The Jalopy Journal
Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by colesy, Aug 12, 2007.
I know that by 1971, just before the axe fell on the original Stock, the rule was long-gone.
OK, This one in my opinion is;
The Coolest Car on the Thread So Far.
Russ Matthews from Lafayette Indiana and his big old Buick winning their class (photo 2) at the 1962 NHRA South Central Divisional race at Okalahoma City. Also shown is Dickie Harrell in his 62 Chev Impala. Dick was living in Carlsbad New Mexico at this time.
I remember reading in the rule book at one time, don't remember when however, that a minimum of a 16 lb exhaust system needed to be under a car running in stock, but that it did'nt need to be connected and operationable. Or, did I dream that? Butch/56sedandelivery.
I know I had an exhaust system on my L/S 57 in '69.
I think it came off for 1970.
Here's an interesting story from Jerry Gross of Super Stock magazine on Wiley Cossey's victory in Junior Stock at the 1966 Winternationals and the race within a race for C/Stock honors.
Winter Nationals 1966 continued........
Winternationals 1966 continued.........
That's Tom Crutchfield in the Button Motors Mopar over Rod Phillips. Russ Matthews big Buick still going strong in 66 but loses this one to Graham Douglass. Dale Bargman and Pete Kost battle it out in C/Stock.
Colesy, The first Russ Mathews picture is Pomona.
Winternationals 1966 continued.......
OK, it's Top Stock and not Junior, but here's a shot of Grumpy Jenkins losing in the A/S final to Don Grotheer, congratulating Don and then trying to persuade Mike Schmitt to sell him his Ford (Just Kidding Chevy Fans). This wouldn't be the last time The Grump would lose to a Hemi Mopar in 1966. A 327 verses a 426 Hemi, not exactly a fair fight but they were both A/Stockers in 66.
Tony Janes Wrote:
"Colesy, The first Russ Mathews picture is Pomona".
Thanks Tony, I fixed it.
great '66 winternats coverage colsey!
love the 'late model' B/S '66 belair and grump's chevy II pictures!
hey Verne.... he knows who you are by the discription i gave him of you(friend of ronnie e. ect... not sure if he'll go or not but i'll remind him tommorow... What car are you building???
great '66 winternats coverage colsey!
love the 'late model' B/S '66 belair and grump's chevy II pictures!
Nothing like looking back 43 years ago. That's quite a write-up by Jerry Gross from Super Stock magazine. Those are the kind of articles I was reading at school when I should have been paying attention to the teacher. Who'd a thought I'd still be reading them today?
Buckshot at the Winternationals
thanks colesy! im getting some things together to upload... loving this!!
Note the class designation on the window of Paula's Olds in the single picture. I believe that it's F-2 A/SA, an AHRA class. The circled number at the top of the window was her handicap number as measured in car lengths for running off the Eliminator after class was over.
In 1966 AHRA came fairly close to cornering the market on the Los Angeles area tracks. Either the week before or the week after the NHRA Winternationals at Pomona, Irwindale hosted the AHRA version of the same event. Paula's car was an easy cross-over car. Fontana, Irwindale, Lion's, and eventually Orange County all passed through AHRA sanction through those years. Fontana may have been closed by 1966 but we ran AHRA classes there weekly in 1964 and 1965.
Not a topic to clog up this thread with. I'll talk to you and Pop if I see you next Thurs. Should be there in Ronnie's '62.
If you look back to the beginnings of stock racing at one time there was a percentage of exhaust flow that was required to pass through a working exhaust system I seem to remember 5% was the requirement. Look at the 64 Hemis and earlier super stockers and their factory headers with a pipe coming off the collectors leading to the exhaust system. Direct collector to air weren't allowed had to be collector with cap and the bypass for the required portion of exhaust gases. Very early 60's or so.
Claymore, the first car that I had any direct involvement with ('63 Plymouth Stage I) in the spring of 1963 had fender-well headers that connected to the stock exhaust system. Since it was a show-room car, the system was complete, fairly heavy, and functional. Of course, in the beginning the car was street-driven occasionally and there was no option to the hookup.
I recall that a good percentage of the stockers that showed up at San Gabriel Raceway on Saturday nights at that time were street driven or were marginally capable of being street driven. No one even complained about it at that point as I recall. I don't remember a specific 5% rule but it seems to me that it all had to be connected and "cut-outs" in the stock head pipes but without headers were fairly common. My '62 Galaxie 406 car had cut-outs but at that time headers were a little outside my reach. First and second-year school teachers weren't very far up the food chain when it came to income and after the rent and car payment were made, there was only so much left over.
