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Projects No spark from coil, no start

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Mister E., May 4, 2018.

  1. sevenhills1952
    Joined: Mar 14, 2018
    Posts: 321

    sevenhills1952

    Please MISTER E., follow these 16 steps, each time for safety disconnect battery.
    Disregard any other confusing info.
    It will work, as long as points, condenser, coil, plugs and all wires are good. If any step doesn't check out, go back to see why.
    Be sure there is a good ground strap or wire from engine to frame/body.

    Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk... Gary from Virginia
     
  2. There's more than enough info here for Mr E to get it figured out, some is confusing, some is easy to follow. Then there are many books as well.

    Sevenhills might want to explain to Mr E about how to find out which wire is the Accessory wire and which one is the ignition wire since according to your description, both of those wires will fit quite nicely into BTW. I would explain it for him but since your repeated statements and instructions to disregard other information,,,,

    Around here we don't assume parts are good, we prove them good and move on. Moving on from a rock solid known and verified starting place because we just did it. That eliminates tail chasing. There are industry standards and troubleshooting charts published and they include a hierarchy of progression thru the process, it's best for professionals not to deviate from that hierarchy and it's imperative that the DIY weekend warriors stick to it.

    I suppose if the thing is running and driving without complaint or issues it would be safe to assume that everything is good.

    Carry on
    Good luck to you MR E
     
    54vicky and rfraze like this.
  3. sevenhills1952
    Joined: Mar 14, 2018
    Posts: 321

    sevenhills1952

    Please. No confusion for the poor guy.
    He's installing an ignition switch. First thing is disconnect battery. Remove old switch, have it down, 100% sure away from metal!
    Reconnect battery (quickly tap it on terminal, if it sparks stop. You have a short or something is on!) Reconnect battery if ok. Now be sure you have power going into old switch. If not, trace it out, it should have a battery terminal. Once that's ok, unhook battery. Reconnect leads one at a time onto new switch. Reconnect battery. Check again new switch, power to switch, turn it to on. Be sure power to that ign terminal.
    That's the wire that goes to ballast resistor.
    Each time you disconnect battery keep it simple, you won't tighten that connection until the end...last step.

    Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk... Gary from Virginia
     
  4. sevenhills1952
    Joined: Mar 14, 2018
    Posts: 321

    sevenhills1952

    I just had a brain storm!(No jokes please)
    If MISTER E will let me know when he gets the new switch I'll be happy to give him my cell #, especially since I'm 2000 miles from Montana. He could call me and I'll help walk him through it.

    Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk... Gary from Virginia
     
  5. Blues4U
    Joined: Oct 1, 2015
    Posts: 2,472

    Blues4U
    Member
    from So Cal

    Just to clarify, I wasn't being a wise ass. But now I am: http://www.letmegooglethat.com/?q=how+does+a+point+style+ignition+system+work :D It's all in good fun. But do some reading, and the posts from the guys above will make sense. If you get through this issue and come away not know why what you did fixed the car, that will be a huge waste. Spend some time reading and watching videos and less time screwing with the car, you'll get it fixed sooner with less frustration.
     
    54vicky and egads like this.
  6. greybeard360
    Joined: Feb 28, 2008
    Posts: 1,195

    greybeard360
    Member

    First thing..... people need to read to learn. He has a foot actuated starter... like this. The ONLY wire going to it is a cable from the battery. There is another wire attached to that terminal that goes to the ignition switch to supply power.
    [​IMG]

    From the IGN terminal on the ignition switch power goes to the ballast resistor. From the ballast to the positive (+) terminal on the coil. Very simple circuit. If there is power at the coil + with key on.... that part of the circuit is good.

    From the distributor, the small wire coming from the side of the distributor housing attaches to the negative (-) side of the coil. Even simpler circuit !!!

    With the distributor cap off, turn the motor by hand until the rubbing block is on one of the flats on the cam lobe. Here the points should be closed. Turn the ignition switch on, connect your test light to the negative side of the coil. Use a stick or something non metalic to open the points... your finger will work too. When you open the points the test light should come on (because with the points closed they are grounding the circuit so the light won't be lit, when the points are open, the light is completing the circuit).

