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Projects Model A direction question

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by 1oldtimer, Nov 23, 2018.

  1. I'm pretty sure I know what the answer to one question will be :rolleyes:. But I have a '28 Tudor I'm working on, it has a 2.0 Pinto motor and a T5 (now), I have some hop up parts for the motor and it fits in the frame really nice. Now I have a good friend that's going to give me his complete worn out '50 Merc Flathead.....you know where this is going right?. I'm on the fence about redoing the mounts (engine and trans), exhaust, radiator and other stuff to get the Flathead in there.

    Secondly, I have in my possession 2 different transmissions to run... one is a mechanical speedo S10 T5 and the other is a T170 RTS..........so what do you gents think...questions/comments/flaming arrows?.

    The car in question:
    https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/automotive-a-d-d-the-28-tudor.753531/#post-10453080
     
    chryslerfan55 likes this.
  2. Rice n Beans Garage
    Joined: Dec 17, 2006
    Posts: 1,380

    Rice n Beans Garage
    Member

    Dan, stay with the 4 banger !!
     
  3. FYI, there is a 181 cubic inch Mercrruiser Marine in my AVATAR. The '50 Merc Flathead is slightly larger than the pre 48 engine so you will have a few more bridges to cross. Check the engine out in the archives. I would pass on it and look for an earlier engine. Be sure to calculate the total costs before you start. Flatheads are expensive. I think I would leave the Pinto in there and drive the hell out of it.

    Charlie Stephens
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2018
    firstinsteele and chryslerfan55 like this.
  4. evintho
    Joined: May 28, 2007
    Posts: 1,048

    evintho
    Member

    Yep, flatheads are expensive. I'd stick with the Pinto motor...………………...or upgrade to a 2.3 turbo. Yes I'm biased as I'm running one in my roadster. Your Pinto motor is roughly 85 hp on a good day. A 2.3 turbo produces 200hp bone stock. 300hp is easily achievable with junkyard parts! In addition, it'll bolt right in and you won't have to deal with all the fabrication nightmares. I can attest to the fact that these little motors can fly, are virtually bulletproof and can easily pull 28-30 mpg! Can you tell I'm a fan?

    [​IMG]

    Found one...……………
    https://losangeles.craigslist.org/sfv/cto/d/1987-thunderbird-turbo-coupe/6724888272.html

    Pull the motor and part out the car. There's a huge market for '87-'88 TC parts. I bought this one for $300 and parted it out for just a hair over $3000.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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  5. The37Kid
    Joined: Apr 30, 2004
    Posts: 24,741

    The37Kid
    Member

    Keep the full hood closed & enjoy the Pinto. Bob
     
    firstinsteele likes this.
  6. I’ve been getting lucky at the pick a parts with transmissions and then the free flathead, now I’m wondering.
     
  7. oldsman41
    Joined: Jun 25, 2010
    Posts: 1,059

    oldsman41
    Member

    For the money it will cost i would stay with the banger and play with the flatty. Tear it down and find out if the block is good most aren’t. If good than build it the way you want your money your car.
     
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  8. adam401
    Joined: Dec 27, 2007
    Posts: 1,587

    adam401
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Fuck all that. Pinto 4 cylinder what's going on here? When do we all of a sudden decide that the cheapest option is the best option? It would also be cheaper to yank the engine outta my bmw and put it in but in case we all forgot this is a pre 65 traditional hot rod forum. Lame econo box bullshit. Shameful.
     
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  9. If you have a Hot Rod you can drive and enjoy, even with a Pinto motor I say leave it alone. You want to do something with the Flat Motor, start building a second car. 5 years from now when you can finally drive the new one sell the first one to recover maybe a third of what you spent on the Flathead rebuild.
    The Wizzard
    P.S. They never go as planned and they come apart so easily.
     
