The Jalopy Journal
Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Lono, Dec 3, 2012.
I'm sure there be some head scratching coming Ed.
There's a 80's mopar not far away i need to stop and check out. i dont even know what it is. Maybe a 318 is an easier fit?
I told you a 318 would be an easier fit! i have put several of these in the previous Plymouth engine compartment and it works well. It's lighter and it's architecture is better suited to engine compartment your trying to put it into. Sometimes being different just leads to lots of time spent for very little gain. Seldom does "cause I have it" ever work out.
Here is a pic with a 318 and the 'perfect' exhaust manifold:
That's a little more like it. The 429 motor mount needs to sit right where the steering box is and the column is in the way of the left side head.
Besides Ford guys, Mopar guys and even GM guys would have all had a laugh at your expense.
I dont know plymouths very well but I am a big fan of using what you already have.
Heres my 53 chevy with a caddy motor in it. Firewall recessed and radiator moved forward, but its in there and I enjoy watching folks scratch there head trying to guess what it is.
Stock bore and stroke, 3.590 x 4.360 = 428.792
Bored .001 over, 3.590 x 4.361 = 428.989 Cu.In.
Bored .010 over, 3.590 x 4.370 = 430.761 Cu.In.
Bored .100 over, 3.590 x 4.460 = 448.687 Cu.In.
Bored 1.000 over, 3.590 x 5.360 = 648.043 Cu.In.
Boring a 429 .100 over doesn't leave a whole lot of cylinder wall left, if any.
While many will call foul, I say go for it. I got a 413 Chrysler to fit in my Henry J. Granted, there is very little Henry J left from the firewall forward, including the firewall, but my meager fabrication skills are making progress, slowly, but she's not gonna be a hack job. I still can't figure out why I did it though, as I don't really even like Mopars. Go figure.
I had a look see at the thing down the lane.
Its a 80 Labaron w/ a 318 for $500 (Meaning $300).
If the rear end fits as well, it may be worth picking up... what say you?
Is that a truck manifold?
circa 1972 dart-valiant
Nice. thank you.
Thinking out loud here, If that Labaron is a clip, anyone know if it fits this frame? I wonder if the tacking is similar. R and P, V8... hmmmm.
Even better than the "circa 72" dart manifold is the 66-67 ones for a 273-318. I tried both on my 360 in my 50 dodge and the earlier one gave me a bit more clearance.
Old pick ups & Vans can be had cheap & have the rear sump set up you need, or..get that one & snag the pan, oil pump pick up, dip stick & tube @ the junk yard. The pick up dipstick & tube should be a bit shorter than the Van one. You'll probably still have to do a little trimming to clear the Alt, but way easier than the 429.
lots of room in 49's the ramcharger boys put a hemi in theirs
I'd like to see a little more on the 318/360 swap into these cars, I have a 47 Chrysler in my to do pile that would be a good candidate for this.
One of my best friends stuffed this one in there and he used these headers for performance (2" primaries) and for the fit. They dump right at the back of the front fender so it gives me room for plug access, and fantastic performance. We believe they are from the early 70's and were probably to made for stuffing a 440 in an A body. They sure look great in this engine bay! Plus if I ever decide to go to a 4 speed, I wont have to worry about exhaust.
The engine is set back quite a bit and the trans tunnel was built by someone who had it before my friend did. I could probably cut a few inches out of each side of the tunnel and still have more than enough room around the 727. But that wont happen until later on. I dont want to take it off the road for that long.
I always loved the car and when he decided to sell it I traded my roadrunner and some $$ to get it. It was one of those deals where we were standing around shootin the shit and he liked my car, and I liked his. The rest is history..
Since then I have changed out seats, patched floors, rearranged some other sections of the interior and added charger disc brakes up front. Blown and rebuilt the engine, changed converters ect...
The rear end is a stock Mopar 8 3/4 with a 3:23 sure grip from an A body with the spring pads moved to fit.
I drive the snot out of it, but that engine is not very street friendly...... At some point I will have to detune it as I drive it more and more. It is WAY more engine than this car needs, but damn it is fun to drive!
