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Projects New engine or rebuild?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Michigan Don, May 6, 2020.

  1. Mimilan
    Joined: Jun 13, 2019
    Posts: 650

    Mimilan
    Member

    Bore it out to STD 390 bore [4.050"] and drop a 428 crank in it for 410"
    The 352 and 390 had the same casting, so it bores safely [over that ,sonic test it]

    Better still

    You can buy complete 4.25" stroker kits for around $2k .
    With a 4.05 bore that would make it 438"
    This would make a big lazy engine [with matching numbers to your car]

    Apart from boring ,all you would need the machine shop for, is to cut the existing "valves and seats" and fitting new cam bearings.
    You'll also need a complete cam kit , gaskets ,and freeze plugs

    Doing your own assembly , you should be able to piece together a strong 438" FE for under $5K

    With a small 600 cfm 4 barrel carb you would have stump pulling torque.


    It would look like a standard vehicle , but have strong low down power and a good lazy cruising manners

    Edit:
    https://www.jegs.com/i/Scat/942/1-94644BI/10002/-1
    or
    https://www.cnc-motorsports.com/157...-fe-390-445-mahle-105-1-flat-top-pistons.html

    Also he biggest weight saving on an FE is an alloy intake
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2020
  2. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 6,203

    anthony myrick
    Member

    It’s tru about “no OD needed” but changing a high gear ratio from the low 300s/high 200s with say a 370/390 and adding the OD makes a huge difference on how that car feels.
    I just talked with a friend of mine, Ford technician. His service dept is full of new 5.0s with issues. Mostly internal engine noises.
     
    57JoeFoMoPar and Michigan Don like this.
  3. ekimneirbo
    Joined: Apr 29, 2017
    Posts: 1,466

    ekimneirbo
    Member
    from Brooks Ky

    What about building a 460. Cheap to buy and costs about the same to rebuild. There's no replacement for displacement,,........
     
  4. Michigan Don
    Joined: Jun 17, 2013
    Posts: 50

    Michigan Don
    Member

    It is a factory 352 cu in 4 barrel low compression.
    Transmission is factory automatic (Crusie-O-Matic). Rear is 2.91 as fastcar1953 mentioned.

     

    Attached Files:

  5. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 6,203

    anthony myrick
    Member

  6. Rusty O'Toole
    Joined: Sep 17, 2006
    Posts: 9,298

    Rusty O'Toole
    Member

    Do you know what kind of car weighs 4000 pounds? A new Ford Taurus or Chevy Impala for a start. Your car weighs 3720 pounds (shipping weight). So don't worry about a 352 being too weak to pull it around. There are lots of later model full size cars that are just as heavy or heavier with 350 and 351 V8s that do fine, like full size Cadillac, Olds, Lincoln, etc.

    If it is full of bad gas you are going to need to drain the tank and possibly clean it or replace it anyway. Suggest you start by checking the gas, draining the old gas if necessary, and putting on a good fuel filter. Then clean the carb and give it a tuneup. This does not have to cost much money, you don't even have to replace the plugs and points, you can clean and gap them, check plug wires, air filter, etc and put in a carb kit for not much money. If you do overhaul the carb be sure you get all the passages clean and don't go by the instruction sheet that comes with the kit, it is incomplete and filled with errors. Get the manufacturer's instructions from a Ford factory manual or from the carb manufacturer.

    60,000 miles is not bad. If the car was maintained halfway decent it should have lots of life left.

    PS the symptom you describe might just be clogged idle jets. This is common on cars that sit around. There is a very easy fix. Carefully screw the idle screws in all the way, counting how many turns and part turns it takes until they seat. Go easy and stop as soon as they seat, write down the turns, then take them out completely. Now take a compressed air hose and blow into the holes. Just 2 or 3 quick puffs will do it. Too much pressure could hurt the carb. If you don't have compressed air a can of computer cleaner air or a spray can of carb cleaner or fuel injection cleaner will work. Now put the idle screws in, and back them out the same number of turns they were before. This can be done in a few minutes, costs nothing, and what the heck, if it saves you buying a whole new motor why not give it a try. I would do this before I did anything else.
     
  7. s55mercury66
    Joined: Jul 6, 2009
    Posts: 3,980

    s55mercury66
    Member
    from SW Wyoming

    Be aware that no automatic overdrive trans will bolt to a Ford FE without an adapter. That wouldn't stop me from keeping an FE motor in it, but I don't have to have overdrive either. It is fairly easy to change center sections in a 9 inch rear, but that may not be your cup of tea either. Nice car, I would love to have one.
     
