Inspired by Ed Roth, Plowboy and Racerdad

So, over the last few years I've seen several Ed Roth creations found and restored via Rod & Custom magazine. I've also seen a couple of really neat examples of Roth inspired builds by Aaron Grote (plowboy). Both Lunar Lander and the Atomic punk were really cool! A bit out of my budget but great builds non the less!
In the last few months Racerdad has stepped up to the plate and he too is doing a really fun looking build, and it's even kinda closer to a budget build! Which is inspirational on a whole 'nother level!

I'd started a project a while ago, it was supposed to be an RPU, stretched doors, shortened bed, cycle fender type of ride. For running gear I'd purchased a '61 Olds Cutlass with the 215 and a manual 3spd. It was a kinda neat little car. Had a bit of rust, been high-sided into a ditch which twisted the front corner of the wimpy chassis a bit.
I got a tube chassis fabricated to reuse the engine/tranny combination for the RPU build, stretched the suspension and mounted the front axle suicide & stepped the frame at the firewall & just behind the cab. The rear axle is right behind the back panel of the cab and it had a 20" bed. (The front axle is from a '48 Ford sedan and the rear axle is from the Cutlass).

Then I got a wild hair and decided to rethink the whole RPU thing. I've decided that since I don't have a lot of time to do full builds that I should do something that showcases my skills as a metalshaper without starting from a blank sheet of paper. The RPU while still cool, still looks like a modified truck.

I've been looking at the remains of the Cutlass for the last few months and have come up with some rather unorthodox ideas. I'll reuse the already built chassis from the RPU project. I love the proportions and the stance. I like the narrowed back end/trunk concept. One thing I haven't liked about the other above mentioned designs is their slab-sided look. What I intend to do is narrow the trunk area up to the back panel of the cab. The cab will be original width just in front of the rear wheels and taper to the firewall which will be the same width as a '30's-'40's truck cab. The original Cutlass front sheetmetal will be reused just narrowed a bit to fit between the front wheels. The modified Lakes-style exhaust will exit the sheetmetal from the existing wheel opening. With the front axle ahead of the grille/radiator everything will fit.
This build may or maynot have operational doors. I think it's useability would be enhanced with operational doors but that adds to the complications of the build. I'd also like to see a much modified top on this thing. Either scratch built out of aluminum and removable, or a different version of the original lid.

I have a digital camera but have never posted pictures on the HAMB, so I'll have to study up for that. I'll try to get chassis pic's up this weekend. Maybe body pic's too, (it's just a pile of sheetmetal as I cut up the Cutlass long ago).

I'm just inviting you to enjoy another wonderfully weird Roth inspired 'Narrowed '60's Roadster' build. (It may turn out to be a coupe, just don't know at this point)!

Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

you tease...

I can't wait to see what you do!

 

cant wait till you figure out pic posting. this sounds great.

 

Man that sounds Tasty! Lets get some pics up.

 

This build sounds sooo cool. Please get some pics together so that we can see what'cha doin'..!

 

Yeah, I know ... no pic's sucks! I'll work on that. Not easy being a lo-tech guy in a hi-tech world! LOL
If you know which thread would be the easiest to learn picture posting from feel free to post a link for the techniquely challenged!

Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

I'm anxious for pics. Almost giddy, one could say.

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=65684

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=461772

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=454924

 

I'm all for new and different builds and this sounds like a good one. Can't wait....

 

Thank you for the above links for picture posting! I'll get this sorted out, maybe this afternoon!

I am looking forward to being able to post pictures, I'll be requesting some design idea(s)/feedback as this build progresses.

Initial input is needed on a windshield choice. Since I've already made some executive decisions for locations/dimension, what I need are suggestions for a compound glass that's about 44" wide. The outside of the posts included should be about 50". It also needs to be compound curved and readily available. Racerdad is using an MGB windshield/frame. It looks good and would be compatable with my design too. I have sent a couple of emails to a friend who has a couple of these as yard art but gotten no response as to size and wether or not any of his are available. So, I'm open to other options ...
Triumph TR3 is the right width 44" but is flat glass. VW is too narrow in the flat windshield era @40", I don't know if the width changed with the 'super beetle' or not? I'm also considering other narrow cockpit designs such as the Datsun 240-260Z, I believe the first ones had flat side windows? Not sure ... Anything that is readily available and the right width is a candidate. I may need some of the supporting sheetmetal, (firewall/cowl area) and maybe wing-window frames? I won't know that until a donor is acquired. Another thing to add to the requirements of a useable donor is the original car should have had flat sideglass. The F85/Cutlass did and I don't want to stray too far from what was available in '61. May have to fudge that just a bit.

Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

Have a look at Sunbeam Alpines from the '60s for a windshield option...

 

The problem with the Sunbeam is availability here in Idaho. I will add this car to my list but off hand I can't recall the last time I saw one of those up here. MGB's pretty common, as were the Triumph Spitfires. Even the Datsun 1600's could be a candidate if they were the right size. Jensen Healy also comes to mind as those used to show up now and then.
If I'd had this project in mind a year ago, I passed on a Spitfire for $200. That's about my threshold of pain for a donor.
While I'm looking for options, I'll start on the backend of the car. I have a pre-existing metalshaping project that I have to complete before any real serious progress happens on this new build. I will do some level of mockups so I can see how these changes look together.
I like to contemplate/speculate on a project for a while before I start getting real serious. I've been doing just that for about 6 months. I think I am about ready to do some cuttin'! I do plan what parts to use and find parts cars in advance. Without a firm decision on the windshield area I can only do so much.

Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

Sounds cool! Please keep us updated. I've thought about doing a similar build but after doing a narrowed back half on one I decided to wait on that until im feeling really ambitious

 

Figure out the picture thing! A mob is gathering.

 

I got the yard mowed tonight, so tomorrow I can work in the shop! I'll do my best to get a picture or two posted if I can figure out how. As I mentioned in an above post I do have some real work to do tomorrow, so I can't spend the whole day doing mockups and getting pictures! LOL

I will try to get the chassis rolled outside for a decent picture or two, the weather is supposed to be just right for doing that. I'd like to do a little cutting too. Maybe if I have time I'll start the narrowing process for the trunk area. I don't think it'll take all that long to do, I've already done a lot of preliminary structure removal, so there's not a lot left.

Gonna go get a good night's rest, see you tomorrow!

Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

It's 7:51am & 34 degrees! Good morning boys and girls! LOL

I'm up, the coffee is on, the dogs are fed, breakfast comes next then it's off to the shop! It's a beautiful blue-sky day in the land of Id (Idaho)!

I have worked crowded all winter with the chassis for this build in the shop. I'll run that outside first thing and get a few pictures. That'll get the ol' brain engaged, while I do some other metalshaping that has top priority.

In the meantime I'll be contemplating the pieces I want to cut and just where to cut them at. The deck lid is a no brainer, it has to fit the new hole I create after narrowing the quarters. The question is just how much of the quarters I want to keep? The ass-end of this project is very abbreviated, so not much overhang will be needed. When this was an RPU build, I'd intended to use a 20" bed. Now as a full-bodied Roadster/Coupe project, I'm thinking 30" would be a lot! 24-26" is probably more in line with my current thinking. Width-wise to run the trunk/quarters between the rear wheels is 46".
The back panel of the cockpit/original rear window opening, I'm still debating running that area full width, or narrowing it just a little. I liked the interior room width of this 'compact-car' and I intend to reuse as much of the original Cutlass as I can, that includes the seats. I'd like to not have to narrow them. The 'hump'/console/driveshaft tunnel could be narrowed a bit from the original. I've also considered tapering the body from front to back. This would require a pie-cut section being added to the sheetmetal and is really in keeping with my concept of how I want this car to look. We're not talking a HUGE pie-cut, but maybe 3" at the tailpan tapered to 0 at the forward edge of the doors. The front sheetmetal would just need to be mounted at a tapering angle to continue the illusion.
This wedge effect could allow the floor to be lifted at the back panel and taper to the pedal area. It would almost eliminate the driveshaft tunnel altogether? Dunno ... It's early and that might not be a good idea ... More coffee needed.

'Nough thinkin', I'm headin' out to the shop, we'll talk later ...

Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

I like the idea of a builder out building in his shop, but would you please, PLEASE post some pics? This thing sounds uber cool!

 

Ok, as promised I've battled my way through the maze of computor crap to bring you these first 3 pictures of the Chassis for this 1961 F-85 Cutlass build.

Yes, here it is. Not a bad start, still needs some tweeking and a bunch of finish work to be a working chassis. At this point it's a roller and that counts!



Furthermore, the pictures load from top to bottom?! What moron designed this crap?! Anyway a second picture of what started out as a chassis for an RPU project and now is turning into a platform for a narrowed fenderless roadster or coupe!



So, after raising my temperature a bit and wandering around in the oh so stupid world of differing computor softwares, we have a chassis picture!

 

Super Beetle roofs are the same width as earlier Beetles.

Safety Glass can be cut no problem,
find something with a nice shape, cut to fit.

 

This view of the front of the tube chassis is to show how much the front axle is moved forward. There is room behind the spring mount to fit the radiator and fan, without crowding. The '48 Ford axle has a decent drop of about 3 1/2". I really like the factory stepped arms. There is an extra lug to mount a front panhard bar off of the driver's side spring perch. Haven't made one up yet, but the option is there.



The reason for this view, I wanted you to realize how close the rear axle is to the backpanel! Yes this is part of the original unibody back section, grafted to a 2"x3"x.125" tube. A second set of tubes will make up a transmission support and X-brace.



A view from the back, shows the factory four-bar rearend kinda in place. It's not solidly bolted in at this point, just a looky-loo! If the rear axle is easily viewable, I'd like to replace the individual arms which are stamped sheetmetal. I'd like to use two sets of split 'bones. I think the tapered tubes would look so much better than the factory arms.

 

Have I mentioned I hate computors?! I can see the pictures on my screen, but my wife can't see them on hers?!
Can ANYBODY see them???

Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

yep, I see the pics..keep em coming

 

I hope you can see these pictures this time, I'd hate to have to use the baseball bat on the computor again!



Again for those who can't see the first batch, here ya go!





This is one of the three pictures that I posted earlier, that don't show up for some reason?!

 

Some more of the sheetmetal, it's really pretty straight! You can see the deck lid, hood and one door.



The original deck lid opening is about 47" wide. That's about as wide as the outsides of the quarter panels will be when I get done! I think the trunk lid will only be 3' wide after I narrow everything down.





One of the things I like about this era bodystyle is there is some curves there. It's not just a single curve! I am also a big fan of the fin era, but that will have to wait for a different build,

 

Roof is still usable too. Too bad I wasn't thinking about a project like this when I cut this car up. I've undoubtedly created additional work for myself.



The other front fender and the back seat pieces.



One of the front fenders, they both are pretty good. Both have a little rust at the bottom mounting area. Other than that they are both straight!

 

Start mocking it up, with the tail 'long". Easy to make shorter.

It will tell you what it wants.

 

I like where this is going.... subscribed

 

" I cut it off three times and it's still too short"! LOL

Yeah, I'm planning on starting long. I'll try to make my cuts strategically so that the rear wheel opening gets smaller as the back end gets shorter. I'm sure there will be a small patch to fill in the hole, but I'll try to use my head about sliding the back end forward.

BTW, this isn't my first rodeo. In the late 80's I used to work 'heavy hits' in a collision shop. Sectioning 'insurance totals' was some of the first professional bodywork I did, right out of autobody school.
I eventually gravitated toward Kustom/restoration work until I found aviation paid better and at the time was stable.
Now the aviation work is pretty much gone and so is construction work for a fabricator like me. At least here in this valley. My main focus is to develope a small line of reproduced panels for certain automotive targets. I'll be doing the manufacturing by metalshaping methods.

So bear with me as I bring you some progress shots of this 'side project'. Remember, I do have a main focus and it's not this! I wish it were, but builds like this cost, both in time and materials and I'm like most of you just trying to make a living in this economy.

Dan Stevens
dba, Steelsmith

 

Better to take your time and get it how you want than rush it out... looking forward to seeing more of this build.

 

I'm kind of wondering if the front spring has enough room to spring with the curved crossmember like that...