I think he posted a pic of this car more than a year ago... I think this is a genuine effort by a genuine hot rodder... the reality tv thing is probably a means to an end : car = good tv, reality tv show = car done alot faster. the project might have been rushed along to get it on the show? just my opinion...
This is a cool project and I am glad Jesse finally got to run it. I hope he eventually jumps through the hoops and gets a certified record. One thing several people seem to miss is this is a internal combustion engine. Pistons, spark ignited, just like your car. Hydrogen is a challenge for several reasons. Consider this, the Stoich A/F ration for H2 is 34.3 to 1. (For comparison gasoline is 14.7 and Methanol is 6.47). Furthermore as a gaseous fuel the hydrogen displaces further air in the intake track. Finally, to avoid knock they probably run this engine at an equivalence ration of .45. The end result...A/F of about 76. Even though the LHV of H2 is higher than gasoline this is still one big air pump and difficult to get power out of. I am skeptical about their power claims (unless the water injection is spiked with methanol) but they still probably get about 260 hp (pulling a number out of my ass) out of the beast which is still an accomplishment, but dosn't sound as cool in front of the camera's. By the way, BMW is able to run stoich but they have very sophisticated labs with in cylinder measurements ($$$) so they can precisly map the engine in addition to variable valve timing to control knock. One question though, with all that talent, why did they have to paint it so ugly?
I'm with Jesse on this one. While I think the fuel cell cars are interesting and will have a positive future it is not combustion engine. I dig the idea of a converted engine Like Jesse' streamliner as someday it will pertain the cars we are driving/building now! Think of the R&D, money, time, blood sweat and thought that went into this car. I've seen it its BAD ASS, its like art on four wheels and guys here are doing their usual bashing and bringing up all the celebrity B.S. I dont get it. I'm impressed with it 199 is FAST thats all I know. Later Dave
i dont think there will be many people converting there hotrods to run on hydrogen when ethanol is everywhere, if your talking about fighting global warming then combusting hydrogen may have a role, there will never be a time when every guy or gal with half a brain won't be able to make there own ethanol.
"The SCTA (Southern Calif. Timing Association) was neither involved in, nor did we confirm Mr Jame's "record". In fact, Mr James did not set any record. What he did accomplish was to exceed an existing record speed previously set by BMW. His private timing event was timed by the same folks that time SCTA events and the course was set up by the same folks who set SCTA courses." Roy Creel, President, SCTA" Nice! The way I see it I played by SCTA's rules on everything. I had Mike Cook oversee everything we did on the car. I had "official" timing equipment set up, and got an SCTA official speed of 199.7mph. The car actually went 201.59mph on my GPS past the speed traps. Since SCTA is now being Dicks since this was not "sanctioned" event? I'm going to consider 201.59mph my top speed First Hydrogen I.C.E. car to Break 200mph Thanks SCTA!! <object width="425" height="240"> <embed src="http://cdn.smugmug.com/ria/ShizVidz-2008120101.swf" flashvars="s=ZT0xJmk9NTc0NjU1NDg1Jms9Q1c0OVomYT04NTIzMTg5X00zSENmJnU9ZnJhbmt5bHVja21hbg==" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="240"></object>
If, for some reason, it is not a sanctioned event or by some "rule" it, therefore, is not a record, then that's the way it is. As a teenager, I would think that my high school principal was "a dick" for one reason or another, but he was the principal and his rule or interpretation of said rule was the end of any discussion to the contrary. I doubt that just because you disagreed with the SCTA, that they are "dicks". It's their rules, just like the principal at my high school. I'd like to see their response to your record attempt with an actual quote of the rules that they are concerned about. I'm sure the SCTA would like to be supportive of your attempts as it would be good for all involved. So, get an official response from them in writing as to what they consider a violation of their rules. Your attitude and the direction that you take regarding this matter will be remembered as, quite possibly, the final chapter in the LSR run. Rather than calling anyone that disagrees with you "dicks" work through the process and let yourself be heard by them. If they continue to stand by their findings that the attempt is not legit, then show up everyone by going back, maybe to the salt, and get the record back and get it back "by the book". I'm sure we'd all like to see that record set by an American team. You have the resources and the media attention to get that record in style. Or, you can just call everybody "dicks". Good luck, one way or another...
