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Technical Is this enough trans cooler???

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by JK, Aug 28, 2019.

  1. https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Perma-Cool-1006-Frame-Rail-Transmission-Cooler,98065.html

    Looking at this cooler for my trans. It'll go at the bottom of an aluminum radiator and after the cooler in said radiator. This fits perfectly under the A/C condenser. I'm just worried about it only being a 2 pass. I have a big B&M plate cooler, but, no place to put it that has direct airflow. Any opinion is appreciated.
    Let me add this is a stock 350-700R4 combo. Only trans mod is a 'vette servo and a shift kit.
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2019
  2. sevenhills1952
    Joined: Mar 14, 2018
    Posts: 767

    sevenhills1952

    I was always curious why go through the radiator with trans fluid. We always used an external cooler bypassing the radiator.

    Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk
     
  3. olscrounger
    Joined: Feb 23, 2008
    Posts: 3,497

    olscrounger
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I run two of those on the framerails of 40's-none thru radiator Been on my 40 that way for 10yrs and many miles.
     
    lothiandon1940 likes this.
  4. mgtstumpy
    Joined: Jul 20, 2006
    Posts: 7,582

    mgtstumpy
    Member

    Rule of thumb operating range is from 185-250. Cruising at 60mph and the pan temp could be 180 and then you pull a slight grade the temp will go to 200+. Pull a long steep grade or tow and it could climb to 250. If temp climbs to 300 over a prolonged period serious damage could occur. Temp fluctuation is normal however prolonged high temps will definitely shorten the life expectancy of your trans.
    • Good fluid is pink,
    • Red is used; and
    • Brown means you've waited too long.
    For optimum performance change the fluid, purge the system and change the filter every 15k miles (24k klms). For longevity used a quality trans cooler.

    Based on advice, the consensus is to run transmission coolers in a series, from pressure outlet of transmission through radiator first and then through an auxiliary cooler before going back to transmission.

    Firstly, the reasons for this is that if the transmission fluid is hot, it will be cooled more quickly and efficiently by the radiator. Secondly, if it is cool it will be warmed up and yes they can run too cool. When they run cool condensation that may be in the system remains there, NOT GOOD. The transmission needs heat for self preservation but not too much.

    If the fluid is too hot after it leaves the radiator it will be cooled by the auxiliary cooler before going back to the transmission. Auxiliary coolers needs to be mounted where airflow isn't impeded as it needs to dissipate or radiate the heat, air flowing through and over does the job. If stuck for space a small slimline auxiliary coolers with a fan is the go.

    In colder areas and on short trips, the transmission may not get hot enough to reach optimum operating temperature. By being routed through radiator firstly it will be heated to a better temperature.

    Big manufacturers spend $M on R&D so why not take advantage of their expertise, it's free. I wouldn't recommend just running an auxiliary cooler, my opinion, but definitely use your radiator. Why, because the transmission generates the second greatest amount of heat beside the engine.

    I personally prefer to run fluid line through the radiator first and then back through auxiliary transmission cooler. I've seen small air deflectors used to push air over and/or coolers in some instances where space is an issue. Don't have it too low so that you run the risk off loosing it due to road clearance issues. Last thing you want to do is grenade your transmission due to heat buildup and heat will kill them eventually. I've never been a fan of just a stand alone transmission cooler in isolation.
    transmission-coolers-2.jpg
    transtemp.jpg
     
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  5. This is why I'm running it through the radiator. Every newer car I've ever had has been like this and I intend to drive this car in most conditions.
     
  6. Black_Sheep
    Joined: May 22, 2010
    Posts: 992

    Black_Sheep
    Member

    I have the same cooler mounted behind the grille on my truck. Power comes from a mild 454 with a TH400 that has a stock converter and a shift kit. The trans fluid has never shown an indication of excessive heat. I believe it will be fine for your application too.
     
  7. mgtstumpy
    Joined: Jul 20, 2006
    Posts: 7,582

    mgtstumpy
    Member

    Types of Transmission Coolers
    Designs will differ between manufacturers, but there are three main types. The different types of transmission coolers include the tube and fin, the plate and fin, and the stacked plate. Most automatic transmission coolers are made out of aluminum, which helps to dissipate heat more effectively, and each type has varying degrees of durability and effectiveness. There are also transmission coolers with built-in fans for even more cooling power.

    Tube and Fin Coolers – The tube and fin cooler can be distinguished by the tube that weaves throughout the transmission cooler and the turbulators that surround it. The tube is responsible for transferring the fluid around while the fins attached on the outside help to absorb the heat. Tube and fin coolers are often the least efficient type of cooler.
    [​IMG]
    Pros:
    • Inexpensive
    • Great for older cars
    Cons:
    • Least efficient type
    • Not suggested for overdrive transmissions


    Plate and Fin Coolers – The plate and fin cooler can be distinguished by the parallel plates that run horizontally, and looks just like a mini radiator. This type of transmission cooler is more efficient than the tube and fin type, mainly because the larger surface area allows for more fluid to contact the cooling surface. Fluid is forced through each row of smaller plates that help to cool the fluid faster and more effectively.