Plans are to completely rewire it, change it over to a power rack, detune the engine some and strip and spray it.
I have been building and thrashing on cars since I was 12. The wife (24 yrs now) has said on multiple occasions that this is the one car that is not for sale.
It drives people nuts at some of the car cruses because they can't figure out what it is LOL. The Mopar guys will recognize the engine, but still have trouble placing the body. I mean, think about it..... When was the last time you saw a 51 Belvedere like this at a car cruse???
That 451" solid roller engine usually has people waiting for me to shut it down and open the hood. It is crazy loud, stupid fast, and gets lots of smiles to the gallon. Definitely not your average cookie cutter ride.
Major props to Fugly (Damon K.) for building this ride then passing it along to me. I always told him how much I liked this car. Thank goodness for his automotive ADD and limited garage space LOL.
There's a bunch of Threads on putting a 318 in the 46-48-early 50s. Including a copy of the article from Street Rod Action that is in the Tex Smith Mopar Hot Rods book.
I know there are a few options ( yes I've been searching endlessly) and now I've narrowed down to a couple. Each pose a couple questions worth asking.
1) I have an S10 frame - is it a match for a 1950 Plymouth frame.
2) is the clip out of a 80 lebaron a match to the same frame.
Like I've said, I dont have my Plymouth here right now to be able to take my own measurements.
The reason I'm now thinking of a clip is for a modern that I can drop and update the steering as the same time. Experienced opinions more than welcome.
The LeBaron should have the same removable front suspension with transverse torsion bars as the Dodge Aspen and Plymouth Volare and it is VERY popular with the 1953-1956 Ford F-100 guys.
If you can drive the Lebaron home it's practically a perfect donor for your car, assuming the front clip width is close.
A guy in Ala. started to put his '46 Plym on an S-10 frame but gave up, not saying it can't be done, just he didn't.
I have a 79 labaron down The road i have been contimplating The exact same thing, but in my 54 savoy. Waiting on feed back on your measurments, pros, and cons.
I'm certain you will have a hard, very hard time with the 429 swap. We just finished a 429 into a 64 Galaxie earlier this year. It was a struggle. The 429 is a big motor. Same block as a 460. It really fills up the engine compartment in the Galaxie. I'd think it would be really tough / near impossible in an earlier car. Exhaust will be a major issue. A rack is nearly manditory. A good project to not start.
Do the 318. It has to be tons easier.
I will tell for a fact that cross torsion front suspension is too wide for that car. You need some thing in the 58" hub to hub range under that car, and the cross torsion unit is right at 61 1/2". The very best bet is a MustangII unit, but it's not a simple deal with these cars as it is a subframe type deal. The S-10 would be okay width wise, but the steering box is way far forward and would occupy the same space as the grill. The only other I would really look at would be a XJ Jag unit, as the pre '87 stuff checks in at about 59"... Still just a bit wide though to put any substancial tire under this car.
That will take a bit of work Hell my 318 took alot of work. the real issue you have is the master sets to close to the trans and the pipes real tight down there. look at my albums theres a few shots of the work that I had to do. good luck looks like a tight body.
Drove home my donor today.
318 auto, disk brakes....
I wonder how much I can pull out of it?
Oh yes it can be done, but i did a 460 swap in my 35 Plymouth. Click on
the link for my build. It rund pretty good but traction is a big problem.
Glad to see your moving along! After seeing this i decided to get get a doner for mine as well. It will save me a ton when it comes to the little things i'll need, plus i'll get the new rear end, disc brakes and new streering rack all at once.
I know most people upgrade to a dual master under the floor, what are your plans for that? I was hopping i could get my motor low enough to fit a master with a booster under the hood. Haven't put to much thought into it tho.
I'm hoping that way too. It's possible. Of course there are smaller boosters out there but I really want to pick this donor clean. A little more effort leave a little more money.
Besides, I dont need it on the road next week.
A 429 in anything is awesome, but a 429 in a stude is just badass.
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