I still can't believe this S***! I applied to the state BMV for title nimbers for my newly built car (a fiberglass deuce roadster). I did the application just 1 month ago. I even had to have a cop come out to verify it didn't have numbers on it. Today I get a letter from the state BMV saying I must have reciepts for all the parts I used in the build. I did have a hand written list but that crap don't fly with them! So today I called the BMV and after a short wait I get a woman that tells me the only way I can get a title for my car is to sue the state of Indiana BMV!!!! I gotta go to small claimes court and convince a judge to make an order to the state BMV to assign me a VIN#!!!!. Thats 40.00 filing fee and wait all morning for him to get to me. Has any Indiana guys gone the lawsuit route with the state? I'd like to hear about it and how it came out.Normal Norman
Sounds like a good deal to me. File with the judge, pay filing fee, convince him you built it but the state won't do the deal without receipts. It's up to you now to make sure you take enough information/witnesses to convince him that you actually did build it and don't have the receipts. Set a precidence. Actually you are in a position to start your own part time consulting firm to help the hot rod community in Indiana out at the same time. Change your handle to INDIANA BOYD
Never had to sue here BUT......... OK also uses the receipts, etc for major components on 'home built'. They will accept the C.O. that come with "kits" but also want receipt for engine, trans, diff. I know this doesn't help now but to readers who are thinking of building from "scratch" check your state's rules before you start.
Get on your computer and a copy of quickbooks. Make your own receipts!!!! F the man and the system. Its all a game just play it better than anyone else.
How many credit card statements do you have covering stuff you bought? Where did you get the engine, etc? Maybe you can get enough evidence together to show somone you really did build it. I knoe it's a pain, but how'd you like someone to be able to easily retitle a stolen rod?
I actually don't understand why the engine, trans, etc matter so much as long as you have reciepts for the main chassis/body and any parts with serial numbers on them don't flag as stolen in their database. I guess they want reciepts so they can figure out how much to tax you for it?
I am in Indiana and have not heard of anything like this, but will be interested in hearing additional details. Have you seen the actual laws in question in print? Would be interesting to read what is actually stated for "kit cars", "replicars" and homebuilts. Good luck.
I second that. Get a couple friends to make out reciepts for the engine, rear end or what ever. If your good enough on photo shop you can make reciepts for other parts. They probaly will add up the cost and tax you. Thier money hungry!
I did find this via google... http://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/wiki/How_to_title_a_hot_rod It states the following for what it is worth, but the link to the form is invalid... Indiana No Title, Missing VIN Tag and Purchased Vehicle Out of State. Any documentation you can get of the vehicle is important, especially a Bill of Sale. You can use Indiana Bill of Sale State form 44237 @ www.in.gov/bmv/forms or make your own stating as much information as possible about the vehicle, purchase price and the seller information. Both seller and buyer sign and date the form. A police officer will have to inspect the vehicle. Provide him with all the documentation you have and indicate you have no VIN tag. He will fill out a Physical Inspection of an Indiana Resident's Vehicle Form stating no VIN tag or Plate number/State. If you have a VIN number they will verify through a IDACS/NCIC check to make sure the vehicle isn't stolen. Once completed you take this form and your Bill of Sale and any other information about the vehicle with you to your Indiana BMV and apply for a new VIN number which will be mailed to you. Once you receive the new VIN number, have a legible tag made by a local trophy shop with the new number and affix it to the vehicle in or about the original location of the VIN tag. Once completed a Police officer again will have to come out and verify all documentation, new tag location and charge $5.00 for the Physical Inspection form he signs stating everything is in order. The last step in this process is to return to the BMV will all your documentation and apply for Certificate of Title. At this point you will pay your sales tax from your Bill of Sale form and a fee for Title Application. Once completed your New Vehicle Title will be mailed in 4-6 weeks.
Colorado is the same, they want receipts to get a total value then you get to pay tax on it all over again.
i was told the same thing. a lawyer friend of mine said good luck finding a judge to hear your case and rule in your favor. the reason the state wants receipts is so they can tax you. kit cars are easier because A. they're either a rebody of an existing car, 2. or they come with a certificate of origin and numbers. half a dozen calls downstate will result in half a dozen different answers. the hoops will keep getting smaller and smaller and higher off the ground. then they start lighting them on fire. you should have done a little more research before starting your project. do you have family or a good friend in another state that is a little more relax in it's laws that you could sell your car to and then buy it back once they've titled it?
i tried this. it didn't work. they told me to take it to small claims court to try to compel a judge to order the bmv to issue me a title. plus, he has an assembled vehicle that was never issued numbers or title.
