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Projects Northwest Vintage Dragster Group Build.

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by rottenleonard, Oct 22, 2016.

  1. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

    Thinking about this transmission, it would not shift manually at wide open throttle, I never did try shifting it manually not at wide open throttle. It would shift in Drive provided I let off the gas, that would raise the vacuum signal and make it shift. Is it possible that maybe I just need two make some changes to the governor for a lower RPM? This transmission may have been out of something with a V8 in which case you probably would not want it to shift lower than 5000 RPM at wide open throttle. If the valve body is not a full manual valve body will it still shift up when you are manually shifting at wide open throttle?
    I hear what you are saying, and I know you have a ton of experience with this, are you considering the power level here? I'm thinking with the carbs ironed out and a good tune we may have 225-250 hp.
     
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  2. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 10,617

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

    If throttle pressure is still higher than govern pressure it will not shift.
     
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  3. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

    If that is right, thats probably our issue.
     
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  4. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 10,617

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

    Is there a reason that you don't want it manual shift?
     
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  5. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

    I would like it to be able to put it in drive and have it shift itself so less experienced drivers have one less thing to do. I see that tci has a valve body that says it is manual/automatic so if you pull it back to first or second it will be in those gears, but in drive it will shift itself. I'm not sure if we could modify our valve body to do the same or if it would have to be replaced.
     
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  6. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 10,617

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

    Get one of these kits
    20248.jpg
    Governor recalibration kits
     
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  7. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

    I was just jockeying this thing around the driveway unloading for the weekend. I'm thinking a lot of our traction 20171002_195155.jpg issues are right there.
     
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  8. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 10,617

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

    Do you have a hot rod you could put them on and go do some burnouts with.
     
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  9. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

    Yeah when was the last time a nasty burnout IMPROVED your situation
     
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  10. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 10,617

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

    After I went to the P/O rear end it has been good. :D
     
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  11. rooman
    Joined: Sep 20, 2006
    Posts: 4,052

    rooman
    Member

    With the Powerglide you will most likely need a looser converter than with the 3 speed but that should cushion the shock on the tires a little. It will also let the motor stay in the power band longer. Listen to a modern dragster with a 'glide. The rpm's don't change very much during a run and if they are set up correctly the motor is in it's "happy place" for most of the run.

    Roo
     
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  12. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

    Last night, Randy and I got together to start the next phase if the build, he found another 292 out at the scrap steel salvage yard in unknown condition. Cost us $100 extracted. We tore it down and I feel a little bad about it as everything looked VERY good in it, must have been a low mileage rebuild. Not that it is necessary for what we are doing but just to scratch the itch we are looking at lightening the crank, better pistons and rods as well as the SBC cylinder head conversion just for good measure 20171010_205403.jpg
     
  13. CrkInsp
    Joined: Jul 17, 2006
    Posts: 513

    CrkInsp
    Member
    from B.A. OK

    Take a look at the LS heads. Bolt placement is a lot better.
     
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  14. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

    Oh? Have you got any info on this? Links?
     
  15. CrkInsp
    Joined: Jul 17, 2006
    Posts: 513

    CrkInsp
    Member
    from B.A. OK

    Working on obtaining prints to post. Also head gaskets to stack for comparisons.
     
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  16. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

    I did a short web search, I see quite a few are using LS heads on the 300 Ford 6, we have a couple of those too.
     
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  17. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

    I stole this post from racer x, think it will apply to our traction issues.

    "here are some helpful tips for those considering running in this event. mounting the tires without tubes really helps traction. it allows the sidewall to flex. those tires have very stiff sidewalls and need all the help you can give them. experimenting with tire pressures can really help the 60 foot times. slowly drop the tire pressure. you don't want to drop the pressure too quickly as top end handling may become a serious issue. go slow and watch the 60 foot times. if radirs are used either put the tire in a tire cutter or do burnouts pre event until the tires are flat. the two grooves need to go away for maximum contact with the track. I prefer the chain around a pole going to the rearend method until the desired effect is achieved. worn out shocks or hydraulic shocks with the oil removed or comptition engineering adjustable shocks make a big difference in weight transfer. painted black no one will pick them out. removing front sway bars also helps. the tire juice cant be overly emphasized. you need three simple readily available supplies. plain non synthetic trans fluid; diesel fuel and laquer thinner. the thinner cant be the enviormentally friendly stuff. this is really important. get the cheap shop line real thinner. fill a gallon jug with 1/4 trans fluid; 1/4 thinner; 1/2 diesel fuel. wearing gloves apply to the tires with a rag rubbing it in as you go. the juice will absorb into the tire. the tire will change to differentshades of black as its absorbed. keeprepeating until it is no longer absorbed. the tire will take on a slightly shiny look. it takes a few applications done one after the other. to get even more aggressive the tires can be wrapped in plastic overnight. a tire durometer is a handy item to have so the tires progress can be checked. use it to get a baseline prior to applications. a radir tire as delivered is around 50-55 on the durometer. this reading can easily be brought down to the low 40s to high 30s. a new drag slick registers from the high 30s to the midthirties. we are talking a drastic improvement here. if this juice is used I would highly recommend a upgrade to the axles and studs to something stronger than stock. I would also use rim screws. make sure you wash your hands after applications. the treatment is usually good for a few passes. reapplications can easily be done quickly at the track between rounds. have fun with your new found bite. I was a tire tester for radir wheels. I have gone into the eightes at 168 mph on a 10 inch wide 28 inch tall pie crust radar tire."
     
