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muncie 4 speed shifter help

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by 65ssnova, Feb 12, 2013.

  1. 65ssnova
    Joined: Jan 3, 2013
    Posts: 88

    65ssnova
    Member
    from Tulsa OK

    I just got my oem 1965 nova muncie shifter to replace the old worn out hurst, they claim it comes with all the needed hardware to bolt it on. My first problem was the new arms that bolt onto the shift fork mounts(the three spots with the bolts in the center) DO NOT fit, they are about a 1/4 too small, The next problem is how do i mount it to the tranny? the hurst comp plus had a mounting plate, this one looks to just bolt on the tranny but how? Any instructions would be great because i didnt get any and any help would be appreciated. Thanks
     
  2. Engine man
    Joined: Jan 30, 2011
    Posts: 3,476

    Engine man
    Member
    from Wisconsin

    Hurst shifters usually came with replacement arms that bolt to the transmission shift forks. They have a bigger hole because they used replaceable bushings. They sometimes used a shorter arm for a shorter throw. You may have to find OEM arms. You might also have to find the OEM shifter mount.
     
  3. isky1843
    Joined: Feb 3, 2011
    Posts: 157

    isky1843
    Member

    This is a simple process:

    Step 1: pick up the Muncie shifter and hold it so you are looking at it from the left side
    Step 2: throw that giant hunk of shit as far as humanly possible
    Step 3: rebuild of replace your hurst

    Sorry, I have fought with three Muncie shifters and never been able to get one to work reliably. The last one left my car stuck on the railroad tracks in San Marcos TX stuck between gears. Of course I was dressed nice because I was on my way to pick up a girl for a date and had to crawl under the car on the tracks to get it in neutral. Hopefully someone can give you som real advice. I just had to post because I'm still sour about the whole incident.

    And no, I didn't get any that night. I blame the grease spot on my shirt caused by that damn shifter!
     
  4. Black Panther
    Joined: Jan 6, 2010
    Posts: 1,608

    Black Panther
    Member
    from SoCal

    Youre first problem is that your tranny doesnt appear to be 1965 vintage...in about 1969 or so Muncie transmissions shift levers were held on by bolts...from 1963-68 they had studs that stuck out and the shift levers were held on by nuts...you would think that the shouldered part of the mechanism that actually does the work would be the same size from one style to the other...but they arent. You can either put the early style shift arrangement in your existing trans...the ones coming out of the side cover are no problem..but the reverse one is another story...or you can get levers for the shifter that are for the later style trans. You cannot modify the levers you have to fit because they are hardened steel...I tried to do this once and it was a big waste of time. Lastly I think the shifter body just bolts to the tailshaft housing of the trans...assuming you have a normal Muncie style trans (could be a T-10 even) you should be able to figure that part out. To confirm that the trans is a Muncie...look at the side cover of the trans and make sure it has a straight bottom edge. If it has a curved bottom edge its a T-10...
     

  5. goon56
    Joined: May 31, 2008
    Posts: 232

    goon56
    Member
    from new jersey

    how did it not come with any instructions? and good shift arms should have a plastic or metal bushing that takes up the slop between the rod and shift arms. i've seen some that dont have a bushing, and the hole in the shift forks is smaller. seems like you should maybe just gotten a new hurst shifter or gotten the old one rebuilt. hurst does this- And i also have seem that recently they went from the weird snake shift rods to straight rods by changing the shift fork plates. not to mention the different ways the shifters can mount to the tail shaft. you might have to make a few phone calls and do a little improvising. don't know if that helped any.
     
  6. 65ssnova
    Joined: Jan 3, 2013
    Posts: 88

    65ssnova
    Member
    from Tulsa OK

    I ran the numbers on my trans, its a 65-67 muncie m-20, Im not talking about the bushing end, Im talking about the shift levers. The new three brackets, the reverse bracket fits but the other two do not.
     
  7. Black Panther
    Joined: Jan 6, 2010
    Posts: 1,608

    Black Panther
    Member
    from SoCal

    Ok...the reverse one fits...how is it held on? With a nut or do you have to use a bolt? Is the way the levers are held on the same when you compare the side cover and the reverse? Or do you have to bolt on the levers at the side cover and a stud coming out for reverse?
     
  8. Black Panther
    Joined: Jan 6, 2010
    Posts: 1,608

    Black Panther
    Member
    from SoCal

    By the way there is no 1965-67 Muncie..1965 case ended in 325 and the 1966-67 case ended in 010...which one is yours? Either one should have the stud arrangement for the shift levers for all three positions..sounds like they might have used later style bolt on shift forks in the side cover when the trans was rebuilt or something...
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2013
  9. 65ssnova
    Joined: Jan 3, 2013
    Posts: 88

    65ssnova
    Member
    from Tulsa OK

    Alright thanks Black Panther, the website i ran the numbers on must have been incorrect. Mine ends in 010 so i stand corrected. Could it just have been a late 65 and they stuck the 66-67 trans in? just wondering. And i have boxed back up the shifter and will be ordering a new hurst comp plus.
     
