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LPG Installation Requirements

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by 38plymouth, Jun 17, 2008.

  1. stude_trucks
    Joined: Sep 13, 2007
    Posts: 4,755

    stude_trucks
    Member

    Absolutely true - 100%. The biggest, and honestly only real problem with running propane is filling up when you need to. Finding the auto fuel refill stations is no easy convenient task. But, they are out there, just need to find them and they aren't usually 24/7 by any means either. Mostly just at the actual Propane supplier locations.

    You can just get and run BBQ propane, same exact stuff, just different filling fittings and tank requirements. Which is mostly all about making sure you pay your road taxes when it goes into a road vehicle. I do believe you can also purchase non-taxed LPG and then pay the taxes yourself manually if you want to do it all legally as they will make you do if you get caught.

    I have a 29 gal LPG for my pickup and I also have a forklift tank and a hose that can connect the 2 in an emergency if I were to run out. You can also do the same thing with a simple BBQ tank or even a little propane torch cylinder if you wanted and just needed to get off the side of the road and maybe down a mile or 2. I don't drive too far out of town because my truck is an old 50's farm truck and not good for long trips anyway. But, I do have to remember to get a fill up 8-5 M-F only or hope I have enough for the weekend if I forget.

    If they just had more propane tanks at gas stations, it would be not much of a concern. Chicken/egg problem though. Not enough demand because too much of a pain to fill up therefore not enough suppliers willing to invest in the few $'s and space for a tank and effort to deal with the few LPG wackos who just can't go along with the program. Again, keep in mind, the gas companies also supply LPG as it is largely produced as a by-product of gasoline refining. So, you would think it wouldn't be that hard to promote and distribute something you already make anyway.

    But, with that said, LPG is not a magic cure all and held down by conspiracy. Since it is a by-product of gasoline refinement, you still need to refine a lot of gas to get a lot of LPG. So, you can't just have all LPG and then little demand for the gas. Ideally you sell exactly all the LPG and other products you make and there isn't any extra supply to hold down prices on any of it. When LPG was in much lower demand years ago, they use to just burn it offs as just total waste. That is what the flames were mostly at the top of the refining towers. You don't really see those any more for environmental reason too - at least in the US anyway. They probably still do it where they can and don't want to be bothered with dealing with the "waste" gases.



     
  2. garyv
    Joined: Nov 6, 2006
    Posts: 129

    garyv
    Member

    According to this wikipedia article (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compressed_natural_gas), "a suitably designed natural gas engine may have a higher output compared with a petrol engine because the octane number of natural gas is higher than that of petrol."

    Also, "The state of Utah offers a statewide network of CNG filling stations...".
     
  3. stude_trucks
    Joined: Sep 13, 2007
    Posts: 4,755

    stude_trucks
    Member

    Yeah, that is right and CNG in Utah is very cheap too. A lot of the CNG vehicles in other states that were made in the 90's and early 2000's that don't re-sell well because of the pain to re-fill get sent into Utah and are in very high demand because of the huge savings in fuel costs.

    But, because this is secret rocket science that only Utah possess, other states haven't been able to do the same thing.

    Let's see;
    1. easy cheap to do (convert gas motors and build filling network)
    2. very clean burning
    3. lower maintenance of engines
    4. actually safer than gasoline (yes, despite what some might believe, it is true - look up facts if you don't think so before responding with stories about friends of friends who accidentally blew up whole towns)
    5. tech. figured out back in like 1910
    6. probably would kill oil/gas profit margins
    = better keep the lid on that idea as much as possible.

