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Art & Inspiration Lazy 8 logo search

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Pothole, Apr 14, 2020.

  1. Pothole
    Joined: Dec 14, 2017
    Posts: 81

    Pothole
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Folks I am trying to find the source, purpose, application and whatever else that is associated with the V8 logo/emblem sometimes called the "lazy eight". This is the logo used on the Ford powered Harry Miller/Preston Tucker Indy racers for 34 or 35. It is very similar to the well know 1938 V8 logo which is on the hubcap as well as other locations.
    The difference is the 2 vs 3 long rules. Here is what I know so far: a side from being on the Miller car it is on 1935 sales literature, painted on a road in a promotion video, and an accessory mountable to hood ornaments.

    The 1935 Ford was selected as the pace car for the 35 Indy races so I was wondering if Ford added the third(center) rule for this purpose. I'm thinking this because I can't locate it on any production Ford car or truck. I have contacted the research center at the Henry Ford but due to the virus-19 they are closed. I contacted the Miller/Offy historical society and they had no idea. I have a couple of other contacts to vintage racing organizations buy haven't heard back yet. Naturally I turn now to the HAMB, my source for all hotrod.

    Being a Miller/Tucker fan I want to use this image on the side of a TROG racer as a simple tribute to them(at least in my mind) but need to better understand the logo's purpose. It is very period correct.

    Images: Miller racer, hubcap w/2 rule logo, hood ornament, tribute Model A
     

    Attached Files:

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  2. gnichols
    Joined: Mar 6, 2008
    Posts: 10,718

    gnichols
    Member
    from Tampa, FL

    Isn't it just a variant of all the flathead V8 graphics?
     
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  3. Pothole
    Joined: Dec 14, 2017
    Posts: 81

    Pothole
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Yes it is a variant but there must have been a purpose beyond just being a simple design change. Its limited use seems to have a specific application, at least it looks that way. But then maybe not.???
     
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  4. Fordors
    Joined: Sep 22, 2016
    Posts: 2,764

    Fordors
    Member

    Nothing positive, just an opinion, but to me the added line gives the appearance of an arrow- rapid, forward motion.
     
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  5. Stogy
    Joined: Feb 10, 2007
    Posts: 16,392

    Stogy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER


    @Pothole, While I couldn't find information relating to the reason I did find evidence of its use over several years over varying styles of Ford Product...

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    img7901_94564.jpg

    :rolleyes:...(update) 1936 Manual

    Credit to Artists, Owners
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2020
  6. 5window
    Joined: Jan 29, 2005
    Posts: 7,368

    5window
    Member

    Maybe the "third rail" was to add stability to the ornament, then copied over on the paper/painted logos?
     
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  7. The Shift Wizard
    Joined: Jan 10, 2017
    Posts: 1,956

    The Shift Wizard
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Some of those examples have the center, 3rd line definitely extended like an arrow and all seem to be horizontal or laid back "lazy" as if viewed on the pavement, not upright.
    So my money would be on "arrow/arrowhead with forward motion".
    Fordors wins....... with Stogy a close second...... but only because he had to hunt up the graphics.​
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2020
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  8. belair
    Joined: Jul 10, 2006
    Posts: 8,410

    belair
    Member

    I would guess to add some strength to the cast emblem, or just because it adds some Art Deco swoopiness to it-which it does.
     
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  9. Stogy
    Joined: Feb 10, 2007
    Posts: 16,392

    Stogy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I think @Pothole believes it was tied to the Race Excitement and it may very well have been...moving/flying forward at the speed of an arrow as again highlighted by @Fordors...the excitment lasted a few years anyway and that beauty of deco did fadeaway it seams with the generation of auto it adorned...it was a beautiful time in styling for Ford Unquestionably and a great time for Art with many of the Artworks looking literally Customized by the liberties of Artist...

    In another twist perhaps it had a connection to Ford in Aviation...as Ford had one covered on land an air travel...

    It was a beautiful design with or without in my opinion...just as the vehicles it adorned
     
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  10. Pothole
    Joined: Dec 14, 2017
    Posts: 81

    Pothole
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

     
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  11. Pothole
    Joined: Dec 14, 2017
    Posts: 81

    Pothole
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Stogy,
    You deserve a quality cigar for all those examples. Its interesting that they are all different which further confuses the issue, or am I being dense. Thanks again
     
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  12. from a napkin doodle.....car porn.....could have been his wife that posed for the emblem???
     
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  13. Pothole
    Joined: Dec 14, 2017
    Posts: 81

    Pothole
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Gentlemen(?) - Really
    I try to understand your passions but please take it to a new thread, you have hijacked this one.
    Surly we have been locked up too long. Its the "Lazy" eight, not the "Lady" eight we should be discussing.
     
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  14. Stogy
    Joined: Feb 10, 2007
    Posts: 16,392

    Stogy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    @Pothole this really boils down to that meeting in the Boardroom back in 1935...and if it involved Racing that's kinda cool...You Say you saw them on the 34 Gilmore Racers? I'm going snooping...;)

    Update...Somewhat lengthy search yielded nothing before 35...

    I look at those racers as the catalyst for Highboy Hotrods...that's my thought of Hotrod for the day...is that fact or fictitious Stogy...

    Did they have Gilmore 32's?
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2020
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  15. s55mercury66
    Joined: Jul 6, 2009
    Posts: 3,980

    s55mercury66
    Member
    from SW Wyoming

    Maybe Preston Tucker, as the promoter behind the 1935 Ford Indy program, had a hand in the design of the laid over V8. It makes a good tale, anyway.
     
