for my 35...

    Mike
     
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  14. Pete Eastwood
    Joined: Jul 27, 2011
    Posts: 793

    Pete Eastwood
    Member
    from california

    Pat
    Derek told me you got this car from Bill Magraf.
    Was it the green one he had?, if so I can tell you a lot about it !
     
  15. pgan
    Joined: Apr 7, 2009
    Posts: 187

    pgan
    Member

    Peter,
    That's how I ended up at Bill's Early Ford store in San Dimas. He had two out there that I saw, the green one and another. But of course they were quite pricey--for 4-doors. So I looked all over the country (even Canada), but everything I saw for less was junk. So I went back to Bill's but he had just sold both. In their place was the red-primered one I got. Pricey, but pretty darn nice and original. It had a decal from Kirtland AFB, NM in the windshield, and as I showed a couple pages back, under the red primer was khaki green. So I figure this car was sold directly to the Army in '33 and spent most of its life on the very dusty, but totally rust-free, New Mexico base. When I mentioned this to Tom Prufer, he said "I know Kirtland AFB...they did nuclear testing there." But so far nothing glows in the dark.
    Pat
     
  16. Rckt98
    Joined: Jun 7, 2005
    Posts: 861

    Rckt98
    Member

    Haha. Hope you were wearing a lead vest when prepping the body.
     
  17. pgan
    Joined: Apr 7, 2009
    Posts: 187

    pgan
    Member

    OK. Someone said they wanted to see the exhaust system on the car. I was going to let a muffler shop do this (though my good, long-time muffler shop is now gone...like so much else here). Then I saw the system Bill made for a customer's '34 coupe--all TIG-welded from mandrel U-bends in stainless. I said, "That's a work of art. I can't afford stainless, but I think I need that on my car. Nobody will see it but me. But it will be worth it." It wasn't cheap. But it's worth it.
    Here's the front:
    no370.JPG
    Here's most of the rear:
    no371.JPG
    And here are some detail shots. I used Eastwood's Hi-Temp flat silver spray paint on it (as opposed to the brush-on) and one can did this. I had to take the master cylinder, pedal, and some brake lines out to get the left pipes in. And I couldn't help myself; I had to splurge and get the tailpipe sections chromed. Bill said, "Nobody will see them." I said, "I will."
    no372.JPG
    no373.JPG

    no374.JPG

    no375.JPG

    no376.JPG

    So here's where we are this morning. Exhaust system and driveshaft in. Gas tank, fuel line, and trans cooler next. Still working on engine oil-fill/breather set-up. We'll see. Back to work.
    no377.JPG

    Or is this play?
    Pat
     
  18. Dave Mc
    Joined: Mar 8, 2011
    Posts: 1,835

    Dave Mc
    Member

    Those downturn exhaust tips will make a mess of your following friends car on Dirt parking areas , I happened to get behind something similar while getting to my spot at the Fairgrounds once .
    Your project is looking real clean so far .
     
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  19. 1lucky1
    Joined: Apr 19, 2009
    Posts: 1,077

    1lucky1
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Morgan NJ

    Great job on the exhaust,Now everyone Saw it,Where did you get the flanges from,Any gas jet between them,Love the chrome Tips,Perfect!
     
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  20. 0NE BAD 51 MERC
    Joined: Nov 12, 2010
    Posts: 983

    0NE BAD 51 MERC
    Member

    For some reason I thought she was flathead powered. but having built a couple flat head cars over the years. A 40 with a 53 Merc and a 41 { both great and fun cars} I think the small block and overdrive are better choices for a road touring car for you and Anna to cruise off into the sunset with. Of coarse being a Ford in a Ford guy A 302 and aod would have been a good choice too! :rolleyes: Thanks again for taking time from your retirement to share this with us. Larry
     
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  21. brad2v
    Joined: Jun 29, 2009
    Posts: 1,613

    brad2v
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Niiice exhaust. Having built my very first one for the beater in my avatar, I have a whole new appreciation for a nicely turned out exhaust system.
     
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  22. Never2old
    Joined: Oct 14, 2010
    Posts: 527

    Never2old
    Member
    from so cal

    I guess I missed it, but where will your battery live?
     
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  23. pgan
    Joined: Apr 7, 2009
    Posts: 187

    pgan
    Member

    Yo Never2: I love that little red roadster pickup. Hope it's yours.
    I've given the battery type and location lots of thought. One of today's jobs is to mount the trans cooler, which will go in the rear X-member opening on the right side. That leaves a cavity between the X-member and framerail under the pasenger's seat/feet, where the battery was mounted when I got the car. But it hung down so far it got caught on the trailer, and bent, when I brought the car home.
    Since there's no storage area in an early Ford sedan, and since the back seat will be primarily for luggage, and since I have to make a frame for it from plywood, I plan to keep the upholstery fairly thin back there, and make the rear cushion hinge forward. Interstate makes a pretty thin 12V battery, and I'll make a mount for it in the right rear corner, behind the back seat.
    I was thinking of a marine-type plastic case that I could vent through the floor, but they're too big. I've also looked at several "mini" batteries, or dry sealed ones. But I prefer a regular battery, that I can charge with a regular charger (if necessary), and replace anywhere. That's what I have, mounted in a custom metal box, right behind the seat in the trunk of my '32 roadster, and it's been totally trouble-free. Then I remembered that I have driven various VW bugs for decades, daily, with a regular, unboxed battery mounted under the rear seat cushion, about an arm's length away. And look at me. I'm still perfectly normal. Right?
    Cheerio, Pat
     
  24. Never2old
    Joined: Oct 14, 2010
    Posts: 527

    Never2old
    Member
    from so cal

    Yeah I just got the rpu “finished” and working out some bugs. My ‘33 two door is next.
    There are a couple more model 40s being built on here so I’m chomping at the bit to get after that rebuild.
    By the way the rpu has a Miada battery behind the seat.


