FE FORDS, why dont more use them?

Yeah, but it takes a 4.23 bore 427 block at .030 to make the 454 (447 at std bore) setup with a 3.98 crank, which is what he asked about- not 4.13. 4.13 bore just makes you a 428. Go back and read it again, George, you'll get it. Personally, I would always run a 416 with the thicker, stiffer cylinder walls than bore it to 4.13 just so I could say it was a 428, unless the block had already been .030, .040 and .060 and I wanted to save it- if you think you can tell the difference in the seat of your pants between an otherwise equal 416 and 428, I'd say you got ahold of some "good schidt"- a 416 can be a very sweet street engine

 

I no FE expert,I don't even like Fords But...in the late 70's I worked for school bus repair garage for 5 years. At the time they had 60 large buses with 361 FT engines.60 is a good example I think.I can't remember any problems with exhaust flanges. The only common problem was sucking in intake gaskets...fucking heavy intake as mentioned along with having to remove pushrods...Maybe truck heads are different?
Overall the FT was reliable and in school bus or city delivery truck use it lasted about 90,000 miles between overhauls.Stop and go is hard on engines.

 

Almost new stuff? No, not even close, well I guess they were new when Dad started building them in 1961 but he hasn't stopped working on them since then.

Sorry, you're on an island with this, it's not a common problem but think what you want.

 

As far as the exhaust tabs go, I've only had two FE's. a 352 that was original with my 62 Merc and a 66 410 that was original in a Parklane that I had. When I swaped motors, the 352 had no issues with the exhaust at all. The 410 on the other hand was a nightmare! One bolt snapped off in the head and the one next to it snapped the ear. The 410 had a bunch of exhaust leaks at the head BEFORE I did the swap. The 352 had none. Maybe that had something to do with the issues. Just my $0.02

 

When I had my exhaust shop I would not touch the exhaust manifold bolts without a torch to heat the head cherry red and then hit them with a 6 point socket. Unlike a speed shop, I rarely saw any that been touched in less than 40 years. Yes you have to be careful or you will have a problem. Once they have been replaced or broken apart then you are good to go.

 

Yes, I know, but wanted to mention the thick 390 blocks. Why go out to 4.13? This is a pretty good reason...
http://www.probeindustries.com/Ford_390_428FE_SRS_Pistons_s/10220.htm

 

It is easy to sit behind a computer and talk smack, but I have been running FE's since 1979....34 years....so I do know a thing or two about the strengths and weaknesses of the mighty FE.

The bolt rusted in the hole is the problem, not the tab the hole is in.
The reason they rust is because water can get into the threaded hole...becuase it is not a blind hole.

 

I'm hardly on an island. See the above two other posters who mention issues.

As for running FE's since 1979...by 1979 I had already owned, fixed, and sold at least 4 of them. So you're still coming up short if we're going to compare the size of our dicks.

Like I said, they don't all do it but it happens enough that it can be called weak spot. The heads are know for exhaust problems, whether it is due to broken bolts, warpage, cracked off tabs, or whatever.

There's even a guy on Ebay selling a set of heads with all the exhaust bolts broken off.

Just for kicks I Googled Ford FE exhaust leak and there were so many people on so many forums asking what to do about their leaky exhaust I gave up even trying to reference them all.

Some were even ...you guessed it....on the HAMB:


http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=461173

 

The leaks are not caused by broken ears, they are generally caused by using mis-matched header flanges/gaskets. The FE came with several different exhaust port configurations. If you are the type of ham-fisted buffoon that corrects poor part fitment with a 1/2" drive breaker bar, then you may succeed in breaking the ears off your FE, but personally, I wouldn't go around bragging about that.

 

Most all of the leaks being discussed are using stock manifolds. Don't take my word for it - go do a search.

Another engine that has lots of exhaust problems is the Jeep straight 6....mostly cracked manifolds rather than the head itself.

 

Ok I'm going to jump in the middle of this one, a couple of years ago I bought a so called 390 motor brought it home tore it down to find it was a +.020 bore in a 66 410 block and I ASSume a 390 crank, for sure not a 428 crank, the piston is at least .060 in the hole..that is a guess, what were the differences in compression distance on the these different motors 390-410 if any, I thought it was just due to a cast replacement piston??? I'd like to use the pistons because of very little wear but looking at the distance of piston in the hole it had to run like shit. What do you FE experts suggest short of a $2000 stroker kit?
Thanks

 

Maybe o/t but we have been running a FE in a 1971 F250 4x4 since the day it was bought new. We have set a 390 in place of the 360. Only complaint I have is the short bypass hose behind the water pump. It has served us well.

 

Strange,my daily drivers for the last 25 years have been about 5 bought used Jeep Cherokees.For of them straight 6's.not a cracked manifold in the bunch.Our daughter also drive one,no cracks in the stock tube header.
Yes,I have heard about the cracked exhaust manifolds,never had one myself.Just like the FE broken exhaust ears,some see em some don't.

 

Kinda think it just depends on who's turning the wrenches. Some guys should just stick to sbc's and stay away from Fords and Mopars.

 

What you probably have is a later 390-4V pickup engine- Ford used the 410 piston with the 3.78 crank to lower the compression, with the piston being way down in the hole as you describe- the original pistons say "410" on them. Many folks have seen that and thought they had a 410- the 360's were similar, a 390 car piston with the 3.5 crank, piston ends up down in the hole

 

You're really hung up on the idea of wrench turning. But you gotta get the picture - these are 100% stock vehicles that no one ever turned a wrench on ....unless of course it was to try to fix the exhaust leaks.