    Dino 64 likes this.
  10. I agree with Adam, not as expressive but still in agreement. Mitch.
     
    clem likes this.
  11. 41rodderz
    Joined: Sep 27, 2010
    Posts: 1,253

    41rodderz
    Member
    from Oregon

    My first 31 was a high boy with a 2.3 Pinto engine, automatic and 8" Mustandg rear. Great on gas and scooted the hot rod right along.
     
  12. Truckdoctor Andy
    Joined: Jan 13, 2017
    Posts: 401

    Truckdoctor Andy
    Member

    Truthfully, stock to stock, I’ll bet the Pinto makes as much, if not more power. Put a small cam, four barrel, and a header on that banger and it will make more power than the flat motor. I’d keep the banger!


    Sent from my iPhone using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  13. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 3,632

    anthony myrick
    Member
    from al

    Run the pinto like ya stole it while ya build the flatty
    This is the hamb
    Flat motors are cooler than pinto bangers (not a pinto hater)
     
  14. adam401
    Joined: Dec 27, 2007
    Posts: 1,587

    adam401
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    No doubt the pinto has more power. Just like one could take a Toyota 2jz and probably blow the doors off most of the cars on this site but that's not really what we're doing here is it.
     
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  15. Stovebolt
    Joined: May 2, 2001
    Posts: 3,229

    Stovebolt
    Member

    Dan,

    looks like the ADD may have kicked in again!!! LOL ;-)

    I will play devils advocate - you have enough on your plate atm, The Hillman, the Chevy Panel, the tudor - It may be easier, quicker, cheaper to build a bigger turbo motor for the tudor, and get many more miles and smiles out of it and enjoy the build on the other cars. To bring the tudor up into the traditional build realm will mean you will probably need to travel a long and expensive road undergoing a full rebuild, let alone the search for parts, re-conditioning them etc etc.

    Just my thoughts as another automotive ADD sufferer.

    Oh yeah - and you can send the flathead and T5 my way
     
  16. tb33anda3rd
    Joined: Oct 8, 2010
    Posts: 14,046

    tb33anda3rd
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    1. Connecticut HAMB'ers

    Pinto? Flathead?.......lose -lose.
    can't be your only options?
     
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  17. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 3,632

    anthony myrick
    Member
    from al

    Unless you are racing another flathead.
    Or just like the look
     
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  18. lake_harley
    Joined: Jun 4, 2017
    Posts: 350

    lake_harley
    Member

    1oldtimer....I feel your pain. I have a '31 Coupe that I have anguished over for more than a year.

    In my case option 1 is the Model A 4-banger (warmed up a bit) with a RTS-170 overdrive and the banjo rearend that's already converted to open drive. That, I think, would be the easy build with less fabrication since the engine mounts and spring mounts are already in place.

    Option 2 is a 2.5L S-10 engine with either T-4 or T-5 transmission. Rearend choice for this option gets complicated though depending on transmission choice and would be either the open drive banjo, early Bronco 9", a 8" Ford that would need to be narrowed about 2", or the S-10 rearend that is almost a bit too narrow. Throw in a bit of indecision between transverse leaf or coilover suspended rearend if using the S-10 engine and anything other than the banjo rearend.

    I won't even get into the issues of brakes, wheel selection and wheel bolt patterns. The hell of it is I have all of this stuff. The only big thing I'd have to do to go any direction is to build the Model A banger engine if that was the route I choose, and I've somewhat already started that process.

    If I understand your situation your sedan is actually a driver (or almost) with the Pinto engine? I think I'd go the route Charlie Steffens suggested in post number 3 and drive it. Maybe just leave the hood closed to avoid the sneers from some.

    Lynn
     
  19. dan31
    Joined: Jul 3, 2011
    Posts: 918

    dan31
    Member

    When you close your eyes really ,really tight... does your dream car have a Pinto in it?.
     