    Sent from my iPhone using H.A.M.B.
     
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  25. pgan
    Joined: Apr 7, 2009
    Posts: 187

    pgan
    Member

    Lotta things going on around here (such as my new column on Bill's "South City" web site), but don't think I haven't been out in the garage in between. The one problem I've been trying to solve for some time was how to devise some breather/oil-fill/PCV valve setup for this engine, not wanting to cut holes in my early Chev 283 valve covers, and not having room for a front manifold filltube/breather because of the AC/alternator/rad. hose mounts (as you'll soon see). But I did devise a fairly creative solution, I think. Plus a couple other things.
    no385.JPG

    no386.JPG The original Chevy breather tube went through the manifold into the valley chamber. There are several places, between intake runners and water passages, where you could drill through the manifold. I selected this spot near the left front, and drilled and tapped it to 1/2" pipe. The hole is nearly 1-inch, plenty big enough to pour oil through using a funnel. I don't know what they call the gold part of the breather, but it's porous. These are made in several sizes and styles by Parker, and I got it at a hydraulic hose and fitting outfit in Burbank called Comoso. Note I used a button-head Allen bolt on the manifold next to it for clearance, so I can get a deep-well socket on the breather to tighten it. However, I'm going to leave it finger-tight to start; I don't think it will leak.

    no383.JPG
    no387.JPG
    The other half of the breather system was a PCV valve. My knowledgeable go-to parts guy is owner Rick at Master Auto Parts in Sun Valley (next door to Frantic Fred's Hot Rod Shop). Don't know what it's for, but he found this compact, metal valve with screw-in pipe thread on one end and 3/8 hose on the other, listed in his books. I drilled and tapped the manifold at the rear as shown, added a matching hose fitting to the carb, and voila a clean and simple PCV hook-up with no hole in the valve cover.
    no381.JPG On the subject of drilling and tapping, I also picked up a screw-in brake-light switch. I know these aren't as reliable as the finger-type that mounts on the firewall behind the brake pedal (a la '40s Chevy), but this master cylinder had outlets on both sides, and the plugged rear one was located right at this hole in the frame. How convenient! Good thing I hadn't filled and bled the brakes yet. So I had to undo the brake lines (again), remove the master cylinder (again), remove the 1/4" plug, carefully drill the hole about 1" deeper, and tap it for 1/8" pipe. When done I thoroughly blew out any chips, using an air gun from the other side and in the reservoir. This will make for simple wiring and avoid drilling holes in the firewall.
    no379.JPG Next job was to install a trans cooler. The inlet/outlet on the 700-R4 are high, creating clearance issues with a trans tunnel. Bill found the upper banjo fitting, and said it was expensive. Both take screw-on A-N fittings. I found these with barbed hose ends at Comoso.
    no380.JPG The cooler mounts to the lower frame-rail with a couple of simple home-made L-brackets, and two Adel clamps and tie-wraps hold the two hoses against the top of the X-member, away from the exhaust pipe. I try to use KISS methods as much as possible.

    no389.JPG So this is where we are today. Manifold and carb bolted in place, early valve covers unviolated. Front drive accessories come next, plus paint and install gas tank and fuel system. But first I have to put the fuel injection back on the dragster.... And get Sam's magneto back from Don Zig's. And figure out how to make a Spalding ignition out of the pieces Sam found and machined for me. See you soon. PG
     
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  26. Fortunateson
    Joined: Apr 30, 2012
    Posts: 2,347

    Fortunateson
    Member

    Looking good. Regarding the PVC system, is there a baffle under the manifold? I read constantly that if not oil will be sucked out not just the vapour. Of course I could be wrong! LOL
     
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  27. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 12,189

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    Pat
    Someones always nitpicking right, but I'm thinking the top hose clamp on the trans cooler may be tough to get to once the body goes on.
    Nice exhaust system by the way.
     
  28. nrgwizard
    Joined: Aug 18, 2006
    Posts: 1,100

    nrgwizard
    Member
    from Minn. uSA

    Pat;
    I think the porous thing on the manifold you mentioned is a hydraulic filter. Made out of sintered bronze. Should work good as an air filter for the breather system. Hadn't thought about that. Good on you.
    Marcus...
     
  29. Boryca
    Joined: Jul 18, 2011
    Posts: 604

    Boryca
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Detroit

    That was me. Thanks! Looks real good!
     
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  30. pgan
    Joined: Apr 7, 2009
    Posts: 187

    pgan
    Member

    As most of you know across this continent, it's just been too damn hot to go out and work in the garage all day. Right? But that doesn't mean nothing's getting done. So here's a quick little update.
    no390.JPG First was to paint the gas tank, properly install the pickup and fuel gauge sender, and start the fuel hard line. I was going to mount the filter, electric pump, and adjustable pressure regulator on the inner right rear frame rail, but fortunately I checked body clearance in that area, and found it was limited. So I may have to mount these items on a panel under the rear body floor (as on my '32 roadster). But that means the next step is to mount the body back on the frame.
    no391.JPG
    So that means the step before that is to color-sand and rub-out the body. I started at the firewall, since that's the most difficult and tedious. This is once-over with 1000-grit. You'll notice a few more pieces bolted on the engine, as well.
    no393.JPG And this is just a little hand-rubbed spot check with coarse 3M compound. It'll only get better with finer grits. But mmm, isn't too much more satisfying than rubbing out black lacquer.
    Other projects are still in the works, but with any luck I hope to get the body back on this week. Wish me luck.
    Pat
     

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