Register now to get rid of these ads!

Hot Rods Let's talk Cadillac 331's, 365 and 390's

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Roothawg, Apr 7, 2016.

  1. Roothawg
    Joined: Mar 14, 2001
    Posts: 17,234

    Roothawg
    Member

    It's all about the wow factor. I know in my head that it makes sense to do the whole LS deal, but they just don't have the soul an old motor has. You can't really compare apples to apples. I want a lumpy idle and enough power to shred the tires if the mood strikes. My performance side always creeps in and takes over. I ned to just have a race car for that purpose and the rest just need to be drivers, cool drivers of course.
     
    cretin, loudbang and Johnboy34 like this.
  2. Roothawg
    Joined: Mar 14, 2001
    Posts: 17,234

    Roothawg
    Member

    I have a request for all the Caddy guys out there. I am trying to find any old magazine articles from the 50's-60's on the Cadillacs. Not specifically on the motor alone, but maybe on the cars that had them. Trying to gleen any little tidbits on performance.
     
  3. Moriarity
    Joined: Apr 11, 2001
    Posts: 10,906

    Moriarity
    SUPER MODERATOR
    Staff Member

    IMG_7271.jpg The first engine in Ohio George's 33 Willys was a Caddy....
     
    ls1yj, loudbang and rod1 like this.
  4. Roothawg
    Joined: Mar 14, 2001
    Posts: 17,234

    Roothawg
    Member

    No kidding? Thanks Mark
     
    Moriarity likes this.
  5. Moriarity
    Joined: Apr 11, 2001
    Posts: 10,906

    Moriarity
    SUPER MODERATOR
    Staff Member

    Go ahead and build the Caddy, we all know you want to... show us how it is done!
     
    falconsprint63 and Roothawg like this.
  6. Roothawg
    Joined: Mar 14, 2001
    Posts: 17,234

    Roothawg
    Member

  7. Roothawg
    Joined: Mar 14, 2001
    Posts: 17,234

    Roothawg
    Member

    Interview with Ohio George. Small bit about the Caddy.

    ET: We know your ’33 Willys gasser started out with a Cadillac engine and won A/G at the ’59 NHRA Nationals (Detroit) and ’60 and ’61 at Indy. Was there much potential in this engine, and what was its greatest weakness?
    OG: I didn’t really ever have any problems with the Cadillac. It made more horse-power than we could use due to the rock-hard drag slicks and dusty track surfaces. So my Caddy was very reliable. It was a 390 that we bored and stroked to 414 cubes.

    ET: After the Cadillac, you switched to a Chevy small-block. Why did the smaller Chevy seem like a better idea?
    OG: The reason I went to the small-block Chevy in 1963 was because of a change in the NHRA rule book. A modification in the weight break (pounds required per cubic inch) made it so the large Caddy 414 made me carry more vehicle weight. And knowing I had too much power as it was, the switch to the smaller-displacement Chevy small-block—still supercharged—helped keep the car competitive. As I recall, it was a 327 we bored and stroked to 375 cubic inches—39 cubes less than the Caddy. But the new rule was the main reason I yanked the Caddy.
     
  8. Roothawg
    Joined: Mar 14, 2001
    Posts: 17,234

    Roothawg
    Member

  9. Moriarity
    Joined: Apr 11, 2001
    Posts: 10,906

    Moriarity
    SUPER MODERATOR
    Staff Member

    Were you going to run an automatic transmission? It would be way more fun with a stick...... just my opinion


    Sent from my iPhone using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
    ls1yj likes this.
  10. Roothawg
    Joined: Mar 14, 2001
    Posts: 17,234

    Roothawg
    Member

    Last edited: May 8, 2017
    Moriarity and c322348 like this.
  11. Von Hartmann
    Joined: Nov 21, 2006
    Posts: 959

    Von Hartmann
    Member
    from Byron, IL

    I don't have much to add to the discussion that hasn't already been said, other than I've started collecting parts for a full race cadillac. I want to see how much power I can get out of one of these. The body I have obtained for said project is a 1931 Vicky. The transmission is a Hydro Stick.
     
    clunker, Roothawg and c322348 like this.
  12. Von Hartmann
    Joined: Nov 21, 2006
    Posts: 959

    Von Hartmann
    Member
    from Byron, IL

    Here is the setup I'm going to use on it. This is the hard to find Cadillac Hilborn setup with the original magneto fuel pump drive and pump. It was made in 1958 and sold to Moon for a 365 Caddy
    IMG_4541.JPG
     
  13. Moriarity
    Joined: Apr 11, 2001
    Posts: 10,906

    Moriarity
    SUPER MODERATOR
    Staff Member

    cretin, c322348 and Roothawg like this.
  14. Roothawg
    Joined: Mar 14, 2001
    Posts: 17,234

    Roothawg
    Member

    Von Hartman, very nice!! Have you been able to find anyone that has good info for speed parts?
     
  15. Moriarity
    Joined: Apr 11, 2001
    Posts: 10,906

    Moriarity
    SUPER MODERATOR
    Staff Member




    I looked at my copy and there is no mention of that car/ engine inside. It is in reference to an article on blowers and blower drives
     
    Roothawg likes this.
  16. Roothawg
    Joined: Mar 14, 2001
    Posts: 17,234

    Roothawg
    Member

    Thanks. Saved me $10.
     
    Moriarity likes this.
  17. c322348
    Joined: Nov 28, 2007
    Posts: 267

    c322348
    Member

    I've got a set of those injectors, but not all the other stuff! Hilborn has great records and the staff are very friendly.


