Folks Of Interest Fabricators: How Did You Learn Your Trade?

Bought some DVDs, books, and new equipment today. Reenrolling in tech school to finish the last couple hours I need for my machine tool certificate. Have a nice day. I've gotta learn rather than talk anymore. Thanks.

 

Waste of time, as they don't form panels from flat metal.

You have the internet, you have a device to see the internet & videos, and can communicate with others. There are some metalworking seminars held randomly around the globe, which are highly recommended by people that have gone.

Hands on, trial and error, is what helps to at least get started with finding out that flat metal "wants to stay flat!" lol. It's good to try some minor shaping, before attending a seminar.

Tools: I have minimal, but I don't shape an entire car body. Buy decent tools rather than a beginner flux core welder. That will mess you up in a bad way.

I still have my small bodywork Smiths torch set I bought in 1971. I still have my "dreamdate" Miller 35S wire welder I bought "used" in the later 70s.

I have favorite hammers and dollys, too.

Don't know if a true story, but I read where the engineering students going to work for Mercedes, have to go to a workshop and are handed a piece of steel, and a file, and a vice to work at, to learn about steel. Only then, do they go on to engineering department studies.

 

I am no expert, and a complete hack in my garage, but based on what you wrote, I'd take welding classes first, and build on that. Good luck.

 

second the welding classes. and find a place to work where you are allowed to learn how to do stuff. I don't know where that place may be, but I'd bet it's a small independent shop. Might be impossible to find such a place, but it's worth the time and effort to look.

I know it's really tough to save up enough to get your own place to work, and buy tools and equipment, when you don't have much money coming in.

 

Forming metal takes YEARS of practice. The TV show mentality seems to make everyone that has ever seen an English wheel an expert panel beater. Not so. Watch videos, read books, get tools, practice like a mofo, then go back and watch and read more to understand WHY the metal did what it did instead of what you wanted. Plan on making lots of good metal into scrap.

Take some welding classes at your local college. See if any shops will let you apprentice. I have never met anyone that came out of those trade schools with much more than empty wallets. Most of the guys you see doing this for a living just learned through life, not wrote a check and were handed the skills.

 

get a GED , and learn math and how to read measuring devices like tape measures , calipers and micrometers.....you will not be able to do any serious fabrication without that knowledge

 

i offer metal shaping classes in my shop. i am also in ohio. there is a lot of math involved, and attention to detail. a lot of metal shaping work is very time consuming and tedious.

 

Hmm, where to begin? I learned how to weld in high school. I went to college for three years but I ran out of interest about same time I ran out of money. Time to get a job! I soon realized that welding was one thing I could do that actually paid half decent.
I went to work at the local street sweeper maker, first as an assembler and them as a welder. I worked that job for about 3 years. I had always been interested in cars so when Jack Roush enterprises was hiring fabricators I applied. They hired me to build mule cars for GM and I worked that for a couple years until I got laid-off. I then went to work for AM General as a fabricator building prototype truck cabs. That was 1994 and it was the last fab job I had. It was mostly on the job training for me. I do CAD work now and yes my fab skills are not what they were 20 years ago.
As others have said, take some welding classes first. Take a job and get some experience. Read everything you can on the subject and practice. If you have considered relocating I would recommend a job at Roush as a way to get some experience. They pretty much hire anybody who can TIG weld and actually wants the job, they have a high turn-over rate. Not a great place to work (unless you are part of the race team) but they do get some interesting work from the OEM's here in Detroit, and it is a great place to learn.
Also I suggest looking at the class curriculum at Washtenaw Community College here in Michigan. They have excellent automotive and welding programs. Tuition is cheap being a community college.
Finally, everybody is hiring like crazy here in greater Detroit right now. For example, the company I work for is building another plant with two more lines and plans to hire another 135 UAW employees.
I am sure if you were serious about learning and willing to make the sacrifices you could make it work.

 

I second the GED and learning math. Try to learn math at your local Vo-Tech. And welding. Ask a lot of questions, the instructors I had loved people who actually wanted to learn.

 

THIS ^^^^ Is the best advice you can heed. Don't so this and you won't have a chance in the real world. Seriously.

 

GED is a basic must have, maybe check the military army-navy to see what they have to offer, great hands on training plus school benefits after you get out

 

If you can get to one of Mikes classes you'll be happy.

Fabrication requires being able to take your mind from 2 dimensional to 3 dimensional thinking and back as easily as breathing. There are aptitude tests for this, probably free ones on line. That will be great for any part that has form ( different from shape). Knowing how to weld is a critical skill set to this trade, however mastering the welding skills isn't necessary. There are millions of great welders who have no idea how to build anything or what to do with a blueprint, you form it and tack it and those guys will be happy to weld it. Reading and understanding drafting is crucial, being a good draftsman is not. Plenty of draftsman (& engineers) can't fabricate, some can and their paperwork is far superior.