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  8. buffaloracer
    Joined: Aug 22, 2004
    Posts: 800

    buffaloracer
    Member
    from kansas

    I'd stick with the FE in one form or another.
    Pete
     
  9. Black Panther
    Joined: Jan 6, 2010
    Posts: 1,639

    Black Panther
    Member
    from SoCal

    It might be because I'm a cheapskate....but your shop said up to 10k to rebuild that engine? I also vote for keeping the 352.
     
    kidcampbell71 likes this.
  10. LWEL9226
    Joined: Jul 7, 2012
    Posts: 286

    LWEL9226
    Member
    from So. Oregon

    I did exactly this and had a very good running engine with very good torque in an F-250...
    Pulling a lot more weight than your car will ever weigh....

    I vote keep the FE...

    Lynn W
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2020
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  11. jetnow1
    Joined: Jan 30, 2008
    Posts: 1,598

    jetnow1
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from CT
    1. A-D Truckers

    That car probably has a 9 inch rear, I would swap pumpkins to something around 3:50, rebuild the carb, give it a good tuneup and drive it like I stole it.
     
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  12. OLDSMAN
    Joined: Jul 20, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    OLDSMAN
    BANNED

    That’s very true, but then the existing transmission wouldn’t work, the FE has its own bellhousing, it won’t bolt up to any other Ford engine
     
  13. OLDSMAN
    Joined: Jul 20, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    OLDSMAN
    BANNED

    The 352 isn’t considered a Y block. The Y block is the 262, 292, 312 engine
     
  14. southcross2631
    Joined: Jan 20, 2013
    Posts: 4,022

    southcross2631
    Member

    Check Barry Robotnik from Survival motorsports . He is the best FE builder in the country.
    He can sell you a long block for what kind of price you are talking.
    Should you not use the 352 . Send me a PM and I will be interested in it for my project.
    I am in Tn. and will come over and pick it up.
     
  15. Michigan Don
    Joined: Jun 17, 2013
    Posts: 50

    Michigan Don
    Member

    You've all convinced me to keep the 352 and rebuild, perhaps with some minor upgrade. Given that I'm adding air I think that would be good anyway. I like a numbers matching car so this makes the most sense. Maybe between my neighbor who has rebuilt engines and my Ford engine book we can get it done. I'm getting excited about this after years of waiting for the body work to be done.
    Thanks!
     
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  16. ekimneirbo
    Joined: Apr 29, 2017
    Posts: 1,466

    ekimneirbo
    Member
    from Brooks Ky

    True but if he bought a 460 he could probably get a later overdrive behind it and have the best of both worlds.
    The age old questions about building a car are always.......How much can I spend to do it and what do I want to do with it when I'm done?
    There are many threads on the HAMB where the quintessential 350/350 was used in a car and now the owner is unhappy with driving at highway speeds........so he must choose performance OR driveability. Since they already have a lot of money invested, they often grin and bear it. I'm just suggesting that stepping up to a different engine/trans before any money is invested may be a better choice.
    Since he stated above that he wants a "numbers matching" car, with small modification, the car will most likely be a "cruiser" rather than a "street racer". Nothing wrong with that if thats what he wants.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2020
  17. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 6,203

    anthony myrick
    Member

    Cool. A cam, better intake and better exhaust would really wake up that engine. Upgrade the ignition and enjoy.
    I would bet with the low miles on it the block won’t need much work.
    The previous owner of my 352 used non detergent oil. Gummed up the whole engine. The cyl bores were still in spec.
    Use a machinist you can trust to check it out.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2020
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  18. Michigan Don
    Joined: Jun 17, 2013
    Posts: 50

    Michigan Don
    Member

    Mileage on the odometer is ~60K, but it could be 160K (it would flip over at 99,999). Although the most recent date associated with the car was a early 1980s receipt I found inside. So perhaps it is a low mileage car.

     
  19. rivguy
    Joined: Feb 16, 2009
    Posts: 136

    rivguy
    Member

    Most of these early 1960's V8 powered cars were not underpowered. The speed limit used to be 65 mph. and everybody drove 70-80 mph. on the highways. I used to drive my Dad's '60 Dodge coupe with a slant six and a three speed back in the 1970s and it would go as fast as I ever needed to go. I 've had '56, '57 '64, Cadillacs and stock they will all exceed 100 mph. My '70 Mustang coupe with the 250 six running through a turbo muffler and auto would do 95 mph. and cruise easily at 70 mph. I had a calibrated speedo so that's the actual speed. I don't think that you would really want to or could, drive a beautiful Starliner like a new Mustang GT. That old Ford would be a handful with the Coyote and upgraded powertrain. I'll bet that you would never drive it any faster than you would with the 352. I had a '66 F250 with a lightly modded 360, carb, intake, electronic ignition and headers and that thing would easily go faster than I ever wanted to drive it. I know that a lot of younger guys did not grow up driving 50's 60's and '70s cars so they don't have an idea on how they perform. My Dad's '59 Impala coupe with the two barrel 283 and Powerglide was like a modern car, except for the brakes!
     
