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How do you know when your bodywork is good enough for gloss black.

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Nocero, May 17, 2013.

  1. Nocero
    Joined: May 16, 2002
    Posts: 477

    Nocero
    Member

    I have a pretty good feel for getting things straight, but I'm still a beginner.
    I'll run through the steps and tell you where I'm at now.

    I got the body down to bare metal. Epoxy primed, did my filler work over the epoxy, several coats of black feather fill g2, and blocked it with 220 using a grey guide coat.

    Being a rookie well kinda, been 20 years since I did any bodywork and then it was just repairs and hanging tin. Anyway being I wasn't super confident I had planned a satin finish.
    After putting a light at one end of the body and wiping it down with wax and grease remover it looks pretty good shiny! I'm considering gloss black instead of satin or flat.

    My plan for the next step is a couple coats of sealer, block with 400 then spray color.

    So am I on the right track? And is the wax & grease remover trick a accurate way to gauge how the finish will come out?
     
  2. Nocero
    Joined: May 16, 2002
    Posts: 477

    Nocero
    Member

    ImageUploadedByTJJ1368798747.525236.jpg
    Here's the only pic I have right at the moment.


    Posted from the TJJ App for iPhone & iPad
     
  3. Mr48chev
    Joined: Dec 28, 2007
    Posts: 25,525

    Mr48chev
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Well you could invite the most critical nit picking car guy you know over to have a look at it. Actually another pair or two of eyes looking at it isn't a bad idea as they may spot something that you have missed.

    Back when I worked in a shop (not body) I could spot a lot of flaws on cars that weren't ordinarily noticeable when I had cars up on the lift and could see the body panels from a low angle. That might help some.

    Shiny rules as far as I'm concerned but I've lived the past 25 years with tinted primer too.
     
  4. chaddilac
    Joined: Mar 21, 2006
    Posts: 13,815

    chaddilac
    Member

    My buddy Harold will shoot a panel gloss black with some cheap paint to see where it's high or low!
     
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  5. jesse1980
    Joined: Aug 25, 2010
    Posts: 1,356

    jesse1980
    Member

    If your a beginner and you have to ask it probly isn't good enough. Gloss black shows everything. Not putting you down just giving my opinion. I would have a professional go over it one time before spraying it black.
     
  6. Nocero
    Joined: May 16, 2002
    Posts: 477

    Nocero
    Member

    I've been trying to get a couple pros over but they are real busy and it's not high on their priority list. I am that nit picky perfectionist guy. I have a to. Of hours blocking. I went so far as to lay on my back with a halogen light and look up.
    I have been going around and around the car with little pieces of masking tape marking every little spot. All the tape is gone now and i know I'm pretty close but just not sure.
    Spraying a panel may be the best option if I can't get someone over here.
    Any other tricks?
     
  7. Get a gallon of wax and grease remover, poke a hole in the top with a nail.
    Clean the panels, blow, tack and pour the w&g remover on, stand back and look at the reflections. Should get a pretty good idea how it looks doing this.
    Do parts of the car, not the whole thing at once
     
  8. low-n-slo54
    Joined: Jul 25, 2009
    Posts: 1,921

    low-n-slo54
    Member

    Spray a couple more guide coats one panel at a time. Sand lightly with a block. Where it leaves black paint is where you'll need to bring it up. Do this until all the guide coat is gone. Wet it down to see it shiny. Pray for the best! Good luck.
     
  9. dadseh
    Joined: May 13, 2001
    Posts: 527

    dadseh
    Member

    you only blocked it down once????
     
  10. Nocero
    Joined: May 16, 2002
    Posts: 477

    Nocero
    Member

    No. Sorry i guess i should have been more specific.
    I've been blocking for a month and a half. I have put several coats of high build then blocked and repeated I don't even know how many times.
    If the wax remover trick is a good indicator I'm pretty darn close.
     
  11. The37Kid
    Joined: Apr 30, 2004
    Posts: 25,895

    The37Kid
    Member

    Grease and wax wet down works well, have a pencil handy to circle areas that need correction. Was tour last block sanding done dry or wet? Bob
     
  12. Wax & grease remover and sighting is your best bet. I would definitely get another set of eyes on it. Doesn't have to be a pro, just someone that understands what you're looking for.
     
  13. SixtyFord
    Joined: Jul 4, 2009
    Posts: 42

    SixtyFord
    Member

    Do one panel at a time and when you sand it with the 400 do it wet and the water will sort of stick to the primer and let you look at a "glossy" surface. Useing a long block (10" plus) and light pressure will help even out some of the "waves" that are hard to spot.
    Another thing to try is to run your hands over the whole car, your fingers will pick up imperfections that your eyes will miss. Just take your watch and rings off first.
    Good Luck! I always like when someone pushes their skill envelope!
     
  14. Tnomoldw
    Joined: Dec 5, 2012
    Posts: 1,563

    Tnomoldw
    Member

    :)subscribed , Good Luck:cool::D
     
  15. Nocero
    Joined: May 16, 2002
    Posts: 477

    Nocero
    Member

    The very last blocking I did was wet with 220 with a 10in narrow block about the width of a paint stick.


    I have a tendancy to go overboard and be too much of a perfectionist I've probably actually sent a lot more primer to the dust pan than need be. I don't expect an absolute perfect show car job after all it is going to be a driver, but I don't want to embarrass myself either. Just a respectable job.
     
