Well I havent posted in a while, I've been busy with work and school and responsibility. My car is running and the engine is all dialed in. I love starting it and listening to the pipes roar . But I'm yet to drive it!!! My problem is my brake lines. I've been trying to do them myself, but for some reason the fittings leak when I push down on the brake pedal. I've done them over a total of 3 times and still they leak! The fittings are all tightened well. I think it's my double flares. I do them exactly as I was taught, but it won't work! Do you guys have any suggestions? Maybe I'm missing a step in the process? Is it my Harbor Frieght flaring tool? Should I just pay a pro to do it? Wanna make some brake lines for a frustrated mexican kid? This is overly frustrating. I know if I had more skill the damn car would have been on the road months ago! I feel like such a NOOBIE cuz I can't make it work myself. But I'm learning as I go, so it's a SLOW process. Well thanks for the help guys. I really just want to drive the thing.
Well, if your Cheapo Flaring Tool(TM) is the same as my Cheapo Flaring Tool(TM), then you will never get a flare that is good enough to seal. I finally gave up and went to Kragen and bought an assortment of different length lines that already had flares and fittings on 'em. Bent them up to fit and it worked perfect.
hey poorboy, its probably your cheapo flaring tool. i bought a craftsman one from sears and it was like 19 bucks i think. we completely relined my buddys truck with it and none of the connections leak. where are you in san diego? i am in lemon grove and if you need any help just ask. i am always down to help out. diego
I have never had any problem finding ready made lines to suit. I have also never had a satisfactory experience with flaring. You can buy the ready mades in close increments cheap--if you need to lose a few inches, put in a shallow "S" wherever convenient and you're done. NAPA has adapters for any odd problems like big master cylinder fittings. Easy, safe, cheap, works--what the hell else do you want??
i have to go with what cleatus said.unless you're working in a shop there's no way to justify buying a flare tool that really works,it'll cost way more than just buying the lines.sometimes you can buy a kit for your car with all the lines pre-bent,but that's usually only for stock apps. with single M/C-george
Pretty much what cleatus said. Also make sure that you have cleaned out the inside of the tubes after cutting them. At the shop, we have a couple of cheap ones and one good one. We don't even bother trying to use the cheap ones. If you can't afford a good one, find a friend that will lend you theirs. A new tool (about $50-60) would be much cheaper than having someone bend and flare it for you. Plus you'll have it for next time and you can make money for the next person in your shoes.
I would try to find lines that are already made. if you are hellbent on making your own, start with a better tool. Look at the lines youve made, you should be able to see the problem. Either the flare isnt straight, you can crack the line if you crank on it too hard, and youll deform the flare if you tighten it too much. I assume when you tighten the fitting that the line inside is seating on the other end and tightening against it. I've had lines with long fittings that wouldnt allow the line to seat. Just a few things to look at. Good luck.
A good tool is where its at. Although I use a Mr Cheapo myself. Once in awhile you get a good cheapy I guess. When you set up to you take a countersink and debur the inside of the line. Just askin.
Cut it with a tube cutter and clean up the cut area. Set it TIGHTLY into the flaring clamp so that the tube protrudes to the height of the first edge of the upside down double flare adapter. Fit double flare adapter into the tube and use the flaring tool to crush the tube till the double flare adapter bottoms on the clamp assembly. Remove the double flare adapter and then carefully center the flaring tool onto the tube and complete the flare by bottoming the flaring tool firmly into the tubing. Not TOO hard...be careful! Ahhhh...SUCCESS at last!!! Now cut off the perfect double flare you just made and try it again with the fitting installed you dumb ass! Anyone ever make that mistake? Bill
[ QUOTE ] Cut it with a tube cutter and clean up the cut area. Set it TIGHTLY into the flaring clamp so that the tube protrudes to the height of the first edge of the upside down double flare adapter. Fit double flare adapter into the tube and use the flaring tool to crush the tube till the double flare adapter bottoms on the clamp assembly. Remove the double flare adapter and then carefully center the flaring tool onto the tube and complete the flare by bottoming the flaring tool firmly into the tubing. Not TOO hard...be careful! Ahhhh...SUCCESS at last!!! Now cut off the perfect double flare you just made and try it again with the fitting installed you dumb ass! Anyone ever make that mistake? Bill [/ QUOTE ] Not since last May. How 'bout bending the line with the fitting on the wrong side of the bend.
Oh yeah...That little finger that sticks out past the wing nut on your cheapie kit(?)...it goes in the vise so you don't have to hold the damn thing while you set it up and use it. If its a real cheapie, you might like to nip most of the tool in the vise because it will help keep the tubing from slipping down in the hole as you form the flare. (The cheap clamps are soft and easy to deflect) Only real problem with that, is that you will need to take it from the vise to release the finished double flare, and reinstall it to make the next one...but it does work better. I always flare my own lines because it looks neater to have the lines exact length. Purchased sections will work just as well if your careful to pick a close length but you MIGHT need some FLARE JOINERS (NOT Compression fittings!) to get real long distances, like from front to back. I've NEVER done anything like that P&B! NEVER! Haha Bill
I usualy do all of the above. I found the key to good flares (besides QUALITY tools) is to clean the inside of the tube of all burs (usually the cutter has a triangle piece thats used to do this) Then I use a file and bevel the edge of the tube at a 45 or so....then do as instructed above! And when possible...use pre flared pieces!