Sounds to me like somebody didn't bother to check the rules before they jumped off into a project. Nobody should get rolling into a "no paperwork project" without finding out what is necessary to get paperwork from the State they live in and follow those instructions to the letter. It only makes a good thing, the car project, into a bad thing, straightening out a problem that shouldn't have become a problem to begin with.
Like he said. Do you have any paperwork or receipts for the pieces? This is the wrong time to come up with all of the stuff, but you might be able to put it all together.
By any chance did you take pictures of the project as it progressed? Reason being is a photo documentry shows without a doubt that you put it together from assorted parts. Granted there are no reciepts - but - it does prove and reinforce that you built it. Next, get in touch with a company that sells bonds & inquire as to going for a bonded title. It might easier than dealing with the Marx Brothers at your DMV.
Thanks all for your thoughts/advice. Just a little more on the subject. I started this project six years ago as a part time deal. Just to show how much things change over time,it was gonna be a hi-tech ride. I ditched that idea after I fell in love with the traditional look. At the time I started titles were easily available and relitivly cheap too. This is the 5th deuce I've built either for a customer or to sell and never went this way to get a title before. I kinda hate to show up at the BMV with recipts now or a title from another state. This is a small town the cops are likly to remember they verified that there is no number on the car. So I feel like I started this process now im stuck with it,good old hind sight!!! Thanks again for the help! Normal Norman
If the DMV in any state just passed out titles to any that asked, there would be a tremendous laundry of stolen parts going through the system. I've been assembling, salvaging and rebuilding vehicles for 25 years and I have never known any DMV to issue a title without clear proof of ownership of the materials used coming in the form of sales receipts for parts all the way to bills of sale and titles for donor vehicles. Frankly, I wouldn't want it too easy. I have several folders in my records filled with any receipt over $5-$10 for each project. Honestly, it saved my ass in an insurance claim once. A drunk hit my parked truck in the middle of the night. His insurance company wanted to pay me for the book value of a few hundred bucks and total it. My folder of receipts and build pictures secured a settlement for repairs costing many thousands of dollars. Very quickly, at that!
lots of small towns in indianna hit the next town over until you find somebody that is only concerned with collecting fees for the transaction. i have my favorite title transfer place and its well worth the drive accross the county.
i had heard that. i tried 4 different locations. it resulted in 4 different calls downstate and 4 different answers. but i had heard locations that were more rural, less shithole like where i'm from, are more likely to have done this thing before, as in they're more likely to have folks come in with field cars or barn finds and less likely to have dealt with scammers trying to title something stolen. i guess there are places in indiana where people don't have to lock there doors.
A quick up date; I went to the county court clerks office today to file in small claims. The ladies there said"Don't bother,the judge doesn't like to order the BMV to do anything" They then sugested I get a lawyer to do it! My lawyer charges 100 bones just for a office visit ! I need a title,anyone got one? P.M. me if ya do. Normal Norman
Why don't you buy on of those historic reg. you see time to time and call it a day? Two model A's and two deuces later, haven't had any problem yet.
You seriously listened to their opinion on a case they have no information on and no expertise to advise a claimant in the first place? So far, it looks like you are getting just what you ask for. The court is most likely to rule with the evidence of ownership submitted. Either you are the rightful owner or you are not. If you have much at stake, why would you whine about the legal fees. That $100 would be the first truly qualified advice you'll receive. A few hundred on tires is maintenance. How do you NOT spend the money? Buying a black market title and renumbering your car is not just illegal, but would completely invalidate any claim to ownership you actually have if it were to come under scrutiny. Get professional and you will get professional results. Keep playing under the table and you are bound to lose.
My father taught me this lesson a long time ago; If it don't have a title it ain't worth it. Some guys get titles like it's nothing then other guys can't catch a break. Try the judge route. If you can convince him, which you probably can if he is a reasonable guy, you are pretty much in the clear.
when i lived in ind. they said i had to have receipts ,but i got a title for a 1968 chevy and turned it in as a parts car for mine.that way i didn't have to have a receipt for parts purchased.cause if you turn in receipts,they will tax you for the amount spent on car.
I lived in IN for 42 years and their title rules SUCK! I had a signed & notarized title for a 1934 Ford that was signed off many years and owners before with a VIN check and notarized bill of sale (with a different name I have to admit). Iwas told I would have to go and have every owner title, insure, and license it and transfer to the next guy, some were dead "you have to go through their estate" the DMV told me. A friend from MI said "bring me your title" he had a MI title in a week, I took it back to IN with his name on everything all signed and notarized, it took me over 6 months before I got my title in the mail. One more reason I moved from IN and never looked back. I did the "sue the DMV" thing for a 1953 Chev convert, cost me $100.00 20 years ago, it wokred quite well. I used a lawyer and it was relitively smooth. Good luck! the coupeman.
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