  16. R Frederick
    Joined: Mar 30, 2009
    Posts: 2,660

    R Frederick
    Member
    from illinois

    I do this, Don't panic, the paint makes for a good sealer and base where you don't cut it off anyway. I'm doing a car black and plan on shooting it twice before final spray process.
     
  17. 63 Avanti 3137
    Joined: Dec 23, 2010
    Posts: 160

    63 Avanti 3137
    Member

    Blocked with 220.... your about half way there. Your not even standing at the rail let alone overboard.
     
  18. Nocero
    Joined: May 16, 2002
    Posts: 477

    Nocero
    Member

    I understand that there's a lot more sanding to do. I am pretty much there as far as hi build is concerned I guess would be a better way to put it. Take a look at my other post and see if my plan is sufficient and let me know if I'm skipping steps, or if you have any recommendations.

    This car was such junk when I got it I can't even believe gloss is a possibility at this point.
    Here's a link to my build thread which I am long overdue for an update.
    I'm not very good at keeping up on it.
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=321085&showall=1
     
  19. falcongeorge
    Joined: Aug 26, 2010
    Posts: 18,341

    falcongeorge
    Member
    from BC

    When I opened the thread, this was my first thought...

    But having read this, I bet you are pretty close. Get a second pair of eyes to keep you honest, and try the wax and grease remover, see where your at.
     
  20. The37Kid
    Joined: Apr 30, 2004
    Posts: 25,895

    The37Kid
    Member

    You've gone this far, NEVER even think "It's good enough, nobody will see it." Its your car, make it perfect. Bob :)



    I don't expect an absolute perfect show car job after all it is going to be a driver, but I don't want to embarrass myself either. Just a respectable job.
     
  21. TR Waters
    Joined: Nov 18, 2006
    Posts: 1,439

    TR Waters
    Member
    from Vermont
    1. Early Hemi Tech

    I have a friend who has won best in class at Hershey, and I asked him how he got his cars straight.
    He told me that when he thought he was close, he would set up a length of wire the length of the car. Not on the car, but a few inches away, drawing the wire tight.

    A few feet back from the wire, he would set up fluorescent lamps, and look for the shadow of the wire down the side of the vehicle. Since the wire was straight and tight, and waves in the shadow indicated more bodywork needed.
     
  22. SixtyFord
    Joined: Jul 4, 2009
    Posts: 42

    SixtyFord
    Member

    Wow that is a great idea! I'm going to have to try that.
     
  23. Nocero
    Joined: May 16, 2002
    Posts: 477

    Nocero
    Member

    Now that is exactly the kind of advice I can use!!! And why I love this place. Thanks!
     
  24. redhumphries
    Joined: Nov 21, 2006
    Posts: 424

    redhumphries
    Member

    years ago and I mean many years ago we would buff the primer and stand back for a look. I dont know if it will work on todays primers Ive been doing it so long I know when its straight. good luck at least you dont have any panels that are 4 foot long. RED
     
  25. 49ratfink
    Joined: Feb 8, 2004
    Posts: 17,321

    49ratfink
    Member
    from California

    sounds to me like you are using too small of a sanding block to get a car ready for black.
     
  26. Nocero
    Joined: May 16, 2002
    Posts: 477

    Nocero
    Member

    Well with small panels compound curves and body lines it's tough to use a bigger block in most areas.
    Ill up load some pics and see if they turn out good enough.
     
  27. HighSpeed LowDrag
    Joined: Mar 2, 2005
    Posts: 968

    HighSpeed LowDrag
    Member
    from Houston

    If you're at 220 grit and somewhat confident, here's what I would do and I do it for a living. Check all of your edges, door jambs, etc. Make sure that they are where you want them to be. Then spray three good coats of primer and let it sit for a week. Then use dry guide coat, not a spray can, and start blocking each panel, one at a time. Start with 220, guide coat again and sand with 320, guide coat again and sand with 400 dry. When you have the whole car done to this step and you are happy, then get out the 400 wet. Use a spray bottle to wet the panel, not a bucket of water. Then wash the whole car with soapy water and sand with 600 wet, also using a spray bottle. Wash the whole car again and blow dry. Then use wax and greasse remover to look for highs and lows. If you see highs/lows at that point resort to using 180 to actualy cut the area back to flat. You can't block a panel flat with 220. It will ride the wave and create more problems. 220 and above grits just get the scratches out from the previous steps. They don't actually flatten or straighten a panel.

    FWIW.


    Mark
     
  28. Nocero
    Joined: May 16, 2002
    Posts: 477

    Nocero
    Member

    ImageUploadedByTJJ1368819047.564534.jpg ImageUploadedByTJJ1368819092.000841.jpg ImageUploadedByTJJ1368819124.283647.jpg ImageUploadedByTJJ1368819161.713636.jpg
    These are with a quick wipe down with prep all. They look super straight this way to me.



    Posted from the TJJ App for iPhone & iPad
     
  29. Nocero
    Joined: May 16, 2002
    Posts: 477

    Nocero
    Member

    Thanks that's more great advice!


    Posted from the TJJ App for iPhone & iPad
     
  30. 35desoto
    Joined: Oct 6, 2009
    Posts: 760

    35desoto
    Member

    From those pics and this side of the world that looks great however there's only one way you will get satisfaction - and that's when the final coats go on and you are happy with what you see.
     

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