I think the reason for bringing up the taper being machined off isn't so much about the taper but matching to a 90* angle , if you machine to a sharp corner you create a stress point and usally fractures occur there first if you put a big fillet in the corner it increases the strength quite abit
Agree that! Choosing the right cutting tool, with a radius, from the pile is a given. Shot peening of machined parts that may have micro grooving is good, cheap insurance, too. Rebuilding is definitely an option but I have to think the fun factor of doing it the first time will certainly be less the second time. It's got to be a psychological downer. Instead of attempting to recreate it again, maybe adding in some upgrades could make it more of an upper.(?) To paraphrase the classic TV show: "Gentlemen, we can rebuild it. We have the technology. Better than it was before. Better... stronger... faster".
Thank God Ben is OK ! I always worried that my 32 Roadster would be hit. Not a lot of protection but I loved the car
yep, my second thought also after the drivers health. i think that would be the big problem, psyching your self up to "do it again". i think if it was me i might try to find another body and sell that one off. maybe find a pickup cab? this way my mind wouldn't think i was rebuilding, just building another.
This is the second car in two weeks that rolled because of suspension designs. These things don't always work. But this is true hotrodding. Flops work held up good. The cowl welds were a lot stronger than the metal around them that's for sure. Glad Ben is ok this car has a bitchin look
"Second car in two weeks that rolled because of suspension designs" What ever the cause, these problems need to be diagnosed & corrected. The outcome on this one could have been a lot worse, next time, luck may run out. I've studied all the pictures, I see potential problems.
Thank goodness Ben is okay. Just remember you can rebuild it. You have the technology. You can make it better than it was. Better, stronger, faster.
original or otherwise removing metal (the taper) reduces the thickness and strength so probably not a good idea, especially if not done with a radius etc probably a deadly idea on a cheaper underspec'd part
Did he actually say? I have seen about 10 people ask on his Instagram account and have yet to see an answer to the question.
You know, 9" axles can fail at the bearing/flange area from excessive offset wheels...and we all think they are pretty strong. These sideways applications of a part meant to be in compression seems to be a similar situation. And as already said, shafts always need a radius at a 90* corner. All lessons to be learned. Magnafluxing of steering and suspension parts may be an expense and not 'cool', but they do show up faults. For example, plenty of visually ok early Ford steering arms have been found to have faults/cracks when magnafluxed.
From the look of the end of the spring hanger from my point of view as a spring maker . I see Sheer and brake on the end at 60/40 . It's hard to say why it failed from the that single picture and more info would be needed . I would love to see more metallurgical analysis of the hanger and looks to be cast and case hardened ...
Tomorrow is shop night so I will ask the guys in his club (Iron Lords) for details. I will let you guys know.
Could the first cracks started from being over torqued? Say putting it as tight as forged or still tapered not cut one might be capable of holding. PS I threw out my speedway perch bolts for my PU today. I'll use my original 34s now. My Tudor has Henry 32s for the suicide setup. Sent from my iPhone using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
X2. The perch bolts are not designed to be mounted this way. But still very sad about the car :-( Sent from my iPhone using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
All valid points...Something is going to have to be re-engineered in this style of set-up for sure. And you have chrome to boot. As others have said look forward to the analysis...
Hope some Ok, Maybe you are the guy to answer this question, being a spring maker. With the front crossmember, spring and shackles in place is the ideal setup to have them sitting parallel with the ground not tilted forward or back? If so isn't the perch setup in the split bones critical so things don't bind or cause things to flex? Bob
Your absolutely right about torque with Taper and no Taper...It may have to be adjusted. With Taper the taper would lock in bore and would possibly remain in bore even if nut and thread sheared of due to incorrect torque or other anomaly (an actual safety feature). No Taper means the whole length of the bolt would stretch when torqued diferently and if it was a clearance hole the bolt could slide out if there was a shear. The dynamics of the two setups is different even if torque should remain same due to thread size which is how torque is sometimes based in general terms.
Hey Bob ! Think about it. Everything is pivoting from the point where the split wishbones attach. The spring perch / shackle & the point where the spring nestles in to the crossmember should all be on the same arc ! So you should work within those parameters
As the old HAMB metallurgist, I will provide technical info. That shows a fatigue crack for the smooth portion. The rough area is just the final stage overload fracture. The fatigue cracked area is just one crack, it may have stopped cracking for a bit and then restarted so it gives the different amount of corrosion shown. If I had the part and magnified view I could say more exact. But that is a fatigue crack, and fatigue cracks are due to cyclic loading. They propagate a very small amount with each tension cycle. The way Ben's holding the part in that pic the fatigue crack is the portion that was in tension. I do not believe the crack is from initial tightening, it is from cyclic loading over time the car has been on the road. Whether there is a sharp corner or radius does have effect on stress concentration. I don;t know the total design so will not say if this is a factor. The shackle piece is being used in a much different stress conditions than it normally has in stock type position. The additional forces as used in suicide mounted to the radius rods would increase the stress, and therefore cause more crack initiation and propagation forces. Ben, sorry to see and hear about this, your car was a very nice one. Hope you can figure out what is usable and what can be fixed.
Blah Blah holy shit guys give it a break!! Would ya about your techanol bullshit! The guy just lost his bride and joy! He built it from the ground up! And built it from the best parts and friends he could like all us wish we could!!! Give the guy a break shit breaks!! How many of you have magnufluxed shit before you used it!! Come on!! Poor guy just got a bad piece!! Look at the Rolling Bones he was rolling with I've seen those car all the way in Colorado and still running!! Just bad luck!! I've already extended my hand to Ben and told him I have buddies with a lot of 32 3w parts and I would help anyway I could to help with his bad experience! Ben your car will be rebuilt! Sent from my SM-G930V using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
Pete, As I see things the perch should be free to move during setup so the shackle and spring all align, and don't bind, then tighten up the nut. What is your opinion on welding the perch to the split wishbone? Bob
I think most of are speaking with a tone of sympathy and concern. I know my interest in this thread other than being a huge fan of Ben's car is fear. Not for my own safety but for the good fellas who hang here, the love ones who ride with them or a innocent bystander. It's hard to hold back the reply button when you become so emotionally rattled by something like this. I certainly am not trying to kick anyone in the balls over build choices. Most here would like to help Ben or anyone in need. You are correct the biggest factor I see is fluke part failure with a couple extra variables that may have been at play. Wyatt out. Sent from my iPhone using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
I'll tell you o don't like the hanger in the wishbone! But I know a lot of guys that have them. Ben's looked great I seen it a Bonneville it was clean! A lot cleaner than most that I seen at the line up at Bonneville!!!! I just hate seeing all these assumptions! It is what it is probably not the best of suspension choices I build all my cars with forged chassis engineering! But those guys have building cars along time! Bad luck and I fell for him! So sad! For his loss he worked his ass off for that car!!! Sent from my SM-G930V using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
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