As for the Jeep, just google 'Jeep exhaust crack' and hundreds of posts will pop up. Here's one lifted from the first post from a Jeep forum:

"Everyone has heard about it: the dreaded exhaust manifold crack that plagues the Jeep 4.0 engine. It is not a matter of if it will happen, but rather when it will happen. Well, my '91 XJ developed a crack about a month after I bought it back in October of 09."

They crack like crazy. Just like 90's vintage Mitusbishi's were oil burners due to bad ring seal. Or maybe it was all those 19 YO girls turning wrenches wrong in their Eclipses....

 

Id love to build a trick big inch FE for my Comet … I just don’t have Hemi money

 

I`m a new guy here, ...BUT, I have been racing FEs since the mid 70`s, so I have a bit of insite on them. First off, yes it is common for the upper exhaust manifold bolts to rust up in the heads, and snap off IF you don`t heat the ears up first. My tow vehicle is a 1974 F350 DRW car hauler/ramp truck, that I bought in early 1988. I replaced the tired 360 with a 1976 390 4 barrel engine from a F250. These engines use the "410" pistons, which give over .100" deck clearance, and thus, low compression. Anyhow, I ball honed the cylinders, put new rings on the origional cast pistons, plus usual valve job, new bearings, timing set, oil pump etc, with a mild "RV" type cam and stock iron 4 barrel intake. Its been to every state on the west coast, and over 20 years since I did that cheapo rebuild, it still runs great, and normally burns no oil between oil changes. After 14 years, the headers I installed on the fresh engine, were getting rusty, so I replaced them, none of the upper bolts broke, although 1 would have, if I didn`t heat the ear first. I used to work at an engine shop from 1980 to 86, and we did a lot of 360/390 cars and trucks, and quite a few 361/391 FT larger trucks, and I don`t ever recall seeing a broken off exhaust ear on a FE head.
As for FEs being expensive, I disagree. One of my race cars is a 78 Ford Fairmont, that I have been running with FE power since 1988. other than a 390 the first 2 years, it has mainly been running 428s from 1990, until 3 years ago. Since then I have been running a .030" over 427 with a 428 crank. All the FEs Ive ran in the car have been TRW or Speed Pro pistons, a flat tappet solid lifter cam, stock cast iron 428 CJ heads, with factory 2.09"-1.66" valves, stock iron cranks, and a factory Ford aluminum "Sidewinder" intake with an old Holley 780 vacuum sec. carb. I used to run a C6 automatic, but about 12 years ago I switched it over to a 4 speed Jerico. With the 428, it ran low 10s in the 1/4, and the 454 didn`t really run much faster, although it has gone a couple of 9.9`s late last year.The 428s had about $3500. apiece in them, although the 427 is a bit higher, probably closer to $5500. for that one, aftermarket rods and such. The 428s would generally go about 5 years between freshen ups, the current 454 has been in for 3 years. I keep the RPM s down, and it treats me well.To build a 427 cube 351W stroker, would cost at least that much, and you would have almost all aftermarket Chinese parts in it.And unless all the 429-460 guys around here are dumber than me, I haven`t seen any non stroker, iron head 460s that run any better than my 428s did. (lots of slower 460s though!)I`m lucky that I bought most of my FE stuff years ago, before the collectors drove the prices up on the bigger stuff, but 390s are still pretty cheap and plentiful.

 

Thanks Gene and Rory for thr 410 piston heads up...I love this place!

 

As for running FE's since 1979...by 1979 I had already owned, fixed, and sold at least 4 of them. So you're still coming up short if we're going to compare the size of our dicks.

/QUOTE]

I was not aware that we were going to do that as part of the discussion.....

 

Rory knows a little about FE's trust me on this.

 

x2...

 

I used them until I sold my wagon last year that had a 390,if I dont go with a Y block in my 55 convertible I was thinking about a FE dressed up as a 58 to 61 motor.

 

Fitted with Jardine Headers, They produced music like no other! They actually criss crossed under the oil pan!

 

Me'n my dad are big time y block guys, but he had a '58 goldflash with a 332 in it just a baby FE but he always said "man that was a sweet motor, so smooth and plenty of torque" it was a quick upgrade too for a custom 300 or mid 50s fairlane as the early 332, 352 FE bolts right up to the y block mounts.

 

Wow- four whole FE's before '79? Gee whiz golly...Guess Rory, Jody and I have "innies"... I did a count the other day, got 24 right now, including 9 427's, 3 CJ's and an SCJ, and a couple regular 428's- the others are plain-jane, probably the kind you had...

 

Yup, motor mounts bolt up the same to the motor, but, make sure you have the right one for the right car! FE cars bolt to the pedistals different than the Y-blocks cars. I found out the hard way! Haha!

 

Yea, but you guys are gluttons for punishment. I had enough common sense to stop at two.

 

A little off the HAMB doctrine, but the 360 in my '70 short bed is unreal for pulling power! The low end lugging is just about as good as a 460! I will probably put this baby back in service when I get my car trailer built. The next challenge; getting some mileage. I managed to get around 15 when I last drove it, but I think it can be improved! But a little more on track, I owned a 428SCJ, it had been put into a '64 Galaxie with a 4 gear, ran goooood!!

 

Glad to see people use these motors! My family has a 390 cube in a slightly O/T '67 F250 4x4...even with brand new traction tires, this thing runs out of traction LONG before it runs out of power. I have yet to see something this truck couldn't pull!
It is heavy though, and I will warn that these need a valve job about every 70k-80k miles, but other than that, they are as reliable as the day is long!
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Jake
Shotgun Rod & Kustoms