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  20. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 3,632

    anthony myrick
    Member
    from al

    I had a 88 ranger with a 2.0
    Worst slug I have ever owned. Even worse than the 4 cyl s10
     
    dan31 likes this.
  21. Rickybop
    Joined: May 23, 2008
    Posts: 5,266

    Rickybop
    Member
    from Michigan

    "Since when...?"
    Since Ryan changed the format to include forums for traditional hot rods and customs, but also a third one...this one...to accommodate traditionally STYLED hot rods and customs. Because Ryan understands...as most here do...that some but not all can or even want to have a totally traditional car...for various reasons. So if our cars at least look traditional but have some hidden modern components, we won't be shunned, excluded, brow-beaten or otherwise disrespected. Well...except by the self-appointed traditional police posers.
    So NOT "shameful"...lol...not at all.
    1oldtimer, you've got a good lookin' Model A sedan there. The guys who suggested that you keep the Pinto drive-train obviously know how the REAL world of hot rodding is, (the real world in general for that matter...lol) and how lofty plans can stall a project. And they just don't want that to happen to you. Enjoy your car as it is. Then do a whole lot of research to decide if you really want to go more traditional...and suffer the consequenses...lol.
    One more thought. If we looked closely enough, we could pick at almost any car out there for not being 100% traditional. Of course we don't want heartbeat paint jobs and the like. But we can be reasonable.
    Good luck, 1oldtimer!
     
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  22. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 3,632

    anthony myrick
    Member
    from al

    Cat fight
    Old school hamb
     
    Irish Mike likes this.
  23. a boner
    Joined: Dec 25, 2004
    Posts: 4,600

    a boner
    Member

    Banger! Especially with a T-5.
     
  24. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 15,564

    gimpyshotrods
    Member

    Blown Hemi, Hydro.
     
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  25. BamaMav
    Joined: Jun 19, 2011
    Posts: 2,572

    BamaMav
    Member
    from Berry, AL

    I can't believe nobody has said just put a SBC in it......

    Guess I just did.:p:D:eek::rolleyes:
     
    dan31 likes this.
  26. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 3,632

    anthony myrick
    Member
    from al

    You mean a LS
    Little shevy
     
  27. Beanscoot
    Joined: May 14, 2008
    Posts: 751

    Beanscoot
    Member

    Well at least call it by its proper name, the 122 CID, not "2 litres".
    Or 140 cubic inches, if going with that turbo one.
    It eases the pain a little.
    And I vote for the four speed.
     
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  28. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 15,564

    gimpyshotrods
    Member

    The smaller the displacement, the more gears it should have.
     
  29. Ok, now to muddy the waters more........:), it's an endearing trait I have.
    The '28 is still in project form, frame almost done and set-up for rugged duty (boxed and crossmembered) just in case. The 122 was in there when I bought it, it's now sporting a T5 and beefed up banjo. I'm trying to use a lot of stock or cast type parts, not much to re work for some motors/trans combos. Full fendered, stock Ford wires, un chopped and most likely with the hood on.

    Motors:
    The Merc motor was running but smoking on deceleration (and not overheating).
    The 122 will be rebuilt with a big valve, ported head and a cam.
    I also have a 283, 327 or 350 (all turn free but unknown condition)
    Lastly I have a 322 Nailhead in unknown condition and no adapters.

    Trans:
    A Mech speedo S-10 T5
    A T170 RTS o/d 4spd
    A 2.3 Ford T-5 w/ mech speedo mods

    All transmissions will most likely have to be rebuilt as all came from the wrecking yard.

    One's a belly button, one's expensive to build and the other 2 are slow (and expensive to build).
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2019
  30. Rusty O'Toole
    Joined: Sep 17, 2006
    Posts: 8,668

    Rusty O'Toole
    Member

    Check out the flathead first. Chances are the block is cracked around the exhaust valves and elsewhere. Most of them are. If it is still good scoop it up. Then price a rebuild job. You may decide to stick with the 4 cylinder but it's nice to have a choice.
     

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