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Technical ***November 2023 Banger Meet Thread - Shopping Season***

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by Jiminy, Nov 1, 2023.

  1. Jiminy
    Joined: Oct 25, 2012
    Posts: 470

    Jiminy
    Member

    Link to previous month: October 2023 Banger Meet

    Coming Events: (PM Jiminy with additions/corrections)
    Stay safe.


    For the HAMB banger newbies, here are some links to a lot of banger info:

    Jim Brierley's book 4-bangers! And me! is a must read book for all banger enthusiasts. US customers send $34.00 all color except for the oldest pictures (includes S/H in the U.S.A.), PayPal welcome, to:
    Jim Brierley, 39480 Colleen Way, Temecula, CA 92592.
    email: [email protected]
    phone: 951-695-7313.


    A few links to speed equipment companies there may be more
    https://specialtymotorcams.com/index.php#header
    http://www.millerhi-speedheads.com/index.html
    http://www.modelatrader.com/brumfield/brumfield.html
    https://www.hotforhotfours.com/advertisers.htm
    https://www.secretsofspeed.com/speed-parts

    Bert's, Synder's, Mikes affordable also list some speed performance parts.

    Here is a list of most of the prior monthly banger meet links:
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...d.php?t=161498


    Banger basics. another info link list:
    http://www.fordgarage.com/


    http://www.plucks329s.org/index.htm

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...d.php?t=251717

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=42480

    The link below shows flywheel lightening dimensions
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/may-bang-er-thread.470853/page-4#post-5212157
    and this link shows the missing image from the above post
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...-work-on-bangers.1010716/page-3#post-11427055


    The 4 Banger hot rod picture thread.
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/the-4-banger-hot-rod-picture-thread.997051/


    Model B rod bearing insert numbers
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=6992484#post6992484


    Engine tuning with a Vacuum gauge
    http://web.archive.org/web/20120415...e.com/tuning-with-a-vacuum-gauge-spg-148.html


    Adjusting dual Strombergs:
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=6638461#post6638461


    Helpful Model A tools and tips:
    http://www.maurer-markus.ch/ford_a/tipps.index.en.html


    Gary in MN's late model Malory distributor conversion for A/B engine:
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=9147025&postcount=109


    Elrod's stuck head tech:
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=218487


    Model A generator to alternator conversion:
    http://ejwhitneyco.com/automotive.html


    Gear ratio / speed and RPM calculator:
    http://www.accuautoparts.com/calculator.php


    Model A master cylinder mounting bracket ideas:
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...73#post4953173


    Go here to read the 1931 edition of Harry Ricardo's book "The High Speed Internal Combustion Engine"
    http://www.scribd.com/full/40610101?access_key=key-w2bcjicdancrnxypd05


    Chevy Banger Stuff
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...d.php?t=463465


    Post 198 starts a great discussion of the shape of a flat head combustion chamber
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=470853&page=10


    T-5 5 speed in a Torque Tube:
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=256226


    Model A & B Style Cast Iron Cylinder Head Compression Ratios.
    http://www.fordgarage.com/pages/headcompressionratio.htm
     
  2. pkhammer
    Joined: Jan 28, 2012
    Posts: 810

    pkhammer
    Member

    So, I need you guys opinion. I know that is opening up a big 'ol can of worms but here goes anyway! I have an opportunity to buy a '29 Speedster from an estate. It was built from a Rootlieb kit which costs more than what I can buy the completed speedster for. It hasn't been run for a year a two so it will need a little tinkering to have up and running. I think the car looks goofy with the fenders and bumpers and radial tires so all of that would go away. Tires and wheels would be replaced with stock Model A wires and bias rubber. Add a few decals here and there and maybe some hop-up parts to the engine.
    In the end, can it be made into something cool or will it look goofy no matter what?
    [​IMG]
     
    Dannerr and Outback like this.
  3. Rex_A_Lott
    Joined: Feb 5, 2007
    Posts: 1,138

    Rex_A_Lott
    Member

    I like it. I think just changing over to some big and little tires would do a lot for the looks of that one. I've always ran the 16" wheels, you have a lot more tire options. If you switch to A model wheels you're pretty limited. Good luck.
     