Thanks for posting the pic of the Bullet, Rich. However I felt I needed to correct a couple things. The pic you put up is actually the original Buckeye Bullet, which was powered by batteries. The official and sanctioned records it holds are 271.737 FIA World Record, and 314.958 SCTA. Top speed "out the back door" was a tick shy of 322 mph. To date the Buckeye Bullet 2, powered by a pair of "gay" Ballard fuel cells, has run progressively faster speeds each trip to the salt. Last August we ran our best speeds yet with a timed mile of 280.007, exit speed of 286.476. GPS and wheel speed data on that run showed an instantaneous speed of over 297 mph. Since these runs were not backed up, as required by the governing bodies, they are not records of any kind. Not bad for "gay fuel cells", as some have called them. Now a few comments concerning Mr. James' (ahem) "record". SCTA does not have a separate class for hydrogen (or fuel cells for that matter). Mr. James' car would have to run in the same class as any other non-gasoline fuel and, as others have posted, his speeds, while pretty good for a first attempt and with a high pressure gas, are nowhere near the records for the class in which his car would compete. The FIA records held by BMW are for Category A (special construction), Group XV (hydrogen reciprocating engine), Class 10 (5000 cm^3 to 8000 cm^3). Mr. James' engine was 572 c.i., or 9373.4 cm^3, placing him in Class 11 (over 8000 cm^3). AS of January 20, 2009 there was no record for that class. It is up for grabs. Obviously his car was not in the same engine class as the BMW, so any claim of breaking it's record is without merit. Same with the SCTA records. Mr. James did go faster than the BMW, even if briefly. So he has every right to say he did. However, he did it with an engine over 50% larger in displacement than BMW used. And he did not break or shatter any record. I hope Mr. James takes his car to Bonneville to make a REAL record attempt. If he does, and the Bullet is also there, he just might see firsthand what "gay" fuel cells can do. As an FYI, the Buckeye Bullet 2 uses less than 2 kilograms of H2 per run and developes approximately 800 hp. I'm not sure how much Mr. James car uses, but since he needs three tanks (virtually indestructable, btw) I assume it is much more than 2 kilos.
First: Not all SCTA members are Dicks. There are many fast Vaginas as well in the SCTA. Second: Claiming times with a GPS or G-Tech is like having sex with an inflatable. Sure it's sex, but few will think you "scored". Third: Press releases are not normally thick enough to pry nails out of walls. Like the nails holding BMW's FIA certs on the wall. Maybe photo etch them on some sheet steel? PS - 199 is flying at El Mirage. And the car sounds bad-ass. Congrats! And I'm also a great believer in clean air, so I just point my exhaust pipe out the back.
What would happen if the tv people wanted a record with the Mustang powered lawn mower, would the SCTA form a new class. I would think that they could have saved money by going for the record when the actual SCTA was set up for records and then it would have been official one way or the other. It was a cool thing to watch, and Jesse certainly has my respect for the run, but it wasn't sanctioned, period, end of story. Everybody else has to play by the rules, with or without the finger. I gave up giving the finger to people 40 years ago.
I'm not taking away anything from a 199 at El Mirage. Quite the opposite. A big congrats is due. BMWs record is a two way average over a measured mile with FIM observers. How exactly they affect the time I don't know. But there is an accepted procedure for a "world record" and if you didn't follow that procedure your speed won't be ratfied. You went faster than the record one way. Doesn't count but you still went that fast. From what I've heard yours is the last television event the SCTA is going to be connected with. Something about dicks and cameras.
Ahhh, a landspeed thread {not} worth talking about {here} has brought over some esteemed gentlemen from another place to finally set the record straight. Finally. Although the team,driver included, should be commended for attaining such speeds on the cars first outing I myself erk at the publicity it has gained. Having said that the SCTA probably could have done alot more in the promotion of their sanctioning body. Why. There have been others trying for records over the years,some with luck,some with none, with absolutely no mention of their efforts. These are the stories i'd like to read about.