    Sent from my iPad using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  18. Moriarity
    Joined: Apr 11, 2001
    Posts: 10,906

    Moriarity
    SUPER MODERATOR
    Staff Member

    Johnboy34, warbird1, clunker and 3 others like this.
  19. Roothawg
    Joined: Mar 14, 2001
    Posts: 17,234

    Roothawg
    Member

    Awesome Mark. Man jewelry!
     
    Moriarity likes this.
  20. wrenchbender
    Joined: Sep 5, 2007
    Posts: 1,209

    wrenchbender
    Member

    I'm wanting to build a 390 cad for my willys but it will have a blower on it my biggest concern in doin this is the camshaft and finding someone to make a blower grind I've called a few places but so far no dice. Cody parr ran a blown injected 390 cad in his altered roadster way back as did Ohio George so someone has to have built cams by the way that's a nice hilborn you got there if I had it I would run it for sure


    Chrome don't get ya home
     
    loudbang likes this.
  21. Roothawg
    Joined: Mar 14, 2001
    Posts: 17,234

    Roothawg
    Member

    Cody doesn't remember. I talked with him a few months back. His dad, Don was the main wrench on the Caddy. Sadly, he passed away several years ago.
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2017
    loudbang likes this.
  22. Von Hartmann
    Joined: Nov 21, 2006
    Posts: 959

    Von Hartmann
    Member
    from Byron, IL

    Roothawg , I can't say I've found a great source of information. I've done a lot of reading in various threads. The Cad500parts.com source is new to me and looks like a great place to start. Last I knew, isky cams could still grind a cam, so I figured I would call up Ron Iskenderian and see what he had in the archives for old race cam grinds. I've talked to him in the past and they have a pretty extensive log of old grinds that they do not list.
     
    loudbang likes this.
  23. Von Hartmann
    Joined: Nov 21, 2006
    Posts: 959

    Von Hartmann
    Member
    from Byron, IL

    I thought this was cool. This is a 1964 M/T performance book and catalog I recently picked up. Thompson offered factory cadillac rods, boxed with chrome moly plates.
    IMG_4545.JPG IMG_4546.JPG
     
    loudbang and Moriarity like this.
  24. Von Hartmann
    Joined: Nov 21, 2006
    Posts: 959

    Von Hartmann
    Member
    from Byron, IL

    And aluminum rods
    IMG_4547.JPG
     
    loudbang and Moriarity like this.
  25. Roothawg
    Joined: Mar 14, 2001
    Posts: 17,234

    Roothawg
    Member

    I just got off the phone with Billy at Howards cams. They can go up to a .520" lift with the blanks they have. If you run that you can stay with a 1.260" SBC spring.

    I am trying to get specs on what the standard Best or Fel Pro head gaskets measure out, thickness wise.
     
    loudbang likes this.
  26. Von Hartmann
    Joined: Nov 21, 2006
    Posts: 959

    Von Hartmann
    Member
    from Byron, IL

    That's good to know Howard's makes them. From what I understand, the lifter bores are the same as a small block Chevy. So, I'm hoping I can use Chevy roller lifters on a custom grind Caddy cam.
     
    loudbang likes this.
  27. Roothawg
    Joined: Mar 14, 2001
    Posts: 17,234

    Roothawg
    Member

    Just hung up the phone with Steve Long Racing cams. He by far has been the most knowledgeable. He knows the old caddy stuff.
    He gave me some good info.
    Here are the factory GM specs for the cams.

    Stock 390 4 barrel:
    Lobe Lift .263 x 1.6=.420"
    Duration 200 @ .050
    113 degree lobe center

    Tripower
    Intake .243"X 1.6=.388"
    Intake duration 196*@ .050
    Lobe center 109*

    Exhaust Lift .263 x1.6=.420"
    Exhaust Duration 209* @ .050
    110* lobe center



    He suggested limited the max lobe lift of .310" x 1.6=.496" and a max duration of 220* @ .050.
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2017
    Johnboy34 and loudbang like this.
  28. 42merc
    Joined: Dec 19, 2010
    Posts: 398

    42merc
    Member

    The Cad & SBC lifter diameter & length are the same & will interchange, but the distance between lifters as installed in the engine is greater in the Cad.
    Maybe a custom tie bar could be ordered.
     
    loudbang likes this.
  29. Roothawg
    Joined: Mar 14, 2001
    Posts: 17,234

    Roothawg
    Member

    Steve Long said he can only do regrinds now. I may use the specs Steve suggested and have a new one made by Howards. I told him I was already talking to them and he was cool with it. Super nice guy. He said he gets $85 to regrind one. Not real sure the pros and cons of new vs reground.

    Found this as well. Interesting read about the intakes. Maybe this is where the other articles got their info?
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: May 9, 2017
    loudbang likes this.
  30. Von Hartmann
    Joined: Nov 21, 2006
    Posts: 959

    Von Hartmann
    Member
    from Byron, IL

    42merc thanks for the info. I was wondering about the lifter spacing. I feel like making the custom lifter idlers is a doable thing.
     
    loudbang likes this.

Share This Page

Register now to get rid of these ads!

Archive

Copyright © 1995-2013 The Jalopy Journal: Steal our stuff, we'll kick your teeth in. Terms of Service. Privacy Policy.

Atomic Industry
Forum software by XenForo™ ©2010-2014 XenForo Ltd.