    Old Dawg and pkhammer like this.
  4. Dan from Oakland
    Joined: Jan 16, 2009
    Posts: 161

    Dan from Oakland
    Member

    Buy it and have fun!!!
     
    Dannerr, Old Dawg and pkhammer like this.

  5. denis4x4
    Joined: Apr 23, 2005
    Posts: 4,182

    denis4x4
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Colorado

    Looks like those are T fenders and 16" wires. I built a Rootlieb kit and I used a one piece hood top with leather hold down straps. Lots of fun. Buy it.
     
    pkhammer likes this.
  6. pkhammer
    Joined: Jan 28, 2012
    Posts: 810

    pkhammer
    Member

    Yes, I agree that the one piece hood top with open sides would be better. I could also fabricate a side exit exhaust to run up the passenger side for a racy look. If I buy it I could sell the fenders, splash aprons, bumpers, headlight bar, headlight visors, radiator stone screen, hood and possibly the wheels and tires. I notice one of the wheels is a K-H bent spoke type but the other three are regular '35 Ford 16" wires. A set of bias ply 7:00-16 rear and 6:00-16 front might give it a better look. I have a set of original 16" wires laying around.
    I found an issue with the title, the serial number is 1 digit different than the engine number. I figure a DMV mistake that didn't get caught. The estate said they'd get the DMV to fix it.
    I think I can buy it for around $5k.
     
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  7. Present
     
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  8. 282doorUK
    Joined: Mar 6, 2015
    Posts: 396

    282doorUK

    Yep do all that de-goofing but go for the tallest skinniest wheels and tires you can find, if they make it look too tall maybe drop it down a few inches. Maybe loose the windscreen too, then it would have a proper vintage look to it.

    Just my thoughts, buy it and you can't go far wrong whatever you do, have fun.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2024
    pkhammer likes this.
  9. 2023RMMR.Kris.jpg My plate isn't full: but I'm face down in it with nowhere to race!
     
  10. From what I understand, the main factor limiting performance on the Ford banger exhaust system is the stock muffler.

    If I'm not doing Bonneville or anything like that, is there any practical difference in driving experience between something like the totally open Geardrive lakes header, factory manifold w/ better muffler, factory manifold w/straight pipes, etc...
     
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  11. Stovebolt
    Joined: May 2, 2001
    Posts: 3,528

    Stovebolt
    Member

  12. Outback
    Joined: Mar 4, 2005
    Posts: 2,317

    Outback
    Member
    from NE Vic

    Love your race car!

    I'm here, nothing to report, but I did park my A at the bottom of the back steps so I could look at it from inside the house, it took my wife 4 or 5 days to mention it! Haha IMG_20231014_095129086_HDR.jpg
     
  13. Yep, lose the fenders, boards and bumpers first. They make it look out of proportion and an afterthought. Than the tires. Then lower the headlights and ditch their visors.
    Any speed parts?
     
    pkhammer likes this.
  14. pkhammer
    Joined: Jan 28, 2012
    Posts: 810

    pkhammer
    Member

    Appears to be a stock banger so a head, downdraft carb and header might need to be added. A fully synchro trans/overdrive would also be on my wish list.
     
  15. ZerroHalfcup
    Joined: Dec 6, 2022
    Posts: 30

    ZerroHalfcup
    Member

    I don't have a ton of experience but I cut the muffler off mine and ran a torque tube back to in front of the rear axle. Everything else is stock. I'm sure a downdraft intake would make a difference paired with it, but I can't tell a real difference with just how I did mine, other than it just sounds a bit cooler.

    Only my experience but I hope it helps
     
  16. wheeldog57
    Joined: Dec 6, 2013
    Posts: 3,130

    wheeldog57
    Member

    Question for the banger guys and I'm sure it has been covered already. I have a stock model A engine and I want more HP. Everything I read says buy a head. Can you mill a stock head and get more oomph? If so, how much do you remove? If not, why?
    Thanks for any information, Ron
     
    Outback likes this.
  17. Dan from Oakland
    Joined: Jan 16, 2009
    Posts: 161