  10. Russco
    Joined: Nov 27, 2005
    Posts: 4,132

    Russco
    Member
    from Central IL

    Black Panther is correct, there are two styles of shafts for the shift arms to mount to. One style is a stud with a nut the other is a bolt going into the end of the shaft, both arms are available from Hurst.
     
  11. 65ssnova
    Joined: Jan 3, 2013
    Posts: 88

    65ssnova
    Member
    from Tulsa OK

    But my reverse has a stud for a nut while my 1-4th are bolt, so this has been changed?
     
  12. Russco
    Joined: Nov 27, 2005
    Posts: 4,132

    Russco
    Member
    from Central IL

    YEP thats not uncommon on something that old, its not a big deal. Just get whatever arms you need to match up. In the past I've enlarged the holes in the smaller type and make them work but no need just get the correct ones.I think 68 and earlier are the stud type 69 up bolt on type.
     
  13. Fast67VelleN2O
    Joined: Mar 6, 2007
    Posts: 494

    Fast67VelleN2O
    Member

    The reproduction shifter is suppose to fit a 1965 Muncie with 1965 parts. Your muncie is not 100% 1965 correct, so the levers aren't going to fit on your shifter cams.
     
  14. Black Panther
    Joined: Jan 6, 2010
    Posts: 1,608

    Black Panther
    Member
    from SoCal

    Muncie shifters get a bad rap...most guys associate them being junk because by the time they got their hands on one..it was already worn out. That being said they dont feel like a Hurst..but you can get used to them..there just isnt a spring action in the neutral gate and it feels a little sloppier. Every vintage Corvette into the late 70s had a similar style shifter to yours and they run around just fine. I dont know if you bought a repro Muncie shifter or a rebuilt one..but that call is yours whether to use it or Hurst.

    As far as why your side cover shift levers are now bolt on? Somebody changed it at some point, maybe during a rebuild..I have seen that before..but you end up using two sets of levers right? One style for the 1-4 and the other set merely for reverse. You can find the right shift fork pieces you need...once you pull the side cover off they come off without tools..you just slide the correct ones in and put it back together. Putting the side cover back on is a little bit of an art though and tricky to do if you havent done it before...you can find the right parts on Ebay or a trans shop or if someone you know has a Muncie parts stash. You can cheap out and use the levers you already have and just get a new Hurst body..that might be the easiest way to go..since you already have everything else...and it solves your problem of a worn out shifter...many times new steel bushings will tighten up old shifters feel dramatically...
     
  15. Homemade44
    Joined: Feb 7, 2007
    Posts: 519

    Homemade44
    Member

    The tail shaft housing had a three hole mount cast into the housing. That is where the shifter mounted. There was a long and a short tail shaft housing depending on application. The housing has to match the length of your tail shaft.

    What has been said about the shifter arms is correct.
     
  16. 65ssnova
    Joined: Jan 3, 2013
    Posts: 88

    65ssnova
    Member
    from Tulsa OK

    Alright thanks guys, Wheres the best deal on a new comp plus?
     
  17. Black Panther
    Joined: Jan 6, 2010
    Posts: 1,608

    Black Panther
    Member
    from SoCal

    Check with Jegs or Summit but I think they are about $200...you dont need the installation kit (bracket, rods, levers and handle) since you should already have the rest of the stuff from your old shifter to do the install...
     
  18. isky1843
    Joined: Feb 3, 2011
    Posts: 157

    isky1843
    Member

    You also might check with Hurst about having yours rebuilt. Doesn't hurt to check.
     
  19. pdq67
    Joined: Feb 12, 2007
    Posts: 787

    pdq67
    Member

    FWIW, my '67 SS/RS CAmaro's Muncie shifter bolt's to a mount that then bolt's the the crossmember. It also has a "torque rod" that bolts along side the top of it that fastens to the stationary shifter then to the driver's side front top tranny bolt.

    This gizmo is supposed to limit shifter arm twisting under power. I used to just chain my engine down back then.

    One thing I do is that I adjust 2nd and 3rd by about a thread to maybe a thread and a 1/2 so that both of them angle across to the "H" when shifted.

    This is a "touchy-feelie" thing so try it.

    Like this

    ....l_/
    .../..l

    pdq67
     
  20. Rich B.
    Joined: Jan 23, 2008
    Posts: 761

    Rich B.
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Portage,IN

    Here's a pic of muncie tail housing used in early Nova's. It has more mounting holes to locate the shifter further forward to help clear the front seat.
    This one is out of my old 66 Nova, I found a rear housing on e-bay. They will mount on any muncie. (Part# 3857584)

    Summit lists #373 4354 as the correct installation kit for your Nova.

    You can make anything fit, but for stock floor location this is what is needed.

    Good luck, Rich
     

    Attached Files:

  21. Engine man
    Joined: Jan 30, 2011
    Posts: 3,476

    Engine man
    Member
    from Wisconsin

    I remember those. Whoever thought that it was a good idea to not mount the shifter on the transmission should have been neutered. Stupid people shouldn't breed.
     

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