    If all of that checks out OK, check the point gap... turn the motor bay hand until the rubbing block is at the peak of one of the lobes.... the points should be open, if not you will have to loosen the retaining screw slightly and move the base of the points until there is a gap.... a matchbook cover is a good gauge (or a .016" feeler gauge).

    Once all of that is done, put the distributor cap back on and spin the motor over with the ignition ON... you should have spark at coil wire now. Pull that lead out of the center terminal of the cap and hold it 1/4" away from the valve cover while spinning the motor.... if you have spark.... it should run now !!
     
    Moriarity likes this.
  7. sevenhills1952
    Joined: Mar 14, 2018
    Posts: 321

    sevenhills1952

    Bob's Chevy trucks shows this as the floor starter switch.
    Someone needs to contact Ecklers since they posted this erroneous information...

    Your 1955, 1956, 1957, 1958 or 1959 Chevy or GMC truck's ignition switch allows the battery to send a powerful surge of electricity to the starter when the car is being started. Without this switch in good working order, you are dead in the water…or the parking lot. It also allows you to control many of the car's accessories when the car is parked while preventing accessories from running down the battery. Sometimes located on the dash or steering column, replacement can be easy with basic mechanical knowledge, hand tools and afternoon. Always reference your truck’s service shop manual before tackling an electrical project like this. Nothing is worse then a dead car. Breathe some new life into your baby with a high quality, new ignition switch from Ecklers Classic Chevy Trucks.

    I believe that truck most likely has an original or original replacement starter floor switch. Hopefully the replacement ignition switch is just an on off switch.
    Who knows.
    Rather than the continued dance, my suggestion still is for him to simply call someone who can walk him step by step to get it running again. dr130a.jpg

    Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk... Gary from Virginia
     
  8. greybeard360
    Joined: Feb 28, 2008
    Posts: 1,195

    greybeard360
    Member

    Some of those trucks did have a solenoid type of starter and were started by the key switch, not foot switch. I think those were only the V8's and A/T trucks.
     
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  9. the oil soup
    Joined: May 19, 2013
    Posts: 69

    the oil soup
    Member
    from Tucson,AZ

    That switch is also adjustable as to when it completes the circuit by screwing the knob over the spring in or out.
     

    Attached Files:

    Vanness likes this.
  10. sevenhills1952
    Joined: Mar 14, 2018
    Posts: 321

    sevenhills1952

    It looks to me like the large top terminal would go to battery + and the small insulated side terminal is the one I was trying to explain...when switch is depressed there will be 12volts there. That goes to coil +. When running the ballast drops a couple volts. Cranking you want full voltage (ballast bypassed) to coil which cranking voltage will be maybe 10 volts.
    If no terminal there, then simply switched power to resistor and other end to coil +.

    Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk... Gary from Virginia
     
  11. Mister E.
    Joined: May 4, 2018
    Posts: 64

    Mister E.

    UPDATE:
    SHES ALIVE! ALIVE!!!!

    Had to put in new wire harness and as soon as I cranked the old foot started she kicked over and grrrrrouwled to LIFE!!!

    WOOOHOOO!!
    Daddy's got a new baby!!
    Haha
     
  12. Truck64
    Joined: Oct 18, 2015
    Posts: 2,191

    Truck64
    Member
    from Ioway

    Congrats!
     
    Mister E. likes this.
  13. sevenhills1952
    Joined: Mar 14, 2018
    Posts: 321

    sevenhills1952

    Great!

    Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk... Gary from Virginia
     
    Mister E. likes this.
  14. VANDENPLAS
    Joined: Dec 14, 2009
    Posts: 793

    VANDENPLAS
    Member

    Well you close that can o

    6D741CEB-3B1C-4597-9DE0-9C6E93502691.jpeg

    Good stuff, now onto the next one!
     
    Mister E. likes this.
  15. ROADSTER1927
    Joined: Feb 14, 2009
    Posts: 2,313

    ROADSTER1927
    Member

  16. Vanness
    Joined: Aug 5, 2017
    Posts: 384

    Vanness
    Member

    I didn’t think this was going to happen!!! Hooray for spark!!!
     
    Mister E. likes this.
  17. Mister E.
    Joined: May 4, 2018
    Posts: 64

    Mister E.

