The mor-dor and the roadster have been on the road a number of years....and in all this time i have never had a panard bar nor driven a car with one.....so I don't have any preconceived knowledge on the subject. The mor-dor has a 4 inch dropped axle,16 " Kelseys and tall skinny ass tires....700 x 16 and 600 x 16 . The roadster has a 4 inch drop also,,wheel's 15 inch 8's and 6's with big and little radials. I know the addition of the panard bars would make a difference in handling. I'd like to know if you are running one?,,,,and why you decided to use or add one?......HRP
A panhard bar makes the steering more precise. The whole axle can move from side to side when steering and that changes the angle of the wheels. Makes turning a little funny in that the car will move relative to the axle and you have to compensate for this in the turn and coming out of the turn. I prefer using a dead perch in that it is less stuff under the car and it simpler.
My picture was a little smass. I'll try again. I have engineering drawings for this if anyone wants them.
If your running a side steer setup,you might not notice too much difference, especially with the tall sidewalls. I suspect the difference is more noticable with cross steering,the axle moving side to side relative to the chassis would cause the wheels to turn slightly without driver input.
right now all my cars and the cars i build have stock style steering with f-1 boxes, you dont need it ...i drove one car with cross-steer and no pan-hard it was scary and unpredictable, i heard one company say "if its set up right you don't need it on cross steer" either...i think its BS anything with cross-steer and a transverse spring should have a panhard- my opinion for what its worth... im sorry i just noticed the pic of the dead perch..never had experience with one but is supposed to eliminate the need for panhard, dont see why that wouldnt work either, i like the idea of a panhard and two shacles a little better though
The mor door probably has the side steering set up and won't need it. If the roadster has a Vega cross steer, the panhard bar or dead perch will prevent any side to side axle movement caused by the drag link pushing and pulling on the right side spindle.
[ QUOTE ] A panhard bar makes the steering more precise. Makes turning a little funny in that the car will move relative to the axle and you have to compensate for this in the turn and coming out of the turn. [/ QUOTE ] On the mor-door,,,,I blamed the tall skin tires for that sudden ...HURRY AND CATCH UP on my coming out of a turn. HRP
[ QUOTE ] The mor door probably has the side steering set up and won't need it. If the roadster has a Vega cross steer, the panhard bar or dead perch will prevent any side to side axle movement caused by the drag link pushing and pulling on the right side spindle. [/ QUOTE ] The mor-door and the roadster both have cross steering.. The mor-door has early mustang and the roadster has vega. HRP
My coupe has a four bar and dropped axle up front. Steering was greatly improved when we installed the panhard bar. Keep in mind that longer is better, and if you can match the length of the steering rod it is probably not a bad thing.
hi hrd ran my coupe without p.rod for 2 years it has drop tube n 4 bar set up with side steer it used to wander in truck rutts on the motorway fitted p.rod 3yrs ago its made the car feel mutch tighter n i can throw it round corners abit more,seems to have stopped it wandering in truck rutts to ,just one question do your rods run split bonesor sutch upfront,or or they still as henry intendid?
I have a 4 bar set-up on both cars,,,,ford truck drums on the mor-dor and disc brakes on the roadster. HRP
I have a panhard bar on the 32........and you have driven it....haven't you ? I know MRS HRP has......... If not...I can fix that........
Funny thing as right this moment I am finishing my front bar. IMO, I think that you need to control the movement of particular pieces. The axle should go up and down (tube axle), not side to side. Point in fact...... I-beams twist, I don't know if you need one there. On an I-beam, I think a dampener would be better.. Dis be my two pennies.............
Yeah,Deuce...mrs. HRP did drive your roadster I didn't.. I turned out the way the two of you planned didn't it... can you spell...CONSPIRANCY! ...thanks Tommy,right now i don't havre a picture but i'll try to take a photo tomorrow...this car has a lotta old style parts ...back when they were new! HRP
[ QUOTE ] Yeah,Deuce...mrs. HRP did drive your roadster I didn't.. [/ QUOTE ] I can chaange that..........come on down and get the keys..........
Don't know what will be shown but this is the drawing. I could mail you the full size version if interested. I made the one from 1"plate and 1" bar
cool rod hrp could do with that rod for the family{thats why im buildin the A}only asked the question cause im not to sure but i think unsplit bones dont need one{proberbly talkin bs.} do you run 4 bar out back,i do on my b ,front+back got p.rod on both,and as the actress said to the bishop length is every thing regards keith
Andy, Could you explain this whole "dead perch" thing a little bit more? This is a new one to me, so a little 'splainin would help clear things up. Thanks, Ed
A dead perch was what was used on all the old solid axle race cars. If you go to the sprint car museum at Knoxville or the Inde. museum, you will see dead perches everywhere.No panhard bars.It works by using half of the spring as a panhard bar. The shackle on the drivers side is removed and a fixed mount for the end of the spring is substituted. Because of the stiffness and the strength of the spring this works extreamly well. The panhard bar design takes up room and can interfear with the drag link.I don't like to see the extra stuff either. I think the dead perch is a cleaner looking design. I've got all my friends using them and every one likes them.
I run one. It makes a noticable differance if you have cross stearing. Spring width will make some difference too. The more upright your shackles are at ride height the axel will have a tendensy to "swing" on the perches. Thats what the "Deadperch" was designed for, to take the back and forth movement out. But If the spring is shorter and the shackles are pointing more inboard it won't move back and forth nearly as much. I saw this setup recently on a pro built chassis and was told it works surprizingly well. I had a old hotrod a years ago and it didn't have one and it had cross stearing using a 40 ford box, and I could tell it would move back and forth by the stearing not always being in the same position when going straight.
A dead perch is a much cleaner look and worked well in race cars but dont forget about the up and down force put on the tire in cornering from a dead perch or panhard . A panhard ran level will put only side force to the tires in a turn, no up or down loading and = in left or right turn. Runing a panhard higher on one side will load or unload the tires opeset depending on wich whay you turn. Thats why you here them talk obout adjusting track bar in Nascar. A dead perch is like a short panhard mounted much higher one frame then axel so handels diffrent in left and right turns. A dead perch also is not good for bump steer on cross steer because of the dif.in lengh and angal to the steering rod. On a cross steer car if you run a panhard AND stearing rod the same lengh and level you will have the best and = handeling in left and right turns. On a side steer car a panhard is not as importent put works best with a long and level panhard and for the least bump steer the steering rod and wish bone should be the same lengh and paralel.On a side steer the main reason for going to a long panhard verses short in to minimize the side to side movement as the car goes over bumps Sorry about the bad spelling Im not to good at this but hope this helps
I dont want it to sound like I am totaly agenst a dead pearch because Im not. Right now I am building a 30 roadster as a late 40s dirt track roadster. I will drive it mostly on the street but will run it on dirt track 3 or 4 times a year. On this car I will run a dead pearch because it will work good on the track. A D.P. works good on a roundy rounder because when you throw it in the corner most of the weight goes to the right frount. With a D.P all the right side of the spring still works because its the side with the shackle. The left side is anouther story. with no shackle it has a tendensey to just bind up lift the tire.No big deal in a hard left turn but if you got to make a hard right you got your hands full with the left side of the spring binding. This is no big deal just runing around on the street but in a panic trying to keep out of a wreck it could be.
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