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HEMI Tech: Water pump. Change? Rebuild? Run it?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by scootermcrad, Jun 21, 2006.

  1. This guy rebuilds water and fuel pumps, and is HIGHLY recommended by a great number of early Mopar guys...

    Arthur Gould Rebuilders
    5R Main Street
    Kings Park, NY 11754
    631-269-0093
     
  2. To answer the original question...I'm going with a Hot Heads timing cover/SBC pump on my DeSoto simply because I want to use a mechanical (NOT electric!) fan. It's going into my 32 Roadster and I didn't want to hack the firewall to get enough room to do it. The aluminum chain case cover/SBC pump saves me 4+ inches at the front of the engine. That, together with the fact that it's going to have a 6-71 on it...and keeps me from having to move the blower forward. And last, it saves about 750 pounds on my engine...along with the 500 pounds I saved with the aluminum intake :D. I didn't do it because SBC pumps are easy to come by, or because it's a better pump, etc, etc, I did it because it was expediant and seemed like a good idea. It will, however, be painted Mopar engine Aluminum...;)
     
  3. mrstude
    Joined: Jul 31, 2010
    Posts: 14

    mrstude
    Member
    from florida US

    I like the idea of the B-Rb pump housing. What are the limitaions ??
     
  4. 73RR
    Joined: Jan 29, 2007
    Posts: 6,228

    73RR
    Member

    On the blown 392 pictured we had to make a very short hose connection for the top of the t-stat in order to fit under the blower (we also raised the t-stat a wee bit) and depending on your intake and fab skills you still need to connect the heads to the pump (blue hose in the pic). We prefer to keep the t-stat above the rest of the cooling system.

    .
     
  5. jeepman
    Joined: Sep 6, 2009
    Posts: 50

    jeepman
    Member
    from az

    there is someone in az that rebuilds oddball waterpumps. if all else fails give him a call. 623-205-4482
     
  6. Cross Rodder
    Joined: Apr 14, 2008
    Posts: 321

    Cross Rodder
    Member

    All Star in Baldwin Park CA rebuilds the early Hemi water pumps pretty cheap. (626) 960-5164

    My 53 331 kept loosing the front seal after 8-20 hrs of run time (corrosion in the housing casting). For a few more $ they re-machine the housing and shaft and install a more reliable and readily available seal system. They let me look at it before it was assembled; pretty nice!
     
  7. Here's an old post i posted how I found out that a 360 Mopar water pump could work. Still havent fired it off but getting close!!


    Well I went into the shop and spent 20 minutes modifying the water pump from a 1968 383 Dodge Coronet that I bought off the shelf of the local parts store. It looked fairly close to the stock Desoto 276-291. I measured the pump at the store and decided that $28 was a risk I am willing to lose if it doesn't work. So I bought it and started modifying it by first removing the indexing ring. As far as I can tell, the lip is only there to center the pump as alot of water pumps are flat with no ring and never leak. So off it comes.
    [​IMG]

    I wrapped some paper towels around the shaft so that it would keep the grinding dust from getting to the seal and bearings. After I cut the ring off, the impellers were rubbing the backside of the water pump /timing chain housing so I took a socket and gave the impeller bushing a couple love taps to bring it closer into the water pump itself.
    Hold on for more pictures
    [​IMG]
    I had to elongate the stock 383 holes about 1/8" inward toward the center of the pump to align with the stock 1952 desoto housing. So far everything is working great.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    Here's the old gasket from the 52 desoto kit that I had. The full gasket set I bought also had a thicker wider one that I will use. Looks like lots of coverage!! Whoo Hooo!!!! Now do the holes line up and does the impeller spin?
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    Whoo Hooo again. It all works!!!! My $28 1952 Desoto water pump that you can buy off the shelf. Another idea that worked!!!
    If I didn't have the housing on, I think I would have just ground the opening on the stock timing cover a bit bigger but this only took all of about 20 minutes.
     
  8. Cross Rodder
    Joined: Apr 14, 2008
    Posts: 321

    Cross Rodder
    Member

    Nice work; does the snout length allow the use of the stock pulleys?
     
  9. Correct. The pulleys line up perfectly.
     
  10. Demon Seed
    Joined: Feb 2, 2009
    Posts: 106

    Demon Seed
    Member
    from BF-AZ

    Nothing against using a stock pump but I like the Chevy conversion simply because I don't want to be stuck someplace waiting for UPS to deliver a rebuilt stock pump when I could just walk into any auto parts store and pickup a Chevy pump and be on my way. I used a Hotheads front cover and SBC pump on the '54 331 I put in my AD pickup.

    [​IMG]

    And I modified the front cover and used a BBC pump conversion on the '55 331 that's in my Deuce.