Things evolved rather rapidly in this area with the arrival of AHRA tracks and their rather relaxed rules in 1964. The first car that I owned as a dedicated "race" car was a '57 Corvette that was originally conceived to become an NHRA Stocker but the focus shifted to the new game in town after most of the local tracks switched to that sanction. AHRA had no requirement for the full exhaust system (nor much else in the way of requirements) and that suited me because my budget would have been stretched to reconstruct the rather complex and completely rotted out exhaust system that was on the car when I acquired it. A set of second-hand Headers by Doug served just fine.
When the time came to get serious and begin the switch back to NHRA sanction in 1970, the requirement for a functional exhaust had been removed from the equation. Therefore, I'm a little unsure of how the evolution timeline progressed. Your recollection seems accurate to me.
I've seen pictures though of '57 jr. stockers that appear to have wide open fenderwell headers? The Patrick Bros. In-Bomber had a single chrome straight pipe and glasspack "hung" under the car from about the firewall to rear axle, not connected to anything, and running open Stahl fenderwell headers. This is in the 1968/1969 era...
I think I remember but I checked my old rule books to be sure. I stil have them from '62 to '75. In 1971 exhaust systems in stock eliminator were optional. 1970 and earlier the tail pipe had to extend to the at least the rear axle, be connected to the header collector and be operational if the headers were capped. All you needed was a small hole in the collector to make the system operational if capped at idle. I remember the first time we took our wagon for a test drive on the street. We clamped tin cans on the collectors with hose clamps but with only a small hole in the collector the cans blew off the first time I jumped on it. Scared the crap out of me.
OK, here is another reason why this board and specifically, the Jr. Stock thread, is so enjoyable and informative, and in this case, inspiring!:
My good friend Carl Bennett is interested in tracking down the SS/I Camaro he and Ron Sirianni campaigned back in the mid 70's. The only info Carl has at the moment is that he and Ronnie sold the car to someone in Canada.
I know this is not a lot to go on, but any information about the car's whereabouts, former/present owners, old/new sightings of the car, etc. would be appreciated. He and I figured this thread would be the most logical place to start the search!
For reference, here is a photo of the car (from the Bill Truby collection):
Here's another very-well-known looong-wheelbase big Ford (from 8mm movie film) @ York -- 1963
Tell that ol' hippie I said to come on here and ask for himself.
Thanks for the latest installment, Steve!
From your writings, I can tell that "Johnny" lived it! IT was the same way for so many guys with that thirst for the track and the competition.
You write from the heart as well as the memory. And that's really saying something considering that you're older than dirt!!!!
I know the exhaust system rule was still there in 1969. When I finished my 427 SS/E Chevelle in April of 1969 after an all night friday thrash, I went to Island for some break in shots. The tech guy wouldn't let me run SS since I had no exhaust system and wouldn't let me run Modified with no roll bar. Rather than waste the trip I talked the owner (Ed Kowalick, I think) into letting me make 2 runs, one just before eliminations started and another as the last car down the track. The second run they put Jerry Stein next to me in his A/SA Plymouth. I was excited to beat him and really excited when I ran 122 MPH.
The next year the rule was gone.
Trying to remember but I think it had to be real late 70's or early 80's when the requirement for full system was dropped. But for sure there was a requirement for a portion of the exhaust had to pass through the system just not sure how far back it was ending in 65 or so I think and I'm fairly sure it was 5%. Like some of the other guys have mentioned there were some creative solutions to getting around the problem.
And like Chuck Norton reminded me of CUT OUTS dam it's been awhile since I heard anyone mention them. Had my first set on my 1964 Galaxy 500 XL with a 390. Had wingnuts and welded the bolts so they wouldn't turn so the caps could be opened and closed with gloves in a flash "what me officer nooo my car is quiet" The next time was in near time bringing back an old trick to solve a new problem. I took a 2 1/2 inch collector extensions and cut them into my (Sorry) 1989 mustang 5.0 before headers were offered. Made a flat metal cap for them and presto open exhaust that didn't throw a cell good old cut outs. Welding shop bitching that he had to use a plasm cutter turned way up to cut the new Ford SS exhaust.
Yes, Verne, alas, you are right. Not only that -- I was oxygen deprived at birth, am semi-dyslexic, brain damaged, pre-Alzheimers, short and -- I can't TYPE!
WOW!! Haven't had - and won't take time - to read all the postst here, but this is NEAT!
Was born & raised in Lansing, MI, home of the Chevair Racing Team and knew all its members. Team captain was Dick Griffin who went from building Studillacs in the 50's, to Corvairs in the 60's and so was their mentor/coach. He drag raced in FL well into his 80's (birthday-wise) and was always competitive.
BTW ... Doug Kahl who also won - I think - the last NHRA "Little Stock Eliminator" national championship (1962 Plymouth wagon) is, as well, a Lansingite.
BTW 2 ... once accused Junior Stock star Jerre Stahl od having the world's only Junior Stock "C-gasser". He reminds me of that to this day.
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