Technical Front Suspension problem

I did find that locknut on my tie rod was loose, after I was pretty sure I had tightened it. That is very interesting! I will give that a try as well. No test drives now for a while as Winter has arrived here for the next week or so...

 

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/front-suspension-problem.1172719/add-reply

Johnny: I welcome all views on this subject, to often it turns into a yelling match. we have
had good dialog here. all views welcome.
I used a tool shaped like a dropped axle with points on the ends. it was spring loaded with
a center gauge marked in 1/16". we chalk marked the inside of the tire front, and back near
the outside of tire. we than attached gauge from tire to tire the spring holding in place.
As you rolled the car the gauge would expand or contract as it moved thru toe in or toe out
range giving a reading on center link. The dropped portion of the gauge let you clear frame or
wish bones. our maintance shop used it on all work vans after front end work.
Is it perfect, proably not. I agree the toe changes as the wheels turn thru an arc.
It was the best I had to work with. keep the views coming guy's.

 

You guys are just spinning your wheels without pictures.

 

Rich B......you described a great tool since it takes wheel/tire runout out of the equation since you're leaving the measuring device in one place on the tires and rolling the car/truck forward to measure toe-in or toe-out. I've used a device like you described and thought of building one, but I'd use it so seldom I've never been able to justify the time it might take to build one.

Lynn

 

One thing folks sometime miss when setting toe in or out is that they select something on the tire to measure. Most tires have some degree of “ run out” making measurements of 1/16 of an inch a challenge. A better way is to get the tire spinning and hold a sharpe object against the center of the tire, leaving a mark all the way around the tire. This will also sometimes show how much run out the tire has. There is a little tool made for this that is spring loaded. But it can be accomplished with a block of wood and a pocket knife. Try it. Just my experiences.






Bones

 

I measure against the rim, I use two long steel poles and measure the difference off each front wheel against each rear wheel.. That way I can measure against the center line of the car.. With todays wide tires you need to measure toe like this..

 

The guys down at the “old time” front end shop use that little spring loaded marker after getting the wheel/ tire spinning with the “ on car” wheel balancer motor. They then have this almost home made looking bar with adjustable pointer that they line up about the centers of the tire, top to bottom. They set it to the back of the tire exactly on the marks. Then they move it to the front and see where the toe in is and adjust. They do a perfect job, that could easily be done in a home shop, with a little fabrication.
If you measure against steel rims, you still have to deal with run out. It’s amazing how much run out they have. Just watch a steel rim , only , on a wheel balancer. Aluminum wheels, cut on a lathe, not so much.










Bones

 

Old guy I used a few times to align my semi trucks used a piece of chalk to get a white mark around the center of the tire, then he used a regular lead pencil to put a line on the white. Might not have been chalk, but whatever it was it was a stick like chalk.

 

My experience with dropped axles and death wobbles are this. Henry had it right as shipped, but the minute we split the wishbones to put our big motors and trans in we loose the track locator.

That means we need a pan-hard bar to locate the axle, especially with a buggy spring. It's not a band-aid, it's just a different engineering situation.

The good thing is the I-beam axle turns into a torsion anti-sway bar. Then we switch to cross steering and we need a steering damper. Another engineering change.

Other issues are wider and shorter rims, and disc brakes. All of which affect the scrub radius in the negative, by moving the scrub radius away from the king pin intersection and the tire patch area. But that is what we do to make Hot Rods.

After all that frustration, we finally switch to the OT MII front ends to fix all the ills of the infamous dropped axle that worked so well from the factory, and will get you throwed off the HAMB if you say anything, so we don't...

Oh, I totally forgot that somewhere along the way we may have switched to radial tires, which do not like much tow-in at all.

Hope you enjoyed my journey...

 

We need to remember the tow in or out numbers are trying for zero number going down the road. If parts are good a straight axle should require very little toe there are only 2 tie rod ends in the system most cars have 4. That leaves us with a very long tierod is it strong enough that it does not flex?