  18. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

    Long time no post, guess we took a bit of a Hiatus but we're back on it now. Plans have changed on the 292 for the first dragster, one of the guys hooked up with an old Roundy round racer that used to run 292 s, he donated us a set of flat top pistons and rods as well as some other valve train parts.

    Here is the set up out of the new 292 20180116_132201.jpg

    Here is the new setup as we got it back from the machine shop where Fred at K & F performed a little bit of work to the wrist pins, Recon the rods, and installed ARP Rod bolts. Not sure of the Piston manufacturer Fred says they are a forged piston although not the highest quality. Good enough for who it's for. Also the connecting rods seem to be a chromoly unit.

    20180116_132216.jpg 20180116_132259.jpg
    20180116_132230.jpg

    Another Stroke of Luck the new motor happen to have a steel crank that was at 10 10, and is in wonderful condition. Just required a little bit of Polish work. Fred decked the block Square to the crank line and set the Pistons .005" below the deck surface. We still need to CC the heads after we get the bigger valves put in, but initial calculations are putting us somewhere close to 12 to 1 compression ratio.

    20180117_140404.jpg

    balance sheet for the components so far, we have still some to get to him to be checked.

    20180117_102417.jpg


    Next we turned our attention to the head off the new 292, setting it up in the mill to remove the head bolt tubes out of the intake runners

    20180116_145004.jpg

    Wayne made short work of them with an endmill. 20180116_151245.jpg

    Starting to fit the lump ports

    20180116_154954.jpg

    Threaded the valve cover side for half inch pipe plugs where the head bolts used to go through.

    20180116_163816.jpg

    Meanwhile we drug in the 2nd chassis and started mocking up the front suspension.

    20180116_144951.jpg

    I will say as a disclaimer for anyone thinking of building a Northwest vintage dragster all of this engine work is just really not necessary, it's just us getting carried away with ourselves. A barely warmed up 6 will do the trick.
     

    Attached Files:

  19. christmas tree
    Joined: Dec 7, 2009
    Posts: 339

    christmas tree
    Member

    50 years ago (1967) we had a 23 T altered 1300 lb car with a.060 292 in it. 5 holly 94s on home fabed intake, stock valves, center boss on intakes, 12 to one comp Crane cam and a Vertex,2 speed stick and 7 in wide Racemasters. First run in eighth mile was a 6.86. 2 happy faces.
     
  20. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

    Dad and I machine. Up a second set of Harley wheels for the second dragster just like we did for the frameless model a build thread we have going. If someone has an extra set of model A spindles with bearings and races we could sure use them. Screenshot_20180119-135802.jpg
     
  21. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

    Not sure how many beers we had last year when we tacked on the front spring mount but the center bolt hole was cut out to 1" ID....????

    Spun up a spacer on the lathe.



    20180123_142310.jpg

    Burned it in with the tig,

    20180123_142834.jpg

    Blended like it never happened.

    20180123_145026.jpg


    Wayne looking for the weight advantage....(might have been just blending the forging line)

    20180123_164018.jpg

    Then we jumped on some rear axle brackets. kind of fun this year as you just hit the go button and the plasma bed cuts one out, no design time.
    20180123_155307.jpg

    20180123_155321.jpg
     
  22. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

  23. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 10,617

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

    Speed Sport.....I like it.
     
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  24. loudbang
    Joined: Jul 23, 2013
    Posts: 33,567

    loudbang
    Member

    Oh Man don't let Beaner see this. :)
     
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  25. loudbang likes this.
  26. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

    We decided to move the steering arms out front switching them side-to-side didn't make the Ackerman perfect but not too bad. Interesting really enough the model A tie rod worked well in this configuration with the later shorter axle.

    20180220_183630.jpg 20180220_183639.jpg

    Next up Wayne grabbed this 302 for a mock-up motor for the 270 race motor so we had something to cut and grind around without getting garbage into the good motor. However the 302 was locked up tighter than a blank blank, and you have to remove the clutch and flywheel before you can remove the bellhousing. Randy took the stance that Wayne and I were going to take all night getting it off and said give me the double Jack, after he explain to me what a double Jack was ,( I think he might have worked on the railroad with John Henry). 2 minutes later it was off.

    Our hero in action.
    20180220_185714.jpg 20180220_190001.jpg



    20180220_190540.jpg

    Next step we installed the adapter with the hydramatic transmission. Then off to a little mock-up. We will need the drive shaft completed this week in order to set the motor.

    20180220_203949.jpg 20180220_193812.jpg 20180220_193806.jpg 20180220_193819.jpg
     

    Attached Files:

  27. 1-SHOT
    Joined: Sep 23, 2014
    Posts: 2,140

    1-SHOT
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Looks like all you need is a long slip yoke and a U joint.
     
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  28. Old6rodder
    Joined: Jun 20, 2006
    Posts: 2,508

    Old6rodder
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from SoCal
    1. HA/GR owners group

    Beat me to it. :rolleyes:
    Perhaps consider moving the rear end and engine toward each other just enough to bring the U-joint ears together?

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2018
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  29. rottenleonard
    Joined: Nov 7, 2008
    Posts: 1,973

    rottenleonard
    Member

    Close what we are going to use is the center part of one these jet boat couplers. download (1).jpeg
     
  30. Old6rodder
    Joined: Jun 20, 2006
    Posts: 2,508

    Old6rodder
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from SoCal
    1. HA/GR owners group

    Nice. I'm using a flanged ear set like that on the right to adapt a B&T to a Spicer on a street bucket I'm (re)doing.
     
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