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  16. rudestude
    Joined: Mar 23, 2016
    Posts: 2,449

    rudestude
    Member

    Sorry for the disturbing post....I removed it.
    I just thought I would throw a little humor in the pot....at such a grim time I thought a chuckle would be ok.
    I guess I wasn't thinking about the chance of a mother , wife , daughter, female in general, including the church lady being on this thread.
    And being I was not the OP , I didn't have the right to change the course of the thread.
    So again I apologize and I will just go spank myself .
    Also I did some searching "online" about the insignia on the Miller Indy car and all I found was that it was just a stylized version of regular "Lazy 8" to go along with stylish flowing body lines and paint design.
    Good day.....

    Sent from my SM-T387V using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  17. 5window
    Joined: Jan 29, 2005
    Posts: 7,368

    5window
    Member

    Mine,too
     
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  18. Pothole
    Joined: Dec 14, 2017
    Posts: 81

    Pothole
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Stogy I think I wrote 34 Miller/Tucker. These were the Ford powered cars that had the steering issues. I don't know if the logo was used on Gilmore racers.
     
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  19. Pothole
    Joined: Dec 14, 2017
    Posts: 81

    Pothole
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Thanks Rudestude & Five Window- it was getting out of control and I don't think for a moment you mint to insult anyone but you did a very responsible think in removing it. Thank you, Pothole
    Now back to the dull lazy eight.
     
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  20. Stogy
    Joined: Feb 10, 2007
    Posts: 16,392

    Stogy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Apologies I thought these racers had also shared that stylized logo as it graced much of Fords overall images from Cars to trucks...I even thought it may have had a connection to Ford Aviation but couldn't find anything...as the center line has a relation to a fuselage on a delta wing...

    I really think they are all variations of the same stylized logo just different perspectives where they were applied by the Artists...man they were good...
     
  21. hotrodjack33
    Joined: Aug 19, 2019
    Posts: 994

    hotrodjack33
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    WTF. So now when you start a thread, you own and control it ?

    I probably could add some insight to this thread from Lou Maxon Inc (Ford's ad agency in the '30s)...but you have managed to make this thread too uncomfortable to bother with
     
  22. 5window
    Joined: Jan 29, 2005
    Posts: 7,368

    5window
    Member

    I think when you start a thread you do have some "ownership" and responsibility to keep it directed on the topic. Controlling is done by the moderators. Although I probably helped it stray off course, I have no objections to the OP or others trying to reel it back in onto topic. I like the original topic better than where we were going anyway.
     
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  23. rudestude
    Joined: Mar 23, 2016
    Posts: 2,449

    rudestude
    Member

    You may have this info already..
    The designer responsible for your subject was Walter Teague.
    The Art Nouveau version of the V8 insignia was first used on a token/coin for the Ford Exposition at the Century of Progress 1934 Chicago's Worlds Fair.
    Apparently he had a thing for arrows, in looking back at some of his involvement with other car companies the names of some of the cars had Arrow in them.
    And that probably was the reason for the Arrow Head Ford V8...just a thought.
    Anyways if you do some searching in the direction of his name and his other work you will probably get some answers.
    He had his hand in alot of different subjects of design that was very interesting, much like Raymond Loewy of Studebaker fame.
    Good luck on your search.
    Thanks
    Terry(aka Rudestude) 15871448574218571846308120202422.jpeg 15871448830522757811594228647334.jpeg

    Sent from my SM-T387V using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  24. Pothole
    Joined: Dec 14, 2017
    Posts: 81

    Pothole
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I am beginning to think that the lazy eight was not something Harry Miller had a hand in even though it was on his and Preston Tuckers Ford power Indy car. I recently heard back from Steve Zautke of the Harry Miller club who states he could find no "smoking gun" info on the logo either. I do feel we learned how the logo was used and when I hear back from The Henry Ford if things change I will be sure to post it. Thanks for the participation, if #23 runs at TROG and someone asked about the logo I can say "according to the guys on the HAMB" etc., etc
     
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  25. 5window
    Joined: Jan 29, 2005
    Posts: 7,368

    5window
    Member

    Is there a date on the Labor Rate Guide? Maybe earlier than '34?
     
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  26. Stogy
    Joined: Feb 10, 2007
    Posts: 16,392

    Stogy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Last edited: Apr 22, 2020
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  27. 5window
    Joined: Jan 29, 2005
    Posts: 7,368

    5window
    Member

    Thanks, guess that takes an earlier date out of the running. 30 cents for a hub cap, no charge to put it on!
     
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  28. Pothole
    Joined: Dec 14, 2017
    Posts: 81

    Pothole
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Rudestude's medallion post is another 1934 element- Ford being Indy pace car, Miller racer and now exposition medallion. Thanks, I will be search Walter Teaque. The Henry Ford is still not open but one of the Miller clubs that had nothing on the logo in question did provide a link to an interesting piece on the Ford name logo- link attached

    7 Facts About the Ford Emblem: A Complete History Since 1903
    https://autowise.com/ford-emblem-history/
     
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  29. Stogy
    Joined: Feb 10, 2007
    Posts: 16,392

    Stogy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Anytime that Logo pops up it's got a place Here...and open for discussion...a Beautiful time in Automobile
     
  30. I had one pop up in my yard and it’s wind activated! ;)
    Started out as a joke when I cut down a tree, ended up staying. Wife ain’t too happy.:)


    71DFAB57-4722-43AE-8581-F5575B6A91FF.jpeg
    Couldn’t help it.:)
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2020

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