    [​IMG]
     
  11. threewindaguy
    Joined: Jun 9, 2007
    Posts: 257

    threewindaguy
    Member

  12. Everyone talks about not wanting to get stranded and have to wait for a rebuilt pump to arriveif you run the stock water pump. Thats just rediculous as you don't worry about an engine, transmission, or any other big or small parts that you can't get. If I had a stock water pump fail, I'd get some radiator stop leak and try that to get me home or just call AAA for a tow. Typically a waterpump doesn't just go, it gives you plenty of warning.
     
  13. Abomination
    Joined: Oct 5, 2006
    Posts: 6,692

    Abomination
    Member

    Tell me about that intake - I want one!

    What brand/model is it?

    ~Jason

     
  14. 73RR
    Joined: Jan 29, 2007
    Posts: 6,228

    73RR
    Member


    X2

    We have rebuilt hundreds of water pumps over the last 30 years and none have ever come back.

    ...and from some things I have read about the new crop of Chinese/shiverlay pumps you may need to keep a look out for the closest parts house...

    .
     
  15. George
    Joined: Jan 1, 2005
    Posts: 7,049

    George
    Member

    The long BBChevy W/P would have cleared the '55 cover W/O mods.
     
  16. 392
    Joined: Feb 27, 2007
    Posts: 933

    392
    Member

    rebuild and use
     
  17. junkyardgenius
    Joined: Dec 29, 2005
    Posts: 734

    junkyardgenius
    Member
    from Kernow

    What year BBC pump is used when using the Hot Heads adapters? 396, 427 & 454 pumps are they all the same?
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2011
  18. George
    Joined: Jan 1, 2005
    Posts: 7,049

    George
    Member

    Basicly there's long & short. The long one will clear 55-58 Chr timing covers. Have to use the HH cover & electric F/P with the short pump.
     
  19. junkyardgenius
    Joined: Dec 29, 2005
    Posts: 734

    junkyardgenius
    Member
    from Kernow

    Thanks George, I,ve got a 354 here and some HotHeads adaptors, when I tried to get a pump today they wanted to know what size big block and what year I needed, just wondered if all the short big block pumps are the same, or what years will fit.
     
  20. George
    Joined: Jan 1, 2005
    Posts: 7,049

    George
    Member

    I suspect people dependant of year & mjodel to put in thier computer. Might be a diffrence in A/C & non A/C output, but all should be simular on the outside.
     
  21. BashingTin
    Joined: Feb 15, 2010
    Posts: 270

    BashingTin
    Member

    Hi JunkYardGenius,

    Not sure if this will help, but I found my short style Big Block Chevy water pump on Ebay. Saved me the expense of coming up with a core charge at the local parts store. Here is an Ebay link with "BBC short water pump" in the search string:

    http://shop.ebay.com/?_from=R40&_tr...BC+short+water+pump&_sacat=See-All-Categories

    Most of them are aluminum which is nice. Lots to chose from.

    Take care,

    David
     
  22. junkyardgenius
    Joined: Dec 29, 2005
    Posts: 734

    junkyardgenius
    Member
    from Kernow

    Thanks guys I,ll sort it out tomorrow.
     
  23. Jeff Smith 700
    Joined: Dec 28, 2010
    Posts: 13

    Jeff Smith 700
    Member

    I am considering modifying my desoto timing cover for the big block Mopar pump. How well did it cool after you put the big block pump pump on?

    Jeff
     
  24. chip77
    Joined: Oct 5, 2010
    Posts: 23

    chip77
    Member
    from monroe, MI

    Hopefully this will help this thread out. I did a search for replacement water pumps for my 315 Dodge Hemi and found them available at Auto Zone and Advanced Auto Parts. Which leads me to believe that places like NAPA and the other bigger/better stores would have them also. FYI the part numbers are M58-468 & 58-468 respectively for the Dodge. Thanks to all who have help with the hemi tech section here....awesome info!
     
  25. 73RR
    Joined: Jan 29, 2007
    Posts: 6,228

    73RR
    Member


    Better check that again. According to the Autozone 'does it fit' gizmo the M58-468 is for a 241-270 and the picture is 241-270, not 315-325.
    I am amazed that they even show one, whether they have one or not is another question. For $50 buy all that you can afford to sit on...

    .
     
  26. chip77
    Joined: Oct 5, 2010
    Posts: 23

    chip77
    Member
    from monroe, MI

    thanks for the heads up......I'll be sure to take the old one with me when I go to purchase.....if it is right I'm getting a couple.
     
  27. with all the talk on pumps, not much on pulleys. When using a long BBC pump on a '55 so I can have the stock fuel pump, will teh stick pulleys line up or what are you guys using?

    Thanks, Hans
     
  28. scootermcrad
    Joined: Sep 20, 2005
    Posts: 12,301

    scootermcrad
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

  29. 29pu
    Joined: Oct 31, 2008
    Posts: 159

    29pu
    Member

    i`m new to hemi`s and have a question.will a 392 cross over pipe fit on a 354 and if their different how can i tell them apart?
     
  30. George
    Joined: Jan 1, 2005
    Posts: 7,049

    George
    Member

    Bolts right on! Just have to use the 392 or BBchevy W/P with it.
     

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