  20. southcross2631
    Joined: Jan 20, 2013
    Posts: 4,022

    southcross2631
    Member

    Good choice to rebuild your 352 . I worked as a line mechanic at a Ford dealer in Az. We used to get trucks off the Navajo reservation that had 100k on them and had not really been maintained.
    Most showed no bore wear in spite of all the miles and a lot of dirt roads.
    The 352 will cruise all day at 90 and not break a sweat. A few upgrades and you can have 300 hp and still not have to run premium gas.
     
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  21. finn
    Joined: Jan 25, 2006
    Posts: 690

    finn
    Member

    Speed limit in Michigan, and most other states with the possible exception of East Coast states was 70 when I got my license in the mid sixties. Everybody drove five or ten mph faster than the limit and those old cars did fine.

    Not as relaxing as modern cars with better aerodynamics, less wind noise, better sound insulation, and overdrive transmissions, but we did it nevertheless.

    The 300 hp 352 was a high compression engine, with 125 hp more than my dads Full sized Ford.

    get it running with the current engine. Fix what’s wrong before you make a boneheaded mistake and spend $10k that doesn’t address the issues.

    Then, if you want more power, get a 390 rotating assembly and overbore your 352 to 390 bore size, and you have a 390 but keep your original block.

    Aluminum heads and intake, and maybe an electronic ignition, headers, and you’re done.

    There are adaptors to ad an AOD
    overdrive, but then you probably want to rehear.
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2020
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  22. indyjps
    Joined: Feb 21, 2007
    Posts: 3,943

    indyjps
    Member

    How about a compression check? See what kind of shape the engine is in.

    If that checks good, Rusty O'Toole had good pointers on getting the carb in shape and get it running.

    Pulling the engine to replace gaskets, pull the pan, clean it out, paint the engine and engine bay would be a good move.
    Swapping in a factory 390 cam would give plenty of go.....390 GT?
    https://www.mercurystuff.com/fe-camshaft-specs.html
     
    loudbang likes this.
  23. How about a lil diagnosing for what you have first......... OR- throw your bank account at it, and feel redeemed.
    You just might be surprised at what you might find............
    Real easy for everyone to tell you how to/what to/ and spend your money.........
    BUT- What would THEY do if it was theirs?:rolleyes:.
    Spend some time trying to get it dialed in before you dive off the deep end.........Sounds like it needs some attention.
    But- That's just me....... Results may vary.........o_O
     
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  24.  
  25. 2OLD2FAST
    Joined: Feb 3, 2010
    Posts: 2,743

    2OLD2FAST
    Member
    from illinois

    You say its " only" 300 horse in a 2ton car , my 300hp 327 4speed Impala was fun to drive !..put over 100k miles on that car ...
     
  26. sunbeam
    Joined: Oct 22, 2010
    Posts: 4,979

    sunbeam
    Member

    Last edited: May 7, 2020
  27. To agree and add to what Finn said. My first car was a 1960 Sunliner, got it after my dad passed in 1967, it was our family's second car, other car was a 1964 Mercury Park Lane convertible.

    Both the 352 Y code engine in the Ford and the 390 Z code in the Mercury were both rated at 300 hp., both four barrels and high compression engines. Don't worry about keeping up with traffic or doing 70, that car will exceed that easily. The ONLY reason I got rid of the car in the fall of 1968 was due to the body rust. Literally the worst car I have ever had, left front door to lock and unlock it you would pull the door skin out and move the lock rod up or down. Rear quarters, did not exist from the wheel openings down and from the fins up. Yep, even the tops of the fins rusted out. I traded it to a friend, it ended up in his 56 Ford Victoria 2 door, spring of 69 is was sold to another guy and put in a 64 Ford wagon as a replacement for a 390 that tossed a rod.

    Couple random ramblings, the 352 at 300 hp had a higher HP to CID ratio than the 390 did, similar weight. The 360 HP engine that others have spoken about, if memory is correct that was a solid lifter engine, the 300 was hydraulic.
     
  28. Michigan Don
    Joined: Jun 17, 2013
    Posts: 50

    Michigan Don
    Member

    Engines been out of the car for a couple years so can't check compression (it's my understanding you need to turn it over to do so).
     
  29. If not easy to set up to spin over, you can always do a leakdown test to check condition. Testers are available, as are plans online to make one at home. Plans usually have instructions on how to do, and what to expect.
     
    6-bangertim likes this.
  30. Been running FE 390's since about 1978.....don't have any issues with my F-250 - F350 or my F350 wrecker...ran a nice 1963 1/2 Galaxie with a built up 390 with 428 guts/crank and top in....ran nice with the 427 exhaust manifolds........thru a 4p top loader.........
     

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