    [​IMG]

    Pros:
    • More efficient than tube and fin coolers
    • Smaller in size and more durable
    • Large amount of fluid is cooled faster at one time

    Cons:

    • Not as efficient as stack plate coolers
    • More expensive

    Stacked Plate Coolers – The stacked plate coolers are the most popular and efficient coolers. Stacked plates look like plate and fin coolers, but have larger turbulators that offer higher air flow. They work like plate and fin coolers by forcing fluid through the cooling plates to lower fluid temperature faster and better. Stacked plates are also popular because of ease of installation and removal.

    [​IMG]

    Pros:
    • Larger plates than plate and fin coolers
    • Most efficient type
    • Smaller in size and more durable
    • Large amount of fluid is cooled faster at one time
    Cons:
    • More expensive
    Transmission Cooler GVW Rating
    An automatic transmission cooler is rated by the gross vehicle weight, or GVW, and range anywhere from ratings of 10,000 pounds to 30,000 pounds and up. What goes into account when calculating the GVW of a vehicle is the base weight of the car, any accessories, the driver, any passengers, and cargo. Car manufacturers will include a GVW rating as a weight limit for your vehicle. To find the right transmission cooler with your car’s GVW rating, you can take this into account:

    [​IMG]
    upload_2019-8-29_11-45-32.png
    https://www.hotrod.com/articles/do-you-need-a-transmission-cooler/
     
  8. DOCTOR SATAN
    Joined: Mar 21, 2014
    Posts: 423

    DOCTOR SATAN
    Member
    from okc

    I would use a separate cooler and mount it anywhere but by the radiator....
     
  9. sevenhills1952
    Joined: Mar 14, 2018
    Posts: 767

    sevenhills1952

    It always seemed to me defeating the purpose running trans fluid through radiator. Why heat it to 180-200 only to try cooling it again.

    Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk
     
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  10. flatheadpete
    Joined: Oct 29, 2003
    Posts: 9,440

    flatheadpete
    Member
    from Burton, MI

    Cooler.jpg I use a power steering cooler from a later model GM mounted to the outside of the passenger side framerail on my '50 Ford. Simliar design and I've never had an issue.
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2019
  11. RmK57
    Joined: Dec 31, 2008
    Posts: 1,041

    RmK57
    Member

    I got my stack plate cooler from a 28 ft. or so Ford motor home. 460, c6 combo. Lots of those things laying around the country side. The only thing I dont like about it are the barb fittings, would much rather prefer AN style fitting.
     
  12. @RmK57 how big is this cooler??
     
  13. RmK57
    Joined: Dec 31, 2008
    Posts: 1,041

    RmK57
    Member

    12 x 11. Mounted in front of my radiator to a c6 trans.
     
    Hotrodmyk likes this.
  14. If you stop and think about it, it makes sense. The OEMs do it that way for two reasons; one, it will help heat the trans fluid when cold. ATF works best inside a temperature range; too hot it breaks down, but too cold it doesn't flow/lubricate as well. Second, because the radiator/cooling system is thermostatically controlled, this helps insure the ATF stays within range also. If the ATF gets too warm, it dumps that heat into the cooling system which then compensates by opening the thermostat more to bring the temp down. This thermostatic control feature is lacking in most aftermarket trans coolers.

    Must work pretty well, as Detroit has sold millions of cars/trucks equipped like that. Generally, only in heavy-duty or towing option applications do you see an additional trans cooler fitted from the factories.
     
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  15. southcross2631
    Joined: Jan 20, 2013
    Posts: 2,943

    southcross2631
    Member

    I used that same Speedway cooler mounted to the frame rail on one of my cars for 3 years with no issues.
     
  16. mgtstumpy
    Joined: Jul 20, 2006
    Posts: 7,582

    mgtstumpy
    Member

    Also the inline coolers mounted horizontal is what I have for my 46 Olds in conjunction with my Walker radiator. It'll get plenty of airflow to dissipate the heat. However if you go the other kind it must be mounted in front of radiator to take advantage of air flow. As my Olds is a big heavy car I'm going to the trouble of running an in-line transmission filter and thermostat as well. Some may say it's overkill, I say added insurance.
    tc.gif COOLER_MOUNTING.jpg coolu-02.jpg
     
  17. I think I'd put the cooler ahead of the radiator instead of after. That will reduce the load on the engine cooling system, and should do a better job of maintaining an even temp.
     
    Hnstray likes this.
  18. Hnstray
    Joined: Aug 23, 2009
    Posts: 10,695

    Hnstray
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Quincy, IL

    @Crazy Steve has it right on all points. Just straightforward information about the desirability of regulated temperature and how to get it.

    One additional suggestion. If you are concerned about trans temp (and it IS a valid consideration) why not install a trans fluid temp gauge? Then you will know exactly what’s going on instead of speculating. I think for the most part the factory engineers solution with engine radiator trans cooler ( and heater) are adequate for ‘normal use’. If a vehicle is performing in heavier duty applications the aux cooler may be necessary. Either way, a temp gauge is useful.

    Ray
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2019
  19. sevenhills1952
    Joined: Mar 14, 2018
    Posts: 767

    sevenhills1952

    We never ran it through radiator on the drag cars, but we never ran in cold weather.
    I just read this, agreeing with what you said, which I never knew...
    The ideal range for fluid temperature is between 175 and 225 degrees, and every 20 degree drop in fluid temperature can help to double the life of your transmission.

    Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk
     

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