    Dan from Oakland
    Member

    If you want to go the easy way with a new exhaust / intake, these guys make pretty ok stuff and the prices are very reasonable in my opinion.
    http://lakeheaders.com/model_A_Banger_intake.html

    to wheeldog57- don't bother trying to mill a stock head to get more compression, as the results are not very productive given the amount of material that needs to be removed.
    Look into buying a head from Jim Brierley or Dan Price. Jim's head is a new design, and Dan's is the Thomas Head.
     
    wheeldog57 likes this.
  18. railcarmover
    Joined: Apr 30, 2017
    Posts: 777

    railcarmover

    1115.jpeg IMG_4850.jpeg

    top is a Winfield red head,7.5 to 1 compression
    bottom is a stock A, 4.2 to 1

    you can see by the combustion chamber design the stock head can’t be effectively milled
     
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  19. railcarmover
    Joined: Apr 30, 2017
    Posts: 777

    railcarmover

    Street driven hopped up flatheads don’t spin fast enough to gain benefit from exhaust extraction..in other words it doesn’t really help it breathe better, even with a header.. reduction in back pressure over stock? Yep, that helps as far as I know.

    the stock A exhaust manifold is one area that was improved by Harold Hicks in engine development, he was brought over from the Tri motor plane project when engineering couldn’t develop more than 22 horse with their design. It’s a sound design and works well.. it also offers heat transfer which helps in anti icing and vaporization of fuel for driveability.

    Most aftermarket exhaust stuff is for looks and sound..’shiny and loud’ is important to me and a header looks cool.. but it doesn’t do much. But I’m not as skilled in speed as others here, so take my shit with a grain of salt..
     

    Attached Files:

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  20. alchemy
    Joined: Sep 27, 2002
    Posts: 20,269

    alchemy
    Member

    Anyone ever milled a stock head, then recut the small piston relief back in? Or has anyone ever filled some of the pocket with brass like they used to do before it was common to buy a new head for higher compression?
     
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  21. Outback
    Joined: Mar 4, 2005
    Posts: 2,317

    Outback
    Member
    from NE Vic

    This is a great question!
    I happen to have a head that's been sliced in half to give a top & bottom. I should be able to measure the thickness of the top of the combustion chamber. Might take a few days.
     
    alchemy likes this.
  22. railcarmover
    Joined: Apr 30, 2017
    Posts: 777

    railcarmover

    Reckon plug reach and position would be an issue. Balance the chambers by cc’ing the chamber, basically fill it with water and count the cc’s it takes to fill it. And braze away..
     
  23. IMHO
    The stk head is not worth working on
    If you machine too much off the deck it will not have enough material to adequately seal on the gasket.
    Yes you could braze up the chambers following some proven designs or just locate an aftermarket one

    considering that these improved heads have been made since the 1930’s they are out there, just have to look
    John
     
    Outback likes this.
  24. I'd consider a Burtz head over messing with an original.
     
  25. stubbsrodandcustom
    Joined: Dec 28, 2010
    Posts: 2,244

    stubbsrodandcustom
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Spring tx

    Stay around 6-1 ratio with a stock bottom end to keep things happy. Upgraded head, Downdraft intake and Mallory distributor is my go to for hop up on bangers without internal work. This really wakes them up.

    I agree, headers don't make a hill of beans for these gals. Best bang for the buck on looks is the Yapp split Y.
     
  26. Dan from Oakland
    Joined: Jan 16, 2009
    Posts: 161

    Dan from Oakland
    Member

    By the time you buy the brazing rod and the gas to keep that sucker hot enough to fill in a head and then resurfacing it when it warps all to heck and back, you will be half way to buying a high compression head.
    Of course the entertainment value of doing it yourself is priceless.........
     
    CSPIDY, johnneilson and Outback like this.
  27. Outback
    Joined: Mar 4, 2005
    Posts: 2,317

    Outback
    Member
    from NE Vic

    For those of you who build strong street motors, keeping the babbit what are/is your go-to hi-comp head? & Why?I'm sure this has been discussed before? Somewhere...
     
  28. That's the first thing to go!
     
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  29. Outback
    Joined: Mar 4, 2005
    Posts: 2,317

    Outback
    Member
    from NE Vic

  30. First to go is Babbitt
    As for head original iron Winfield
    Aluminum Brierley or iron Lion
    If you can find a Brumfield grab it
    J
     
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