Making patterns and thinking in the "negative" is vital. Some minds are incapable, some are trainable, some are natural, I think the trainable ones are naturals but they just haven't done it yet. Measuring accurately becomes more and more important when parts get smaller or the parts are going to be asked to move. With Small parts that move and their is no room for error. This is usually the skill set of the machinist, you need to be able to draw him (draftsman skills) a good enough napkin sketch of what you want that follows universal drafting language.

Metal shaping is a different skill set all together. Forming metal is either cutting or bending where shaping adds the dimensions or directions or operations of shrinking and stretching to cutting and bending. You can't learn ( I said you but maybe it's just me) shaping by watching, or reading alone. That is a skill that needs to be learned by applying what you've seen or read to steel. Having an experienced person guide over your shoulder is invaluable to mastering the very basics and without those basics you'll not get far.

 

I did an apprenticeship so learned most of the skills to a basic level, but at my last job and current job now if I have nothing to do I'll just take some scrap metal and start making something out of it, best way to learn is by doing something, getting it wrong a million and one times and learning from those errors. Plus it's a good feeling when you've turned a piece of scrap into something useful

 

^^^^^^yup...the military actually does more than kill people and blow things, which is quite fun...the blowing stuff up part anyway......dodging hot lead not so much.

You'll get training, 3-hots and a cot, and a paycheck. Not bad. Who knows, you might even like it.

.

 

Henry Ford once said, "You can think you can or think you can't and in both cases, you'd be correct".

First of all, keep in mind you have to pay your dues, either in time, money or both. Not everybody can or should go to college. If you don't go on with school, find a job, be the very best at that job and learn all you can. If that job doesn't interest you or you learn of a better opportunity, move on to something else and approach that job the same way. There's a lot of people that will work hard, but to stand out in the crowd, you should try and work smart and be a real asset to the people that pay you. Hopefully they'll recognize your talent / leadership and ask you to take a promotion.
That's how it works, at least it did for me, but just remember, most "overnight successes", usually spend years to get there.

 

Learning to bend metal to shape is not going to satisfy your desire. You really do need the core fundamentals. You've skipped that in school.
Unless your serious about this you will not ever be happy with your direction. Even good fabricators are going out of business.
I really think a military choice would change your direction in life. Consider it.

Been in the business and manufacturing field for 45yrs.
Some people you never forget during your work life.
I had one tell me to always make myself indispensable.
That credo taught me humility and many talents.

 

...

 

I like the can do attitude your showing on your last post.
With that you will be happy.

I've always told my kids....
You've come from a long line of blood that has never given up.
Set your goal, swallow your pride and tilt your head down until that nose is buried in your path.
Never ever raise it.

I am proud to say ever one of them is a hard working fool.

 

Lot of good advice here. Definitely get the GED as that is almost the minimum to get in the door.

If math is a challenge then perhaps find a good math teacher or tutor that can help you. We all have our strengths & weaknesses that we have to overcome & adapt to. I have a friend that is a skilled tradesman & welder that sees the work & gets what it takes to get the work done. He does good work and works hard. It was his persistence that got him through the math classes & tougher courses. Math is not his strong suit and he has to work at it a bit but his skills easily offset that & does not limit him. He just has to stop and give it a little more thought.

Learn what is required to become a skilled welder. Some colleges have good welding programs and night school as well. I worked in industry where the welding was stick, tig and occasional MIG. Bread & butter welding was stick or tig root with stick fill & cap for code work. MIG was not in the weld procedures and used for secondary welding or the rapid build up of wear surfaces.If one is competent in stick & TIG then it probably is not that big a transition to MIG

A close friend was laid off in his late fifties and wanted a job that paid as well as the good job he lost. He took a full time 3 month community college welding class which was enough to give him the skill for an entry job with a steel fabrication shop where they guided him to grow his skills. It kept him busy until he retired. He wished he could have gone for the regular one year college welding course to be more well rounded. Good welders can get work & it could always be the fall back trade that steadies ones life while chasing their passion. It could also provide enough income to be able to take metal shaping classes to get you on the way to building skills, have a resume and a portfolio of quality work to get in the doors where you want to be.

As one who has hired skilled people it is good to have a resume with work period lengths that shows an ability to stick to a job. The prospective employee should not be a flight risk so the prospective employer is not afraid to invest time in that new employee. The person needs to show the prospective employer that they are stable, have even temperament and ability to work with others. To be fair, sometimes a good person will get a few rough breaks and may have gone through a few jobs in quick succession. Good references will go along way if this has occurred in one's life. Good references that accompany a resume will help get a person to the interview stage.

A couple of good metal shaping classes will let you know if you have the eye and the ability to eventually become a competent metal worker. If the classes & work are not doing it for you then you are not heavily invested in that direction. There are some amazing metal shapers on the HAMB that offer classes & one should be with in reasonable distance for you.