     
  4. KY Boy
    Joined: Sep 6, 2006
    Posts: 403

    KY Boy
    Member

    honda is selling a CNG car now or soon...not sure. But there is a company that is selling a home compressor aimed at that market to take the natural gas from your regular home gas line and compress it to ~3600psi for use in a CNG vehicle. Pretty expensive piece but if you are determined to tell the oil gods no, its an option. http://www.myphill.com/
     
  5. miller
    Joined: Aug 5, 2006
    Posts: 489

    miller
    Member
    from New Jersey

    Hi ....Very informative info....Questions what mileage can be had using the LPG?....For example if I get 30 mpg on gas will I get the same or better on LPG?...What is the costs per mile for LPG?......With the car I have now I get just over 30 MPG at $3.89 a gallon ( highway ) that's about 13 cents a mile..Thanks ...Miller
     
  6. stude_trucks
    Joined: Sep 13, 2007
    Posts: 4,755

    stude_trucks
    Member

    Yeah, that is a great option for a lot of people actually, even at the somewhat large initial expense. Home CNG is still pretty cheap and even with the road taxes added, would be a big savings over gasoline. Unfortunately, my house doesn't have a gas meter/supply and the extra expense of that may be a deal killer for some like me. Very convenient to just fill up in your garage though with cheap CNG, that is for sure.

    I am looking at possibly moving to a new house and I will be sure to make sure the next one already has gas just in case for this very reason.

    By the way, all the recent LPG/CNG chatter is relevant to the hamb. Hot rods with old carb. motors are very easy to convert over to either. The only real down side is having to give up on the old highly prized carburetors. But, new LPG crabs. look pretty vintage, just not patinated. So, you can run a kick ass hot rod on LPG or CNG and don't need to compromise too much of anything major. Especially considering that most hot rods are driven on a limited basis anyway and with very limited range (I said most, not all). I have thought about starting a conversion service just for old cars, but too busy with other stuff and not sure there would be enough interest anyway do to tradition and natural resistance to alternative stuff.



     
  7. fc ute
    Joined: Mar 7, 2001
    Posts: 166

    fc ute
    Member

    here in western australia we get subsidised by the government for LPG conversions, i had my wifes holden commodore done, cost was $3160 and we recieved $3000 rebate from the state and federal govern,ment.
    LPG at the garage down the road from me is 58.2 cents, unleaded fuel $1.65 per litre, has cut her weekly fuel bill from $85 to about $38
    here in australia most garages have lpg
     
  8. KY Boy
    Joined: Sep 6, 2006
    Posts: 403

    KY Boy
    Member

    I agree completely. If traditional hot rodding isnt about innovation and finding a better way to do something then we should all go home as we are just a bunch of geeks copying each other
     
  9. The forum below is pretty good for getting answers you can trust, and the forum owner is in Canada:

    http://fuelsforum.rasoenterprises.com/ , then go to the propane forum.

    Thanks,
    Kurt
     
  10. reefer
    Joined: Oct 17, 2001
    Posts: 768

    reefer
    Member

  11. Bruce Lancaster
    Joined: Oct 9, 2001
    Posts: 21,682

    Bruce Lancaster
    Member Emeritus

    "...The only real down side is having to give up on the old highly prized carburetors..." Not necessarily...I actually have a mysterious gas attachment for a 97. Wish I could post pictures...maybe somebody modern could stop by.
    Basically, it is a casting that fits between throttle casting and main body, with an inlet and some sort of valve. There's a stretched pump rod to keep gasoline option working, and a kind of lever up top that allows float to be jammed in the up position when running gas...I have NO clue as to type of gas or when or why it was made or if there would be more pieces needed...but theres a dual fuel Stromberg!
    Might be a problem finding enough for those running eight of 'em...
     
  12. Bruce Lancaster
    Joined: Oct 9, 2001
    Posts: 21,682

    Bruce Lancaster
    Member Emeritus

    By the way, it is clearly a commercially built piece designed for a Stromberg, not an improvisation. It is so simple I wonder if it might be for something like a pump engine running at a steady speed all the time.
     
  13. Kenneth S
    Joined: Dec 15, 2007
    Posts: 1,527

    Kenneth S
    Member

    Put a blower on top the engine putting out about 12 psi of boost, a propane mixer or two on top of the blower with that good 110 octane lpg, what power loss?
     

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