I feel much better about myself after reading the last few post. I know now that I am not alone and that others have made some of my misstakes.
Bevel the edge....Hmmmm...never tried that! I'll give that a try myself on the next few I do! Thanks Brewsir. I guess it should be added that after the flares are completed it wouldn't hurt to give the lines a shot with high pressure air to make sure all the little chips etc are out. Keep the ends off the floor as you install them as well just to keep from picking up any dirt etc... Bill
I just did it last weekend. Same Harbor Freight Flaring tool. Mine turned out great. No leaks.... I'm in El Cajon if you wanna give me a call. 619.334.8628
I finally can earn my keep at the HAMB with this one- it's payback time for all the good advice that I have recieved! Here is the answer straight from the son-of-a-plumber himself. Anneal the end of the tube by heating it red hot with a torch and wrapping it with an insulator to let it s l o w l y cool. Apparently the stuff gets work hardenerd a bit when they manufacture it and this makes it a little more flexible. Enjoy brothers! Go try it now and let me know how it works for you. Now don't you all wish you came from the elite class that I do?
Just a couple of details to add to what Hackerbill described. Careful and thorough deburring of the cut end is essential. I also burnish the end with 320-grit W/D paper or crocus cloth. Be precise in setting the height of the tube above the anvil. If it's too high, the start of the flare will move off center once the tube has has filled the recess in the anvil, before the first-step die bottoms out on the anvil. Make certain the "horsehoe" is perpendicular to the anvil -- not skewed one way or the other -- as you tighten the screw and form eacb stage of the flare. I use, and recommend a couple of drops of brake assembly lube on the point of the flaring tool for the final stage. It seems to help create a smooth, uniform surface in the flare. As others have said, a good quality flaring set helps ensure good flares. Years ago I struggled and failed attempting to do a brake system using a "bargain" flaring set. I resorted to using over-the-counter ready-made lines from a local NAPA store, and although the system worked, I hated the resulting agricultural look of the results. Then, I had the opportunity to plumb a brake system with a qood flaring set, and after some practice was able to produce correct flares, consistently. That was a few years ago, and now I plumb four or five systems a year and look forward to doing each one, solving the problems for each individual hot rod. If you enoy learning and acquiring skills and plan on staying with this hobby, step up and spend a few more bucks on a good flaring set. Then apply the good guidance that folks have given you here, and practice. Get to know your flaring set until you're the best hot-rod brake plumber in San Diego!
AS was said, get a good flaring tool. Never mind those cheapy two bar tools - get a KD2190 flaring tool. Its pretty much goof proof. I have the KD tool and NEVER had a bad double flare or leak. And I'm just an amateur mechanic. I've left off the fitting on occasion-its really pi****ses me off
Hey I've found a pretty good flaring tool on the cheap from JCWhitney. It is a lot better than the old two-bar style and the price is fair. You have to buy the double flare adaptors but I've had good luck with it so far. If the link works this is it http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=873&catalogId=10101&langId=-1&storeId=10101 Bill
NO TEFLON TAPE!!!! Had to say it even though it has been said before I also use a Wood countersink bit in my cordless drill to debur the inside of the tube.
Lotta good advice here. The primary one being to get yourself a good tool. What I think may help you is to get one of the Bundy brand commercial brake lines and study the factory flare on it. With a good tool and a little care in the setup you can do an equally good one. If you have to join two lines for a long run, do not use brass fittings. Buy plated steel ones. They're available at NAPA stores and you can find them on some vehicles at the junkyard. I plumbed my 32 with Bundy brake lines, cutting and flaring where necessary and it looks just fine. In fact, you have to be under the car to see the brake lines cuz they're either inside the frame - for the front lines - or on the boxing plate on the inside. Use lots of clamps to tie the lines to the frame or crossmember. Depending on the car you're building, you may want to plumb it so you can use two rubber lines from the frame to the rear brakes. That will save having a hard line on top of the rear axle. A little better look for the thin fendered coupes and roadsters where the rear axle is within easy view. Pay attention to where you run the rubber lines so you don't smash them with 4-bars, ladder bars, wishbones or whatever when the rear suspension bottoms out.
Thanks for all the advice guys. I think my problem lies with my Cheapo Tool and the fact that I didn't debur the cuts when I made them. Well I'm gonna give it another go with your guys' advice and HOPEFULLY it will work this time. If not I'm gonna have to call someone to help.
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