An employee that has an average education, is reliable, self motivated, good level head w/o a temper, opened minded, & naturally skilled in his trade is one to employ and grow. Once you get into a shop & classes then network with others and as people move around they will remember you when their employer is looking for good people. I worked post retirement with a large contractor with several supervisors and whenever we needed new people they tendered names of good men. In 3 years we name hired most of the new hires based on internal recommendations, following up references and then interviews to create a very strong team. Those that were recommended by peers are usually a safe bet as no one is going to offer up a person that will embarrass them or be a cancer in their work place. A couple turned out to be bad apples and were released but not bad for about 80 in the core group. It speaks to the power of networking and growing ones reputation.

 

If I could go back to my 19 year old self and give me one piece of advice it would be this:

"Choose one thing that you want to do. Get any entry level job in that field, even if you are getting people coffee and sweeping. Try as hard as you can to learn everything you can, work as hard as you possibly can, always be honest, never complain. If you just stick to that career and give 100% of your effort you will succeed and be happy. If you start jumping around from one thing to another your life will be a constant struggle, one step forward two steps back. You will have a hard time even buying groceries for your family."

Then my nineteen year old self would probably look at me and say:

"Get out of my way you bald headed fuck, your breath smells and you have hair growing out of your nose and ears. I have a date with a hot punk-rock chick, and now that I've listened to you blather on I'm going to be late...."

 

....

 

Don't know if a true story, but I read where the engineering students going to work for Mercedes, have to go to a workshop and are handed a piece of steel, and a file, and a vice to work at, to learn about steel. Only then, do they go on to engineering department studies.[/QUOTE]

It wouldn't surprise me. I used to have a neighbor from Germany who was a retired Mechanical Engineer, and he said he had to work in the trades before he could move on to the engineering program.

Check with your local community college or vocational school for metal working programs; there are also some high schools that offer adult ed programs, so if you need some help with math, that's a good place to start.

 

Learning to use an oxyacetylene torch well is something that can only help you.

Sent from my LGLS992 using The H.A.M.B. mobile app

 

Where is that guy?
Lmao everyone is looking for him to hire

 

You dropped out of HS. MAJOR PROBLEM. Yes, you got a GED, but that says to me as an employer (which I am) that you likely have an attitude problem, or you don't have the intellectual horsepower to learn. You might or might not, but the people on the hiring end of the employment process have nothing to judge you by except your history. I employ 12 young(er) guys, half of whom don't have HS diplomas...and for those guys, it shows.

If you want to excel in a technical field, you NEED math skills, analytical skills, critical thinking skills, and a strong measure of common sense. Develop those skills. Show that you have them, because now you have nothing to show that you DO have them. You need to show that you won't be a waste of effort for an employer.

Take math classes. Study your ass off. Get a tutor. Show that you can crunch the numbers, do the math work. Then you can have a marketable skill, because not everyone can do that. Couple that with a humble attitude, and you're a desirable hire.

One more tip - if you get a job, DO NOT sit around and bitch about the pay. Learn what you can, stay there to build some history, then move on. The employer doesn't owe you anything other than your hourly wage, and if you bitch about it, you sound like just that.

Good luck. Work hard. Build your skills so that you can prove you have them, and make it happen.

And it won't be easy.

Chris

 

I taught most types of welding for 28 years. You have to get the basics right. Most vo tech schools can do this for not much money. Then it's practice, practice, practice. I use to tell students that I can't teach them to weld, I can only teach them the basics. Only you can teach yourself the hand to eye correlation needed and experience teaches the rest.
There are sites like MetalMeet and All Shops (haven't been on either for awhile) that are great information sites. They also meet from time to time, some within driving of Ky. that affords hands on basics to those willing to learn. There's a collection of knowledge at these meets you can't find in a tech school.
As others have said, get an entry level job and keep your ears open and mouth closed and it will come.

 

It sounds like you have finally realized that the free education was something you should have taken advantage of and then you decided tech school wasn't working and you quit tech school also.

You need to get your GED and then go back to tech school and learn welding.

I applaud you for asking questions here,there are some amazingly talented people but what they know wasn't given to them,they worked for what they wanted.

Good luck. HRP

 

Check out the websites of the various branches of the military because they have hundreds of different occupations that they'll teach you. Of course the first couple of months will suck in basic training/boot camp but after that the training begins. I was in a long time ago but you got 30 days paid vacation every year and the pay now is a lot better now then it was then. (My first month in the Army in 1971 I took home $97.) If you want additional training after you get out they'll help pay for that too. Have you heard of Knight School of Welding in Louisville? They've been around for a while. You can also take the GED while you're in the military if you don't want to now. I don't think a high school diploma is required anymore. Good luck....

PS...............What part of Kentucky are you in?

 

You didn't mention your age, but it's a good thing you finally woke up.
Get you GED, join the military and learn a technical skill that is transferable to the civilian world and will eventually pay you GOOD money, not just enough to live on. Don't rely on metal fabrication as the pay is low and it takes years to learn enough to demand big bucks.
As you become older and remain unemployable, there does reach a time when it's too late and your too old to catch up.
Make your move now.

 

The OP did get his GED, and did enlist in the military but was sent home due to a hearing injury. (In his second or third post I think). Too bad, sometimes it helps some people to focus when they are young.