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Help Ford 302 & Harmonic Balacers????

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by gaskell, Apr 8, 2010.

  1. gaskell
    Joined: Sep 6, 2007
    Posts: 150

    gaskell
    Member
    from AZ

    So,

    Im generally a MOPAR guy... So Ford is like a different language to me. I will apologize in advance to the all knowing Ford crowd if I am asking a "DUH" question.

    As long as I match the balancer and the flex plate I should be able to use either a 28 or 50 ounce balancer, correct?

    Here is the back story - I have a 63 Mercury Comet. The 260 and ford-o-matic in it was weak and leaking.

    I have decided to do the 302 crate and C4 transmission swap out.
    I am trying to save some $$ and want to re-use as much stuff from the 260 as possible. I have been told I have to be careful what Balancer I use. The one that came from the 260 is a 3 bolt and 28 ounce.

    My hope is that I can re-use the 3-bold 28oz Balancer and just buy a new c4 appropriate flex plate balanced for the 28oz balancer.

    Thanks in advance.
    -LarryG
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2010
  2. Gotgas
    Joined: Jul 22, 2004
    Posts: 6,735

    Gotgas
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from DFW USA

    All pre-1981 parts are 28oz, so as long as you stick with old parts, you'll be fine.

    You asked, "As long as I match the balancer and the flex plate I should be able to use either a 28 or 50 ounce balancer, correct?" This is not correct. You have to have a 28oz balancer, flex plate, AND crankshaft - or a 50oz balancer, flexplate, and crankshaft. As long as your 260/289/302 crankshaft was made before 1981, you don't have to worry about dealing with 50oz parts.

    You are exactly right about needing to get a 28oz flexplate, but be sure you are getting the right size. There is a 157-tooth and a 164-tooth version, and you have to match them to the C4 bellhousing you already have. If you tell us what kind of car the C4 is coming out of, we can tell you what bellhousing it is and you'll need to get a flywheel to match.

    Starters are the same for either 157 or 164 tooth.

    3-bolt versus 4-bolt balancer is no big deal. Just be sure your crank pulley matches your balancer.

    Hope some of this helps-
     
  3. gaskell
    Joined: Sep 6, 2007
    Posts: 150

    gaskell
    Member
    from AZ

    Ok... so more back story.. The 302 is a FOMOCO rebuilt crate. Direct from the ford dealer. I called the "Help line" and they could tell me nothing about the engine, what it came from or what spec it was built to. Is there a way tell the weight of the crank?
    TIA
     
  4. HOT40ROD
    Joined: Jun 16, 2006
    Posts: 962

    HOT40ROD
    Member
    from Easton, Pa

    If the 302 is 1980 and older you will have to use the 28 oz. damper and flex plate. 1980 mid year and newer you will have to use the 50 oz. stuff.

    No you can not interchange them. The cranks are balance along with the damper and flex plate,

    2M, 2ME and 2MAD are 28 oz balance cranks
    2MAE is a 50 oz balance crank
     
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  5. gaskell
    Joined: Sep 6, 2007
    Posts: 150

    gaskell
    Member
    from AZ

    OK,,, back in from the garage.. The crank is stamped like: (2M and an A under it)
    2M
    A

    Looking for a web page to help me determine if 28oz or 50oz.
     
  6. gaskell
    Joined: Sep 6, 2007
    Posts: 150

    gaskell
    Member
    from AZ

    OK found this.... Thanks to all for the help!


    Crank I.D. Nos. (302) should reflect these Casting I.D. Nos.-

    2M-2MA-2MAD 28 OZ. 68/80

    2MAE 50 OZ. 81/

    I came across this info on GOOGLE and do not know that it is 100% correct, but it makes sense. There is also a production date break in the 1981 302 model run showing going to the heavier crank (MPC).

    Not Documented- Take With A Grain of Salt
     
  7. Badmoonreizen
    Joined: Feb 28, 2011
    Posts: 82

    Badmoonreizen
    Member
    from Howell, MI

    Found this thread while trying to solve a similar problem. I have a Ford 302 which I have identified as coming out of a 1971 Torino. I am going to mate up a C6 transmission which dates from 1973-79. When I called B&M racing to figure out which flexplate I need, the tech support guy told me to see if the balancer is weighted. I don't see any weight attached, but there are machined areas on it.
    If the posts are correct, this must be the 28 oz balancer, and I need the weighted flexplate to match. What torque converter and starter?

    Am I correct in my analysis?

    Thanks, Mark.
     
  8. craftscustoms
    Joined: Mar 16, 2005
    Posts: 219

    craftscustoms
    Member

    Make sure your C-6 has the smallblock housing. I think it will need the 164 tooth flexplate. I think the torque converters have two different bolt patterns. Measure your bolt pattern to be sure. I ordered my starter to fit my combo, probably a starter from a van with an automatic trans.
     
  9. Badmoonreizen
    Joined: Feb 28, 2011
    Posts: 82

    Badmoonreizen
    Member
    from Howell, MI

    Thanks for the response. I have determined that the transmission is a C6 from a 1979 E250. So, it appears that I will need a starter and flexplatefor a 1971 302 Torino, and a torque converter for a 1979 E250. Am I correct?
     
  10. Yes on the flexplate, and maybe on the converter...

    Ford used different stall speed converters depending on application, whether that one is right will need some further research. Shouldn't be a big deal, as long as the input shaft is the same. This might be a case where the aftermarket will be more helpful than just an auto parts store...
     
  11. craftscustoms
    Joined: Mar 16, 2005
    Posts: 219

    craftscustoms
    Member

    I think you will need flex plate, T.C. and starter for 79 van if they show a 302 or 351w with C-6 combo as factory installed.
     
  12. Badmoonreizen
    Joined: Feb 28, 2011
    Posts: 82

    Badmoonreizen
    Member
    from Howell, MI

    The confusion expands exponentially. The flexplate has to match up with the engine and harmonic balancer, if I understand the literature correctly. The starter has to match the engine and flexplate. The torque converter has to match the transmission?
     
  13. 1971-91 Ford C6 Converters for 289, 302, 351 M, C, or W), 400, 429, 460 are all the same and have a 1.375" Crank pilot size. SOME 429-460 from 89-91 have either a 1.250" or a 1.850" (same as FE)
    MOST C6 with the small block bolt pattern used the 164 tooth flexplate but I have seen a 157tooth (Rare).
    So for simplicity sake, you most likely need a 164tooth flexplate in 28oz, and any C6 torque converter with the 1.375" pilot.
     
  14. Badmoonreizen
    Joined: Feb 28, 2011
    Posts: 82

    Badmoonreizen
    Member
    from Howell, MI

    That sounds like a plan to me. Thanks to all who responded.

    Regards, Mark.
     

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