SCTA had nothing to do with your TV show. You are mistaking Mike Cook for the SCTA. You didn't get an SCTA official anything. You do realize that since you weren't at an SCTA "sanctioned" event they won't vouch for you right??? For someone who has competed as much as you have I am amazed that you are having so much difficulty with such a simple concept.
This kinda reminds me of the Stan Barrett/Budweiser Rocket Car being the first car to break the sound barrier. Anyway, since the SCTA record is WAY over 200 and the car isn't in the same class as the Beemer in FIA, I don't imagine they will try to set an "official" record (but I could be wrong, hope so). Time for a new project, how about jumping the Grand Canyon?
I don't understand. They set up the track, use all official gear and oversee the run and it doesn't count? That is weak. It doesn't matter to me if it's Jesse James or The Rev. Jesse Jackson, you jump through the hoops and and then they say no way, that is Bullshit.
"They" never agreed to be a part of all this. "They" didn't set up the track. "They" didn't oversee the run. "They" didn't inspect the car prior. "They" didn't inspect the car afterwards. "They" were blindsided by a press release that said "They" then promptly informed anybody who posted otherwise of the following: Other than that, you are right on. And before someone says Mike Cook did, well, so the F' what. Mike Cook is not SCTA, he is a member of the SCTA. I am a member of the SCTA. JJ is a member of the SCTA. Mike Cook has to put his cars through impound inspection to get an SCTA record as do I. The timing was provided by the same contractor that SCTA uses but the SCTA didn't do the timing themselves nor did they provide the chief timer to oversee it. They ran on the same physical lakebed that SCTA races on but did so after SCTA tore down their equipment and left. Exactly the same as if you went testing at the Pomona Dragstrip the DAY AFTER the Winter Nationals and claimed a NHRA ET or MPH record. No tech, no sanction = no record. Whats so damn hard about all this? It's really too bad it has devolved into JJ acting like a clown. The car is bad ass there were good reasons to run it at a private meet rather than a normal event while filming a TV show. So now bring it to Speedweek or to a regular El Mirage meet and get an official time. It could even go to Mike Cooks private FIA Sanctioned (see the difference there?) meet scheduled later this year at Bonneville and go after the BMW record.
They (being the SCTA) didn't set up ANYTHING...that is the point here. What is all this confusion...he DIDN'T set a record, end of discussion. Hey I just held my breath for 30 seconds...I'm calling worlds record!
Sure it counts. It counts enough to get him the certificate of speed he recieved and nothing more. You see, Mr. James didn't jump through the hoops required to set a record. He went around the hoops so he could say he went faster than the record. There is a big difference between the two that racers know about but the general public doesn't. And it is the general public's naivity that Mr James is $$banking$$ on...quite literally.
Can we call it a test and tuning day. He is well on his way what ever he does. JJ did great no question in JJ style. A land speed record? There are some things Hollywood can't buy!
It is TV and nothing more. If some rich guy pays a lot of money and hitches a ride with Russian astronauts into space, is he an astronaut? I remember an episode of one of his shows where JJ had marital problems and wanted to get away from the shop and life to think things out. He took Kid Rock and rode down to Mexico, along with a film crew, producers, Mexican police, etc. There is no doubt that JJ is talented craftsman and that is the only reason I watch his old shows. His new show is nothing more than "I'll pay you a lot of money, and you'll let me do it." If you pay him enough, he would get down on all-fours and bark like a dog, like most people would. The photo of them flipping-off is for his street cred only. Sorry guys.......
Well I would think that if JJ has any hair at all he will bring it out to a real meet at Bonneville where the car can stretch it's legs a little, the timing will not be in question, and see what kind of a record guy he really is. Out in the open with everyone watching, sort of.
Lots of horses. There are many worse ways to spend a weekend than blasting across the SoCal high desert to the roar of V8 power with hanging out with good friends and fellow racers.
I don't necessarily agree with everything you said, but I don't disagree either. Street cred? What, are we all still 16 years old looking to be badass? God, I hope not. Stow the finger, get your ass out to a real SCTA event, and either run for the record or don't. Everything else is just noise. With that, I'm getting off my ass and going over to Billetproof. There might be some posers, but I seriously doubt they'll be flipping me the bird.
The Jalopy Journal