    Well, what I did was I found a wire harness for the key ignition, ran through the fire wall out to ballast resistor, then to the coil to the distributor and starter and got the battery charged, then found the missing LIVE wire to the ignition that eluded us for the past week and as soon as I cranked her over she purred like a bob-cat/ kitten!!
     
    hendelec likes this.
  18. Good for you Mister E. Carry on !!
     
    Mister E. likes this.
  19. karl share
    Joined: Nov 5, 2015
    Posts: 49

    karl share
    Member

    DID YOU LEARN ANYTHING out of all this information given.??? :D:D:D
     
    Mister E. likes this.
  20. Truck64
    Joined: Oct 18, 2015
    Posts: 2,191

    Truck64
    Member
    from Ioway

    You're all a bunch a hoodlums, that's what!
     
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  21. Atwater Mike
    Joined: May 31, 2002
    Posts: 8,284

    Atwater Mike
    Member

    Mr. E... Proud that you got to the root of the problem, attacked it, and solved it.

    Er...Despite all the assistance offered by all of us...:p:D
     
    sevenhills1952 and Truck64 like this.
  22. dirt t
    Joined: Mar 20, 2007
    Posts: 4,035

    dirt t
    Member
    from Kingman,AZ

    Bobcats are in Bozeman, Grizzlies are in Missoula.
     
  23. No matter how it played out, this ended up being one of the best threads on ignition troubleshooting.
     
  24. sevenhills1952
    Joined: Mar 14, 2018
    Posts: 321

    sevenhills1952

    Check this out! Before Kettering ignition (from memory) my Granddad gave me this Ford spark coil box, for model T I'm thinking. I just tried it and it still works after 100 years! On my power supply it looks like it was only drawing about 1/2 amp. I touched the output terminal and it knocked me flat! Glad I had my copper flip-flops on.
    He had MANY stories to go with it which is why he soldered jacks on it.
    Ford was smart. The box simply put out high voltage so cap/rotor was a hv switch to fire plugs in sequence. 20180510_120140.jpg 20180510_120146.jpg 20180510_120153.jpg

    Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk... Gary from Virginia
     
    Truck64 likes this.
  25. hotrod1948
    Joined: Jan 17, 2011
    Posts: 260

    hotrod1948
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Milton, WI

    Aren't those boxes the ones that the flame throwers used to ignite the fuel in the pipes?
     
  26. Had to laugh, all the gurus were involved in this one and it got solved anyway.....
    Good stuff
     
    Mister E. likes this.
  27. sevenhills1952
    Joined: Mar 14, 2018
    Posts: 321

    sevenhills1952

    I'm not sure, but I'm sure it would work.
    My great-granddad ran a general store in Pennsylvania. Granddad worked there and every day this guy would come in just to take a dump...never bought anything. So my granddad put that coil box hidden behind commode, hooked a wire up to the metal seat. Next day he said guy comes in as usual...granddad waited a few minutes...then connected two wires he ran over to a battery.
    The guy flew outside, pants down...never came back.
    Another time he said the town had a lovers park with a 3ft stone wall around it. He sprinkled gunpowder on it end to end, ran wires to it and that coil and battery one dark night. When he threw switch the park lit up !
    One foundry job he later had every day he put a piece of paper in a guys spark coil points. He would crank, choke it, give up, go back and see the foreman. Granddad would remove the paper, foreman would get the T running. Guy never could figure out why he couldn't start it :)

    Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk... Gary from Virginia
     
  28. Mister E.
    Joined: May 4, 2018
    Posts: 64

    Mister E.

    Hey all, just took her out for a test drive today!
    She drives nice, although had to use hand brake cus foot brake inoperable at moment.
    Other wise she drove nice(through the yard)
    Feels kind of slow though, maybe low geared??
    Or maybe that's backwards??

    Anyway, all the gears work great, even reverse! So just need to fix the foot brake and maybe look for a higher gear ratio.

    Didn't want to leave ya all hangin
     
    Sporty45 and 31Vicky with a hemi like this.
  29. Mister E.
    Joined: May 4, 2018
    Posts: 64

    Mister E.

    More recent pics
     

    Attached Files:

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